| Pages:
1
2
3
4 |
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
I wonder who owns this dirt from roads? Is it the government's because they own the roads? What if it's a toll road?
If so and if there's any money in it, they would lay claim to it ASAP, but I imagine that it would be hard to enforce it.
A new kind of poaching would spring up. Roadside poaching or roaching. People doing it would thus be called roaches,
which fits as presumably they would come out at night to sweep up the dirt.
I can just see the reality TV series in my mind...
Unfortunately, this is all fantasy for now lol
[Edited on 6-6-2016 by deltaH]
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
It's Mine all Mine.
That's why us 'roaches call it 'mining'.
Here's what the top layer of the dust/mud/NaOH looks like after 24hrs or so :
[Edited on 6-6-2016 by aga]
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
This looks super fantastic aga! Now you just need to boil it down or if it's hot and sunny outside, put it in a tray to evaporate for
a few days.
If you do go the heating route, be wary not to lose it by splattering as it might get thick at the end.
What's it's volume btw?
You could probably get more of it out with a couple of repeated wash and decants if you really wanted to, but you're probably not to hung up on
getting maximum recovery just now.
Well done!
PS. Sorry, didn't mean to call you a roach, tactless moment, just thought it was funny that road poaching = roaching.
[Edited on 7-6-2016 by deltaH]
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
WARNING:
Please people take great care not to be hit by cars, drivers don't always pay to much attention to the shoulder of the road and at night it gets
worse! High visibility is key, wear reflectors and bright colours if collecting the dirt and be vigilant of traffic at all times! Working at night is
not advisable and if you really must, attach signal lights to your body for maximum visibility.
[Edited on 7-6-2016 by deltaH]
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Pt miner's safety manual :-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BrivBSv20Y
The liquid is a kind of murky suspension of a lot of the fine material, which will have included quite a lot of organic material.
Do you think it should be coarse-filtered before evaporating off the water ?
If not, the result will probably be a mud cake.
[Edited on 7-6-2016 by aga]
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
I wouldn't filter it, the fines may also contain PGMs. I'd just get rid of the water, i.e. oven, sun, boil etc.
Then time to smelt the sucker in an arc.
When you get to that stage, make sure to leave it in the arc long enough. You need extremely high temperatures to melt PGMs (1800C), which isn't
achieved quickly. Also, insulate, insulate, insulate. A small box design of refractory bricks is best.
[Edited on 7-6-2016 by deltaH]
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5128
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Just out of idle curiosity, what do you plan to use as a crucible?
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
I've got 1 of these :
http://artisanfoundry.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=110
Embarassingly i cannot remember if it's an A1, A2, A3 etc.
NaOH certainly chews through whatever that material is : i used to have two ...
For this particular melt i plan on making something from fire bricks.
Whether any particular available brick works well for this (or not) is totally unknown at this time, at least to me.
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
Any update on the evaporation of the colloidal concentrate?
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
The thick brackish brown liquid got poured off and left out in a bucket.
Over the past 2 days it's been 36 C+ during the day.
I'll go take a photo. 1 sec.
Edit:
This is the liquidus in the specialised evaporation apparatus 
Approx 4.3cm reduction in height of the liquid over the past 4 days :
The mud left in the original bucket :
[Edited on 10-6-2016 by aga]
|
|
|
MrHomeScientist
International Hazard
Posts: 1806
Registered: 24-10-2010
Location: Flerovium
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
This is a bit old to jump in, but remember that hydroxides can have quite a bit of water of hydration; KOH in particular can be up to 15% water by
weight. I always use more hydroxide than calculated to account for this unknown.
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Better late than never !
Yes, the NaOH i get locally is of dubious purity, let alone hydration state.
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
This is looking very good, looks like it might be done in a few more days.
