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Housane
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Where to start
hi i am a beginner and wonering what chemicals to buy and what experements to do. where to buy chemicals would help as i am in thr UK.
Thanks in advance
Housane
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Ubya
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well it all depends on what kind of experiments you want to do, organic chemistry? inorganic? energetic materials? radiochemistry? i mean there are a
lot of things you can do.
if you are starting really from 0 IMO you should start with easy and basic experiments, like making crystals and different salts from common
chemicals.
where to buy chemicals, from a pharmacy, a grocery store or a hardware store, you can find ammonia, hydrochloric acid, sulphuric acid, sodium
hydroxide, hydrogen peroxide, iodine tincture, acetone. from a garden store you could find sulphur and maybe some source of nitrates. just look at the
labels when you go shopping
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diddi
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swimming pool shops have lots of OTC chems. or if you or on a budget, find a friend with a pool and ask for some small samples of their chems
Beginning construction of periodic table display
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j_sum1
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We haven't had this question for a while. The answer is, it depends.
My advice is to figure out what interests you and start a little project. Get what you need for that project in terms of equipment and chems. Then
build your hobby one project at a time.
One other thing: do not skimp on safety. So start with something that won't extend you unreasonably beyond your skill set and which you can do safely
without blowing the budget on protective gear.
Common start points are:
Copper chemistry
Growing crystals
Element collecting
Plant extractions
Disassembling zinc carbon batteries and purifying contents
Purifying otc items
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Housane
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Ok so i am interested in elements and getting them. i need some H2O2 where could i get this as boots dot have it in uk
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MrHomeScientist
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I second the recommendation to build your lab one experiment at a time. That's how I did mine. I browsed around the internet (a lot on this site) and
found things that sounded interesting to try, then bought the required equipment for that experiment. After many experiments like this, I now have a
very nicely stocked lab with enough glassware and chemicals to do pretty much whatever I like without having to buy anything new!
I also started by chasing elements. My very first experiment was an iron oxide thermite to make iron for my collection. You can find many elements
around the house: copper wire, iron nails, tungsten lightbulb filament, argon lightbulb fill gas, mercury thermometers, americium smoke detector
buttons, gold and silver jewelry, and so on. If you're interested in thermite, you can make a lot of the transition metals (plus B and Si) through
that type of reaction. Element collecting is great fun, and it's neat to be able to say you've made most of them yourself.
Swimming pool chemicals are definitely useful. I've made chlorine and bromine using only pool chems. They even have lanthanum chloride! (in some kind
of phosphate remover.) Become a compulsive label reader, and you'll quickly find lots of interesting stuff in lots of stores.
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diddi
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ooooh elements! now your talking 
Beginning construction of periodic table display
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W.R.Monger
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I'm in the same situation here. Trying to figure out what would be some fun/interesting projects.
I want to make some bromine. That should be fairly straightforward and simple. I could produce some of that and seal into an ampoule just to have.
Same with iodine. Chlorine is a gas, so that won't work
The hot ice thing is pretty cool, so i think I'll go for sodium acetate. Then esterification, and i can have ethyl acetate and/or dehydrate to glacial
acetic acid.
The diethyl ether synth sounds fun, that's another useful solvent for later experiments. Obviously precautions must be taken so as not to explode
Then I think i would like to produce some acetonitrile from decarboxylation of alanine
But all of these are more reagant prep than any kind of actual project. I suppose though its a good start and I'll come up with something
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MrHomeScientist
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Glad to see another new hobby chemist!
I know you'll hear this a lot, but safety is key. I want to especially mention bromine because I had a personal run-in with this one. I made bromine
via the electrochemical method, specifically to avoid distillation. Distillation is fine while it's running, but disassembling glass full of bromine
vapor afterward is tricky. Even with my method that keeps fumes released to a minimum, and even whilst doing this outside on a windy day, I got a few
good breaths of Br vapor that caused dizziness, lightheadedness, headache, and an upset stomach feeling. I actually called poison control on that one.
Their advice was just to retreat to fresh air, rest, and drink plenty of fluids. I recovered within a few hours, but it was still a scary experience.
I've also heard bromine produces very painful, long lasting burns if the liquid is spilled on you. Luckily that didn't happen to me. When I was
sealing the bromine in an ampoule, I was absolutely terrified I'd knock the vial over, causing the Br to flash boil on the hot glass and explode the
container, showering me with bromine liquid. Again, luckily that didn't happen to me. But you should at least be aware of the possibility that these
sorts of things can happen, so that you are extra careful when performing these experiments.
You certainly can seal chlorine in ampoules; I've done it. I just flushed the ampoule with several volumes of chlorine gas to displace air then flame
sealed it. It's faint, but if you look down the length of the vial you can see the green color. Others have liquefied their gas and sealed it that
way; I'd be worried about having a high pressure ampoule of chlorine on my shelf, though.
Those all sound like fun experiments! Good luck, and always think through what could happen before starting an experiment. Be prepared for the worst,
wear your safety gear, and have any neutralizing agents handy. (sodium thiosulfate solution for halogens)
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fusso
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Shouldn't alanine
de-CO2-ate to EtNH2 instead of MeCN?
