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Qt3bflee
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Paraffin to extract essential oil (cannabis)
Let me preface that I am a medical patient residing in a state where cannabis is legal.
I am curious on the use of paraffin wax to extract essential oils.
"I was thinking how easy it would be to heat a solution containing cannabis flower and simply add melted paraffin. Let this mix for 30 minutes, then
allow the solution to cool.
From here, the solid paraffin could be further cleaned by washing with water.
After this, the dried paraffin can be added to boiling 95% ethanol and then chilled for winterizing. Chill to the cloud point at which paraffin would
precipitate leaving Cannabis oil in solution.
The benefit here is clear, no major safety risks and wholly non-toxic. Plus, the cannabis flower would never require drying. This would allow any
grower the means of rapidly reducing their crop into oil straight from harvest.
Paraffin wax is only slightly soluble in ethanol and so extreme temperatures and long waiting times for the winterization process may not be
necessary."
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee]
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violet sin
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Sooo, you want to mix plant matter in with liquid paraffin? Then strain it, cool it and try to extract oil from wax with alcohol? That just sounds
like a pain/headache waiting to happen.
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Qt3bflee
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Yes, exactly that.
Paraffin wax can hold up to 1.5oz of essential oil per pound when used for candle making(anecdotal). Ethanol can hold up to 1g of cannabis oil per
3-10ml (anecdotal). I would imagine the oil would have a greater affinity for the ethanol.
My main purpose is due to recent laws being passed preventing the use of butane for extraction. CO2 is cost prohibitive for most people, and while
there are other solvent choices, I figured I would explore alternatives.
And to clarify, I do NOT mean "liquid paraffin". I mean paraffin wax (pure) that has been heated sufficiently as to stir easily in a
solution.
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee]
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee]
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee]
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violet sin
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The thing that strikes me as a poor idea here, is the solid nature of paraffin wax at room temp. Your plant material is going to be entombed in the
stuff, and in order to get your oil out, your going to need to heat the wax a lot, And try to strain it clean, before adding a solvent and do a few
extractions. Even with strong stirring making tiny droplets, you will only be pulling from the liquid wax blobs surface.
Boiling 95% alc can be pretty dangerous if a spill occurs.
What's wrong with just using the alcohol at room temp for the whole thing?
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Bert
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Safety?!
If you don't avoid handling large quantities of near BP alcohol, why bother using a wax extraction at all?
Some things never change, it seems. Only the choice of dangerously flammable solvents- 40 years ago, people extracting cannabis frequently blew
up/burned down their house. Ether(!) and ethanol were popular solvents. Today, same conditions (drug people playing with flammable chemicals, often
while using), same general outcome- FWOOOSH! KABOOM!!!
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Bert]
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Bot0nist
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Large scale butane extractions are in vogue now. I can only assume some catastrophic explosions have resulted from neglect and or ignorance during
this process.
U.T.F.S.E. and learn the joys of autodidacticism!
Don't judge each day only by the harvest you reap, but also by the seeds you sow.
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Qt3bflee
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You... you don't have to boil alcohol for this process. Have you not heard of paraffin therapy?
Anyway, heating the paraffin wax (which I have done quite readily at <180°f) isn't an issue, nor is heating the ethanol (which paraffin is soluble
at far less than boiling alcohol temp.)
I thought this was a science forum. I'm just reading a bit of commentary and ignorance.
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee]
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OneEyedPyro
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I'd suspect the solubility of wax in ethanol is awfully low, maybe a gram of paraffin per 200mls of boiling alcohol.
It sounds pretty impractical to me.
If the only real benefit is not having to let the plants dry then it doesn't sound worth the extra grief. Besides, drying cannabis would only take at
most a couple days with elevated temps and good air flow.
Why not just extract with alcohol then crash into cold water, filter off the solidified product then distill the alcohol back out of the water and
repeat? Sounds easier and more efficient but maybe I'm not quite grasping your concept here.
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Bert
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| Quote: |
I thought this was a science forum. I'm just reading a bit of commentary and ignorance.
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Apologies for our verbose and ignorant ways. I will spare you any further exposure to these micro aggressions!
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4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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JJay
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Cannabis is legal here too. Butane extractions are not liked by local authorities, and almost all chemical extractions are illegal, but glycerine
extractions are specifically sanctioned by code.
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Upsilon
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Quote: Originally posted by Qt3bflee  |
I thought this was a science forum. I'm just reading a bit of commentary and ignorance.
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by Qt3bflee] |
It is a science forum - not a place for you to drop in out of nowhere to ask about furthering a drug operation and instantly insulting those
who aren't telling you what you want to hear.
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Bert
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bot0nist | | Large scale butane extractions are in vogue now. I can only assume some catastrophic explosions have resulted from neglect and or ignorance during
this process. |
Oh yes. Made the news several times the last few years- The hash oil makers are killing their neighbors as well as themselves, occasionally. Hence our
new friend wanting to find a "safer" way, not involving butane.