I have been thinking about the smelting step. I am a bit dubious whether 1800C can be uniformly reached without flushing a graphite crucible with
argon gas. (like what they did in that clip when they arc smelted tungsten). So since you probably don't have argon gas to prevent the crucible from
enflaming, I suggest using a lower melting alloying metal which can be dissolved out later, say with nitric acid, to leave behind a PGM residue
The problem is that the only metal I can think of that would do the job well is silver. Furthermore, you need the silver to be thoroughly deposited
evenly over the catalyst. Fortunately, this is easy to do with silver nitrate. So I would wet the residue with a concentrated solution of silver
nitrate, let dry, then smelt. The silver nitrate would rapidly decompose to silver particles within the material depositing everywhere internally.
Silver has a low melting point and is inert, so it's easily smelted in an amateur context. A large silver bead is also easily collected.
Then the silver bead can be dissolved in boiling nitric acid to once again make a solution of silver nitrate (which can be re-used in the process) and
leave behind a residue of PGM powder which can then be dissolved in hot aqua regia to yield an orange solution if successful.
If you don't have silver nitrate, you can prepare it easily from a small piece of silver and nitric acid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6hPgGV_qAg
|
|
|
j_sum1
Administrator
Posts: 6336
Registered: 4-10-2014
Location: At home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Most of the ducks are in a row
|
|
I am watching this all with interest.
Actually though, my thoughts are trending in a different direction. I think I might follow Cody's procedure to the letter and end up with a little
pinhead of PGM. This will be good for the element collection -- after all, for my collection what I want is the story behind each element. And a
little impure bump dragged off the road edge says a lot more than a cm of Pt wire.
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Still got that mol of AgNO3 i bought from hegi.
Hitting 1800C+ with a rigged up arc should work.
More worrying is silver's boiling point ...
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5128
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
i think you might need to look at magnesia or zirconia crucibles to stand up to the molten alkali.
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
Yes, the magnesia was mentioned already due to the basiscity of the concentrate.
I think it's a must if you're smelting straight.
As for the silver, yes, useless in an arc. That version would be for a improvised gas or charcoal furnace.
Aga, I really think you need to make yourself a magnesia crucible.
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by j_sum1  | I am watching this all with interest.
Actually though, my thoughts are trending in a different direction. I think I might follow Cody's procedure to the letter and end up with a little
pinhead of PGM. This will be good for the element collection -- after all, for my collection what I want is the story behind each element. And a
little impure bump dragged off the road edge says a lot more than a cm of Pt wire. |
Welcome jsum! 
|
|
|
battoussai114
Hazard to Others
Posts: 235
Registered: 18-2-2015
Member Is Offline
Mood: Not bad.... Not bad.
|
|
It's been sunny for a couple days and the ponds are slowly drying (very slowly since lately it hits 17ºC outside at best).
Anyone has experience with those gravimetric concentrators used in mining? I've seen mentioning of Falcon Concentrators in a platinum extraction
patent and I'm curious about how these work.
Batoussai.
|
|
|
minstarmin
Unregistered
Posts: N/A
Registered: N/A
Member Is Offline
|
|
Only Cody's Lab would have thought up something like this. 
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Edit:
Drawn a blank on 'lantern batteries' out here, so had to order some graphite rods from ebay :
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/162029034602?_trksid=p2057872.m274...
[Edited on 13-6-2016 by aga]
|
|
|
deltaH
Dangerous source of unreferenced speculation
Posts: 1663
Registered: 30-9-2013
Location: South Africa
Member Is Offline
Mood: Heavily protonated
|
|
Rods look good. How's the concentrate evaporation proceeding? Should make masses of sodium carbonate at the end because of the high soda content.
Hoping all that alkali will act as a flux to melt the silica content of the concentrate, forming sodium silicate rich melts.
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Heatwave ! 41 C yesterday, and very windy.
There's about an inch left to evaporate off.
|
|
|
blogfast25
International Hazard
Posts: 10562
Registered: 3-2-2008
Location: Neverland
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
What's evaporating off there?
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
Water.
It's an old paint bucket: the flaky bits are paint.
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2
3
4 |
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
