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dieglegold
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Fulminating Gold
I have been trying to prepare fulminating gold for 2 months with rare success. Most of my batches do not detonate, although I had success twice;
however, I have been unable to repeat those successes. I have been using the various recipes on the Internet, typically: dissolve pure gold in aqua
regia (1 part HNO3 to 4 parts HCl), dilute the gold chloride solution with about 5 volumes of distilled water, precipitate fulminating gold with
aqueous ammonia (purchased from grocery store), filter the precipitate (on coffee filters), then dry it while on the filter paper at about 35C. The
precipitates usually do not explode, although sometimes they fizzle a bit and emit the characteristic purple gold aerosol. What am I doing wrong? I
need some advice, please.
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aga
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What and Why ?
What did you do the last time, in Detail, and Why post here without any reference to a procedure you followed instead of posting this
in Beginnings ?
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hissingnoise
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| Quote: | | have been trying to prepare fulminating gold for 2 months with rare success. Most of my batches do not detonate, although I had success twice;
however, I have been unable to repeat those successes. I have been using the various recipes on the Internet, typically: dissolve pure gold in aqua
regia (1 part HNO3 to 4 parts HCl), dilute the gold chloride solution with about 5 volumes of distilled water, precipitate fulminating gold with
aqueous ammonia (purchased from grocery store), filter the precipitate (on coffee filters), then dry it while on the filter paper at about 35C.
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Ammonia cleaner is dilute NH4OH!
Using an excess might make all the difference . . . ?
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cyanureeves
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oh yes! i can promise you that a stouter ammonia will get you there.i did it about three times and was satisfied because all i was after was the red
precipitate.i used the stuff for gold plating but one time i used ammonia that i had made by bubbling ammonia gas by product.i was making sodium
nitrate using sodium hydroxide and ammonium nitrate and decided to make use of the gas by product.i harnessed quite a bit of gas in cold water and
that ammonium hydroxide made a big difference.damn gold exploded violently like a powerful firecracker.wear goggles.
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Polverone
Now celebrating 21 years of madness
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Thread Moved
17-10-2015 at 16:06 |
OneEyedPyro
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Janitorial ammonia is usually 15% while the type found in grocery stores is much weaker and often contains additives, I'm not sure which kind you have
but I'm guessing the latter.
Just make your own like Cyanu said with some distilled water in an ice bath.
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dieglegold
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To answer aga's question above, the reason is because I am brand new to this forum and don't yet understand how it works. Any explanation as to how
and where I should first post would be appreciated.
Regarding cyanureeves information, I have two more questions: 1) Should I dilute the gold chloride solution with water before I add ammonium
hydroxide, and if so, by how many volumes of water? 2) When I add the ammonium hydroxide, should I add a large excess and then decant off the liquid
phase, or is it important to add just enough to precipitate all the fulminating gold but not an excess?
I am really motivated to use a procedure that will give me successful results, reliably.
Anyone else who wishes to answer is also welcome.
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cyanureeves
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i thought stoichiometry was like a religion so i dont use it much.i add the ammonium hydroxide straight to the gold in aqua regia without diluting.i
think hissingnoise meant that if the ammonia is too diluted then excess will eventually get you the stoichiometric equivalent to drop the red gold.i
add ammonia little by little until it all changes color,it will immediately a bit turbulent then go almost clear as it precipitates.it happens really
quick.
[Edited on 10-19-2015 by cyanureeves]
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dieglegold
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Cyanureeves: Understood, and thank you very much for providing additional details. Rather than produce my own ammonium hydroxide, I took the easy
route and ordered 29% ACS grade on the Internet. Your reference to "red" gold is confusing to me, because the literature on the Internet describes FG
as being yellow or brown. The two successes I had were with yellow FG (once) and tan/beige FG (once). Anyway, I will see what I get when I follow
your instructions.
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JJay
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This is an excellent topic. I understand that fulminating gold was heavily researched by medieval alchemists, some of whom died when they attempted to
produce it in large quantities.
