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testimento
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Does anyone have experience on these cheap chinese ozone generators costing less than $20 a piece with ceramic platelets, noted to be producing up to
7 grams of ozone per hour? I'd consider ordering these (or even 10 of them if they work, hell you'd get 2kg of ozone a day with 200 bucks investment)
and stack them up into a tube with line fan. They would produce 14-21 grams of ozone per hour, or continously up to 500 grams of ozone per day only
from 2-3 platelets parallelled?
It is of a high interest because ozone can be used for so several proceseses for oxizising stuff into very interesting compounds, including, but not
limited to, ammonia into ammonium nitrate, so2 into sulfuric acid and styrene to benzaldehyde.
[Edited on 6-10-2013 by testimento]
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jock88
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You will not be going anywhere using stainless steel of any variety as an anode.
The PbO2 from car batteries will not be working either as they will fall apart.
Like so many projects involving electrolysis it usually boils down to the anode and were to get a suitable one cheaply.
MMO won't work either.
Platinum and properly made PbO2 would work or the 'ceramic' (whatever that is) from China.
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testimento
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The car battery PbO2 has been discussed before and I noted using cast-lead anodes coated with in-situ PbO2 being by far the easiest method for
chlorate-perchlorate-cells, although involving a slight lead contamination, which is more than easily filtered out with sand-pack-filter.
This ozone is not about water or PbO2 though, this is for air ozonation.
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Pulverulescent
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| Quote: | | Does anyone have experience on these cheap chinese ozone generators costing less than $20 a piece with ceramic platelets, noted to be producing up to
7 grams of ozone per hour? |
Nope! Nor want to ─ their claims of grams per hour should be taken with excess halide . . .
They'll readily produce NO2 in moist air, too!
But you know, you get what you pay for!
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones"
A Einstein
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jock88
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It's probably been said many times but could you feed pure oxygen through the in-air-ozoneator (elecytric dishcarge) for to avoid the NO2.
It's a pity they don't make N2O for taking with the grams-per-hour figure!!!
[Edited on 7-10-2013 by jock88]
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Fenir
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I once built a very inefficient ozone generator using a whimshurst machine and a test tube in an ice slurry. As expected, the process is tremendusly
inefficient. It , however, did succed at iritating my nose and getting rid of nasal congestion.
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Pyrotrons
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Hi All,
Has anyone here successfully produced high-concentration and relatively pure ozone from dry Oxygen, using a high voltage device, and isolated the
ozone as a liquid?
I don't think I will be in the same room when I do this...however...
I want to flow dry Oxygen (welding-grade) into one neck of a 1 Liter 3-neck (24/40) flask. The middle neck contains an electrode that is connected to
an inverted (upside-down) solid-state tesla coil that can be throttled to absolutely fill the flask with purple corona, but not so powerful as to
punch through the glass. The third neck of the flask would be the exit for O3 which then goes into a graham condenser cooled with Acetone/Dry Ice.
Out drips blue liquid O3?
The electrode could be a simple borosilicate tube with one end sealed, with a wire down the inside of the tube, so that only the glass is in contact
with the O3.
Some kind of borosilicate baffling inside the flask may facilitate better exposure of the O2 to the high voltage, but I believe there may be plenty of
corona discharge to do the job without it, especially if the O2 flow rate is reduced.
I am not a chemist, however, I am good with high voltage and mechanical things. By the sounds of it, I should be able to at least blow the flask and
glassware apart from decomposition of ozone. Seriously, any thoughts on a setup like this would be appreciated. If there is enough interest I may
try it, this would actually be pretty easy for me to do.
"Thus ethyl alcohol is inferior to xylene, although usable for certain applications." - Gerald Hurst
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watson.fawkes
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Quote: Originally posted by Pyrotrons  | | The third neck of the flask would be the exit for O3 which then goes into a graham condenser cooled with Acetone/Dry Ice. |
Before you continue, it would behoove you to look up and write down the boiling point of ozone and the sublimation point of CO2.
Hint: the wrong one is larger.
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Pyrotrons
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My apologies, I was going off of something in my memory which was obviously incorrect.
So the cooling would have to be fairly exotic. At first glance, and though I have no experience with this, it seems to me that flowing R-12
refrigerant through the condenser may work. The temperature of the R-12 could be maintained at 130K or so, with the addition of liquid N2 through a
heat exchanger. 130K is 15K above the M.P. of R-12, yet 31K below the B.P. of O3. I've not checked the viscosity of R-12 at that temperature. Other
coolants that I can think of are Butane (M.P. 135K) and Propyl Alcohol (M.P. 146K).
watson.fawkes, care to add anything else?
*****************************
Edit: Added the following:
Thinking about this a second time, I think a better arrangement may be to have the O3 flow out of the flask, and through glass tubing that is in
direct contact with a metal block, that is cooled to 100-140K with a slow liquid N2 drip. This keeps the entire system open-loop, and avoids initial
dealings with pressure as the aforementioned R-12 (or other coolant) initially meets room-temp glass.
[Edited on 23-11-2013 by Pyrotrons]
"Thus ethyl alcohol is inferior to xylene, although usable for certain applications." - Gerald Hurst
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watson.fawkes
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Sure. First and foremost, you should scope out just how much you
want to accomplish this and what you want as a result in addition to a bit of liquid ozone. This is not a simple project by any means. Start with
picking a target volume of product, say 10 ml liquid ozone.
Second, if you haven't read the link in the original post of this thread, I'd recommend it. There's lots of material in there, and if you're as
serious as you sound about, you'll do yourself well to actually design the apparatus rather than tossing together the first parts you think about.
One thing to remember is that condensed liquid takes up a whole lot less space that the same molar quantity of gas. Given a final volume, pick some
conversion efficiency to estimate with and compute the total O2 volume flow you'll need to deal with. It's probably more than you expect. Off the top
of my head, I'd guess that you'll need some kind of active pumping to get a reasonable product volume.
I'd recommend building the O3 generator and the liquifier separately, tested and worked out separately, and combined only after they're working.
Liquify some other gas for testing would be called for, something you can buy in a bottle. I'd start with propane, simply because it's cheap and easy
to get. That's only a first stage test gas, though, you'll need another, perhaps some refrigerant gas. Just learning how to purge the system of water
and other undesirable condensates will be needed.
For refrigeration, the best online material I've seen is the crowd doing extreme CPU overclocking. There's some really good amateur work on some of
these systems. Also, learn what an "autocascade" is; you may want to use one to get temperatures low enough. Generally, you are working at a
temperature where you'll need to really know how to build the condenser. You'll also need refrigeration for the receiving flask. And you'll need to
know what your contingency is for refrigeration failure. Boiling ozone is not a hazard to be trifled with.
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Zyklon-A
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| Quote: Originally posted by Pulverulescent | | Quote: | | Does anyone have experience on these cheap chinese ozone generators costing less than $20 a piece with ceramic platelets, noted to be producing up to
7 grams of ozone per hour? |
Nope! Nor want to ─ their claims of grams per hour should be taken with excess halide . . .
They'll readily produce NO2 in moist air, too!
But you know, you get what you pay for! |
I agree, with a little over $20 it seems, you can make one, that is much more efective than the $20 one from china.
[Edited on 1-12-2013 by Zyklonb]
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Oxirane
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This is most interesting text about ozone electrolysis. Still have to read it through tomorrow.
http://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs-wm/40143.pdf
Has anyone ever electrolyzed O3?
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Texium
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Thread Moved
21-11-2023 at 14:18 |
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