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DavidJR
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Quote: Originally posted by diddi  | swimming pool shops have lots of OTC chems. or if you or on a budget, find a friend with a pool and ask for some small samples of their chems
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Swimming pools and by extension swimming pool shops are not really a thing in the UK. We don't have the weather for it.
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Housane
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hi just wondering how to do a simpe disrlation( what equipment is needed and is a cindensor worth it? i have nothing so far
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W.R.Monger
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Mr homescientist thanks for all that. Yeah, the bromine isn't gonna be my first experiment, that's for sure. I've got massive ventilation in any case,
and I'll probably yet to wash the glass with caustic water before disassembling, to reduce the free bromine...i don't know how effective that will be
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=29248
Yes.
[Edited on 11-9-2018 by W.R.Monger]
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j_sum1
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Bromine is always an attractive option simply because it is such an amazing and unusual substance. Bit do not underestimate the risks associated with
it.
My recommendation is to make some in test tubes on a tenth gram scale. Do it outside. Don't attempt to ampoule it. This is for experience to get a
sense of what you will be dealing with when you scale up at a later date.
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W.R.Monger
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Test tubes is a good idea. Cheap enough they could just be disposed of instead of trying to clean it up. As far as scale, I don't plan on(currently)
producing more than 2-3 ml, so not much scaling up to do, but I'm sure that's a wise idea too. I should probably find some more benign experiments to
start with, huh?
Why not try to ampoule it?
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j_sum1
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Test tubes clean fine. Simply rinse in water when you are done.
Seriously, 2-3 mL is a lot of bromine for a first attempt. Bromine is dense so that is nearly 10g. I would aim for 0.1g first up. After you have
some experience you can always scale up. Scaling down when you have a lung full of choking vapour is not so easy.
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W.R.Monger
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No, you're right. I just meant i wasn't planning on trying to make like a liter or anything like that
Housane a condenser is necessary for a distillation, how else do you plan on collecting the distillate?
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MrHomeScientist
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I made about 25mL when I did mine, so I guess that was on the large side  I
could have collected more had I distilled, but the whole point was to avoid that.
I used a sodium thiosulfate solution for neutralizing everything. I had a 1L jar full of bromine vapor, and pouring a little in and shaking ate it
right up. It was neat to watch the color suddenly disappear.
If you haven't made ampoules before, this isn't the best chemical to start with. I'd practice with some solids first and then a benign liquid, to get
a feel for how your particular ampoules handle and how you can heat the glass without heating the sample. If you already have experience, great! Just
be careful like I mentioned above. Bromine is an incredibly cool element.
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W.R.Monger
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The ampouling is the only thing i actually feel confident about. I have done a fair amount of glass blowing.
I've been looking around, i think some metal salts could be fun to play with. Maybe dissolving some copper in sulfuric acid and precipitating the
crystals would be a good place to start? Those crystals are pretty. Should be a lot safer than distilling bromine, nitriles and ether at the very
least
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MrHomeScientist
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Ah good, that was the part I was least confidant about!
Copper chemistry is a wonderful place to start. Lots of fun reactions can be done with simple chemicals with low toxicity, and you get lots of pretty
colors. I love the deep blue of copper sulfate. I won't react with dilute sulfuric acid, though, and concentrated acid will stop reacting somewhat
quickly since there's no water for the sulfate to dissolve in! Nitric acid is best, but usually hardest to get. You could make it from sulfuric and a
nitrate source. You might be able to dissolve copper in sulfuric if you periodically add some hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer, but I've never done
that myself. Others may have more experience.
A great series to do (especially with students) is the copper cycle. Lots of versions, but the one I did was: copper metal --> copper nitrate
--> copper carbonate --> copper sulfate --> copper metal. You get to see lots of colors, fizzing reactions, and you go full circle to make
copper metal again.
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Housane
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What is the cheapest place to get a condensor. Does it have to be ground glass or can i do it with normal flasks
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W.R.Monger
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I never thought to take it full circle. That could be pretty cool, watch my pretty blue crystals turn into shiny metal. I am gonna need to get some
glass.
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Ubya
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| Quote: Originally posted by Housane | | What is the cheapest place to get a condensor. Does it have to be ground glass or can i do it with normal flasks |
you need flasks AND condenser, how did you expect to distill something?
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JJay
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Bromine is distilled using ground glass joints. It will attack rubber.
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macckone
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One important consideration when buying glassware is the ground glass sizing. Traditional ground glass lab sized gear is going to be 24/40 (US) or
24/29 (EU). In the US smaller sizes are 14/20 and 19/22. In the US 45/50 and 55/50 are more industrial sizes. In the EU the smaller sizes are likely
to be 14/23 and 19/29. The first number is a diameter and the second number is a length. A shorter male will generally go into a longer female but
not vice versa. It is better to have them matched.
There are also ground glass ball and socket joints but those are usually on more advanced sets.
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