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Tdep
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I have an idea what might be going wrong. On first addition of ammonia, there is a gold precipitate that forms but this is not the energetic FG (I see
my EAu acronymn never took off, oh well) but gold hydroxide because youre lowering the pH. To form te FG you need to add ammonia until the gold
hydroxide redissolves and then precipitates out again as a slightly different yellow coloured solid.
If you have lots of excess mimeral acid in your dissolved gold, it can seem like youve added too much ammonia but you need enough to form the second
precipitate which is the complex you want. Be careful!
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MrHomeScientist
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Why would you think that?
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Bert
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Quote: Originally posted by dieglegold  | | Cyanureeves: Rather than produce my own ammonium hydroxide, I took the easy route and ordered 29% ACS grade on the Internet. |
Bet that was expensive...
http://www.gsdirect.net/michlin-ammonia.html
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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halogen
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Well I find it rather interesting that the most perfect metal has little enough interest in combining with impure substances like ammonia. Take a
minute to consider what is the primary source of ammonia? Urine. Putrefaction and decay, and rejection from the living body are the sources of
ammonia, and ammonia compounds. These gold rejects explosively.
Consider, further, that ammonia is, according to modern chemical knowledge, a bastardized form of water, on water all live depends, and that the
alkahest, also according to modern chemical knowledge, is identifiable unquestionably with fluorine. Hydrogen fluoride, which spells death to us
mortal humans, being a compound of fluorine and hydrogen, is therefore by analogy a more perfect water.
In recent news let us suppose that the claim of an "alien" superstructure, some four thousands of light years away, is correctly interpreted. Could it
be these aliens inhale as their vital substance the most perfect water, hydrogen fluoride, and reject aqua terrae as we do ammonia?
Chemically, the exhalations of these beings can dissolve silicaceous rocks. On that topic consider the chemical analogy between carbon, which is vital
to our organs, silicium, which is the the prime constituent of rocks, and tin and lead! which the alchemists knew as "base metals". Surely
this can be no coincidence.
Finally, regard that fluorine combines withh all elements except for helium; of helium the sun is largely made. One must study carefully the
implications of the chemical and vital activity of neon. It only enters into combination with the alcahest at the lowest temperatures.
What does alchemy teach us?
[Edited on 19-10-2015 by halogen]
F. de Lalande and M. Prud'homme showed that a mixture of boric oxide and sodium chloride is decomposed in a stream of dry air or oxygen at a red heat
with the evolution of chlorine.
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Bert
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Mood: " I think we are all going to die. I think that love is an illusion. We are flawed, my darling".
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I have no response to that...
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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dieglegold
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I believe that Halogen has perhaps inhaled too much halogen.
Tdep: Excellent suggestion. I will address it.
BTW, the 29% ammonium hydroxide cost $13.00 for a pint. However, if I can afford to explode gold and need pure ammonia to do it, what is $13, right?
(We won't mention the shipping cost.)
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dieglegold
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I meant $13 for a 1000 ml bottle, not a pint.
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cyanureeves
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stoicism was what i heard in bible class and gnostics too.beliefs that
christians encountered way back in the 1st century before layboy,deschem and such.
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cyanureeves
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| Quote: Originally posted by dieglegold | | Cyanureeves: Understood, and thank you very much for providing additional details. Rather than produce my own ammonium hydroxide, I took the easy
route and ordered 29% ACS grade on the Internet. Your reference to "red" gold is confusing to me, because the literature on the Internet describes FG
as being yellow or brown. The two successes I had were with yellow FG (once) and tan/beige FG (once). Anyway, I will see what I get when I follow
your instructions. |
it looked redish to me,but i'll say it looks yellow or brown or red.my mac mini keeps
dropping internet signal.$600.00 i paid and it's a pc. of junk,junk,junk! but hey it's an apple????
