A Halogenated Substance
Hazard to Self
Posts: 68
Registered: 7-2-2017
Location: United States
Member Is Offline
Mood: Oxidizing due to extended exposure to oxygen
|
|
On the topic of home Sulfur Chemistry-Viewpoints wanted
If this post is more fitting for legal and societal issues, I apologize.
For the past month, I've been fairly interested into Sulfur chemistry, particularly sulfur's use in the organic chemistry field. I'm aware of sulfur's
bad reputation for having the potential to create extremely irritating and fairly poisonous compounds. The main compounds use I've been wanting to
explore though are the Sulfur halides, starting off with the chlorides. The main use I want to use Sulfur chlorides for is their usefulness in
creating halide groups which have a diverse range of uses.
I'd like to clear up that I'm not interested in creating stink bombs and such. However, exploring the forum, I found a thread concerning a user, Cou,
and his wanting to do Sulfur chemistry. Other users reacted fairly negatively to his interests, particularly over the fact that home organic chemistry
is the one of the home chemistry fields that would annoy or put people in danger the most.
I'm working on a good system to produce Sulfur chlorides currently and even pre-prepared a storage system for it outside of the house (a styrofoam
container with sodium thiosulfate and sodium carbonate mixed with kitty litter; bottles will rest in the mixture). I'm able to create neutralization
traps for Sulfur chlorides.
The most severe problem of this is that I live in a suburban neighborhood. I have not created a system to neutralize thiols and organic sulfides
(though I'd expect I would use conc. sodium hydroxide). I don't have a confident system for storing thiols and sulfides. Again, the reason I want to
try to experiment with organosulfur compounds is their reactively potential in reactions.
I feel that I can confidently use Sulfur chlorides in well contained experiments but insecure about organosulfur compounds. I don't want to bash the
name of amateur chemistry or land myself in trouble by accidentally smelling up the nearby area like a skunk. I'd like other people's viewpoints. Is
there a viable system for production and storage of organosulfur compounds in a home setting? Should I just desert the Sulfur organic chemistry just
for safety's sake? Is there a way to make and use organosulfur compounds institute?
Thank you for any responses.
Edit: Just discovered from Aga that Sulfur chlorides ruin glassware and should have immediate use or be placed in short term shortage. Maybe I'll
transform my storage container into a bromine storage container.
Edit #2: Just found out that Sulfur chlorides are schedule 3 chemicals. There'll definitely be no storage of it I guess  . Careful notebook planning and immediately using it only.
[Edited on 2-14-2017 by A Halogenated Substance]
[Edited on 2-15-2017 by A Halogenated Substance]
|
|
|
JJay
International Hazard
Posts: 3440
Registered: 15-10-2015
Member Is Offline
|
|
I wouldn't worry too much about what people think about it as long as you aren't poisoning yourself or others, stinking up the neighborhood, or
getting the cops called to your house. Sulfur chemistry is a great topic in general, and sulfur is one chemical that is widely and readily available
to almost everyone.
|
|
|
Texium
Administrator
Posts: 4583
Registered: 11-1-2014
Location: Salt Lake City
Member Is Offline
Mood: PhD candidate!
|
|
Well, negative reactions to Cou were more due to his whiny attitude and blatant immaturity than the sort of chemistry he was wanting to do. Clearly
you're much better off than he ever was since you've actually documented a couple of experiments and taken steps to get started in the hobby
responsibly.
Sulfur chemistry is rather dodgy, primarily due to the odors, and also because it has a tendency to make a huge mess of your glassware. I have not
done much sulfur chemistry at all, myself. I haven't made sulfur chlorides before (though I probably will at some point if I find a need for it), and
I haven't done any organosulfur chemistry. I've barely used any of the sulfur that I bought a few years ago, and what I have used was only for some
little early experiments with making metal sulfides.
That goes to show that although organosulfur compounds are useful, they are by no means essential for an amateur organic chemist. I would recommend
avoiding sulfur chemistry until you get a better lab setup with less risk of attracting negative attention. In the meantime, there's plenty of stuff
you can do in the realm of CHON based organic chemistry that won't stink up your yard.
|
|
|
Amos
International Hazard
Posts: 1406
Registered: 25-3-2014
Location: Yes
Member Is Offline
Mood: No
|
|
Sulfur compounds don't "ruin your glassware" unless you simply don't have access to xylenes or toluene to clean up elemental sulfur with.
As for the Schedule 3 of the CWC listing, which is intended as a world peacekeeping tool more so than a safety measure: "Plants which manufacture of
more than 30 tonnes per year must be declared and can be inspected as per Part VIII of the "Verification Annex", and there are restrictions on export
to countries which are not CWC signatories"
Well, looks like you can't synthesize your 30th ton until 2018 
[Edited on 2-15-2017 by Amos]
|
|
|
A Halogenated Substance
Hazard to Self
Posts: 68
Registered: 7-2-2017
Location: United States
Member Is Offline
Mood: Oxidizing due to extended exposure to oxygen
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by Amos  | Sulfur compounds don't "ruin your glassware" unless you simply don't have access to xylenes or toluene to clean up elemental sulfur with.
As for the Schedule 3 of the CWC listing, which is intended as a world peacekeeping tool more so than a safety measure: "Plants which manufacture of
more than 30 tonnes per year must be declared and can be inspected as per Part VIII of the "Verification Annex", and there are restrictions on export
to countries which are not CWC signatories"
Well, looks like you can't synthesize your 30th ton until 2018
[Edited on 2-15-2017 by Amos] |
Oh darn, the factory in my backyard will just have to wait til then.
I've been, however, looking into heterocyclic compound synthesis and haloalkanes instead.
I extremely appreciate the advice given. I'll likely just do organo-sulfur chemistry later if it appeals to me once again, if I've put together good
handling and disposal techniques for the compounds. 
|
|
|
aga
Forum Drunkard
Posts: 7030
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline
|
|
As Amos rightly says, sulphur compounds do not ruin glassware <i>per-se</i>.
Sulphur di/monochloride doesn't dissolve or etch the glassware or anything like that.
The problem is just that if any of the gas escapes, it will react with atmospheric moisture, precipitating sulphur in the ground glass joint,
effectively gluing the joint in place.
Pretty much the same story as solidified NaOH in a ground glass joint.
As sulphur chlorides are easy to make, best make a small amount once to get the hang of it, then destroy that batch.
Make the amount you need next time just before it is required - no storage necessary.
This principle holds true for all potentially 'dangerous' or unstable substances : if you do not need any now, do not make any now.
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