But although ethanol @ STP doesn't come boiling out of it's opened container and go looking for your hot water heater's pilot flame- the
explosive/flammable range of ethanol in air is WIDER than butane's.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/explosive-concentration-li...
And the flash point of ethanol is still below normal room temperature.
So it's not exactly a low fire danger, especially when handled warm and in bulk by whiny, lazy stoners who can't be arsed to figure out their own
chemical engineering.
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Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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OneEyedPyro
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Agreed Upsilon.
It appears he was just looking for a pat on the back for his "brilliant" idea, why even post something if you aren't looking for suggestions?
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by OneEyedPyro]
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violet sin
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There is no benefit from using paraffin wax over the alcohol you would use to pull oil out with. Why make a wax middleman situation. Is there a
specific reason for the suggested route that you haven't made clear?
Edit, this thread is growing faster than I can type on my phone...
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by violet sin]
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Bot0nist
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Alcohol pulls so much chlorophyll, does it not?
U.T.F.S.E. and learn the joys of autodidacticism!
Don't judge each day only by the harvest you reap, but also by the seeds you sow.
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violet sin
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It really does if not run right. If you are trying to get every last spec of active substance. But winterizing can be usefull there. As well as
shortened duration of solvent contact. I would assume the paraffin would better retain the waxes and chlorophyll than the oils. But not worth the
hastle when alcohol and a freezer are available. There are a ton of sites that have information on what alcohols pull in comparison. Isopropyl,
methanol, ethanol that is. As well as ether, hexane and others.
A quick alcohol pull, will give an amber solution, unlike the emerald color of one sitting for some time.
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hissingnoise
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The large number of active compounds in cannabis make extraction a bit hit-and-miss as there is a fairly broad range of solubilities involved . . .
And the shift to sativa-dominant strains means that the subtler effects from difficultly soluble compounds may be slight or missing altogether in the
residues obtained!
I personally prefer the more cerebral  , low-latitude sativas and because of
that I would never even consider fucking around with extractions . . .
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violet sin
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Perhaps a vacuum assisted low/mild heat, vaporizing apparatus would be benefitial there. End up with a honey colored goo inside of chilled glass.
Still sounds like a huge PITA. Extractions can be rewarding if done with care and consumed propperly. A matter of preference I guess. But you
don't have to be one of the idiots blasting a gram of oil shatter in one go on a hot pin.
Much subtler states of intoxication can be achieved with a tiny fleck dropped on the cherry of a cigarette and the resulting smoke inhaled. Old
hippie showed that trick off. Also mentioned people puking and hallucinating from too much of the stuff made by ether. Less than one standard size
drop.
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Bert
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Ethanol extracted>re dissolved in diethyl ether>warm dH2O washed extracts led to some VERY bizarre behavior in "sketchy" people I knew 40 odd
years back.
One of the reasons I'm tetchy about baby stoners who know it all. If you're going to do kitchen organic chemistry and put the results into trusting
people's systems, you'd better know EXACTLY what the fuck you're about.
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
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Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Detonationology
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It seems this thread is off topic enough to bring up this question. If I remember correctly, the polarity of a few solvents is: ethanol >
isopropyl > acetone > CHCl3 > CH2Cl2
Why is the di-/trichloromethane extraction so unheard of, assuming that THC would dissolve very well in both, considering it is non-polar?
[Edited on 10-29-2015 by Detonationology]
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careysub
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The best extraction procedure (from the perspective of cost, safety and effectiveness) is to extract with 91% IPA. It works very well.
After evaporation/distillation (water pump would be ideal) if you want to purify the extract, then redissolve in hexane, heptane (Bestine), plain old
gasoline, or if you must, butane. Only a very small amount is needed to redissolve the extract.
Sure DCM will do the extraction, as will acetone and DMSO, but they are more expensive, or harder to work with, or extract more extra junk. Curiously,
although IPA is considered more polar than acetone, it is more selective in extraction in this case.
[Edited on 29-10-2015 by careysub]
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unionised
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Just a quick note for those who want to point out that this is an absurd, and impractical way to extract something from plants which could never work
in a month of Sundays.
It's done commercially on a reasonable scale.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enfleurage
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hissingnoise
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| Quote: | | Why is the di-/trichloromethane extraction so unheard of, assuming that THC would dissolve very well in both, considering it is non-polar?
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I wouldn't want the taint of chloride in my smoke and there's the fear that some minor constituents in cannabis might not be fully inert to alkyl
chloride . . .
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aga
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Not being a dope-smoker (i get my dope from good old Beer) i have to admit that i'm curious.
I have heard that Butane is used to extract THC from plants yielding an Oil.
Is Weed-Oil commonly available these days ?
It was mostly solid blocks of lebanese blonde hash when i was (much) younger.
Dried buds are, and always will be found as that is the easiest prep.
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zed
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Might be possible to use ethanol biodiesel. Theoretically, it enjoys a price advantage over most common solvents. Provided tax exempt ethanol could
be used in its manufacture.
Of course, I'm assuming, the ethyl-esters involved, will not react with cannibis constituents.
An unproven assumption.
Possible?
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