[Edited on 10-19-2015 by cyanureeves]
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dieglegold
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Well, another failure-partially. I followed Tdep's advice by adding a large excess of ammonium hydroxide to a gold chloride solution (containing very
little if any excess aqua regia, because I had saturated the aqua regia with gold). A yellow/tan precipitate formed instantly, which I filtered,
rinsed with distilled water while on the filter paper, and then scraped off and air dried on a Teflon sheet. Some pieces "pop" when lit with a match,
but other just "hiss" and sometimes extinguish the match. It is as if the precipitate is a "weak" form of FG. If this problem is because I am still
using household ammonia, I will know next week because that is when the 29% solution (ACS grade) is to be delivered.
I continue to have trouble connecting with my "inner alchemist." Thanks to all who have contributed information to help me conquer this vexing issue.
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Amos
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| Quote: Originally posted by dieglegold | Well, another failure-partially. I followed Tdep's advice by adding a large excess of ammonium hydroxide to a gold chloride solution (containing very
little if any excess aqua regia, because I had saturated the aqua regia with gold). A yellow/tan precipitate formed instantly, which I filtered,
rinsed with distilled water while on the filter paper, and then scraped off and air dried on a Teflon sheet. Some pieces "pop" when lit with a match,
but other just "hiss" and sometimes extinguish the match. It is as if the precipitate is a "weak" form of FG. If this problem is because I am still
using household ammonia, I will know next week because that is when the 29% solution (ACS grade) is to be delivered.
I continue to have trouble connecting with my "inner alchemist." Thanks to all who have contributed information to help me conquer this vexing issue.
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Tdep seems to be our resident expert on this; to find out more than what he is conveying via text posts, you can always go and watch his video on it
here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73esFfgASk8
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dieglegold
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The video is most helpful! The devil is usually in the details, and I learned a couple of useful tips. Thank you.
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hissingnoise
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You know what dieglegold, just send me a just a few of those big ingots and I'll certainly do you a step-by-step synthesis and proving video ─ and
(wait for it) free of charge, too! 
I assume that shipping costs are not a problem for you so, you know, the more-the-merrier. 
Oh, I'm so happy! 
Thanks in advance. 
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cyanureeves
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dieglegold DONT do whats in the video with your ammonia hydroxide that you ordered.in the video he uses household ammonia and shows it not detonating
upon impact.your gold WILL explode,i know because it blew up on me right under my nuts and dirt flew into my eyes.1gram of gold will surely blow your
hand completely off.i used a tinier amount of gold and it hurt me pretty bad,i tried to scrape it off a glass coffee pot with a screw driver.i swear i
did not even get to scratch it when it blew up and was done by the weight of the screw driver alone.a member here thought it was more likely not the
mere contact but the friction of the scratching.do not let it dry then try to scrape it off.i repeat.your gold WILL explode with stout ammonia.
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dieglegold
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Hissingnoise: Sometimes a person receives an offer so generous that it simply leaves one breathless. So, watch your mail for those gold ingots.
Sorry, but I must ship COD since I will be broke after sending them to you. Thank you for your generous offer to help.
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dieglegold
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Cyanureeves, Tdep and others: I have now joined the ranks of those who can prepare fulminating gold, after a 2-month long frustrating journey of
experiments. I am very pleased to have finally succeeded. Here is the back story: I am used to the way that silver acetylide detonates: a very
small pile of that powder explodes violently and loudly when touched with a lit match. The shock wave moves rapidly through the loose pile of powder
such that confinement of the powder is not necessary. So, after reading online that FG is very powerful, I assumed it would behave similarly, namely,
that a small pile will explode when touched with a match. Instead, the powder often just pops and blows away other tiny particles before they all
have a chance to detonate. It was only after I watched the video recommended by Amos this morning that I realized that FG needs to be confined in
order for the quantity to completely detonate. Tdep uses confinement with Al foil to enable the detonation shock wave to travel through the entire
amount of confined powder. So, when I wrapped the powder I had prepared over the past few days, and which I thought had disappointing low power, in
Al foil and heated the foil, it exploded loudly and punctured the foil.
The video that was recommended to me by Amos did the trick; thanks to Tdep and Amos.
Cyanureeves: Your warning about using stout ammonia has me really anxious for the stuff to arrive so I can hopefully achieve the power that you
describe. "Pops" are nice, but big "bangs" are nicer!
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