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Draeger
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What is generally legal or illegal in Germany/EU?
So, since I'm having problems with finding information about what is legal and what is not legal if you are a hobbyist, I guess I just want to ask for
your experiences and/or what you've heard.
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Tsjerk
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One of the more specific questions I have seen today... This question can be answered with only one answer; whatever is not specificied by the law to
be illegal is legal.
Unspecific questions have unspecific answers.
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B(a)P
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This would be a good starting point
https://echa.europa.eu/substances-restricted-under-reach
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G-Coupled
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Quote: Originally posted by Draeger  | | So, since I'm having problems with finding information about what is legal and what is not legal if you are a hobbyist, I guess I just want to ask for
your experiences and/or what you've heard. |
A surprising amount of stuff is perfectly legal for home hobbyists to own and use in the EU, even notoriously 'listed' reagents like Acetic Anhydride
for example.
The trick seems to mainly be finding someone willing to sell these items to you, and a surprising variety of stuff can be found on well known auction
sites etc. for a start, if you look.
[Edited on 2-2-2020 by G-Coupled]
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Draeger
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk | One of the more specific questions I have seen today... This question can be answered with only one answer; whatever is not specificied by the law to
be illegal is legal.
Unspecific questions have unspecific answers. |
Sorry, I just didn't know how to detail it any more than that.
Thanks. I'll take a good look into the list.
| Quote: Originally posted by G-Coupled | | Quote: Originally posted by Draeger | | So, since I'm having problems with finding information about what is legal and what is not legal if you are a hobbyist, I guess I just want to ask for
your experiences and/or what you've heard. |
A surprising amount of stuff is perfectly legal for home hobbyists to own and use in the EU, even notoriously 'listed' reagents like Acetic Anhydride
for example.
The trick seems to mainly be finding someone willing to sell these items to you, and a surprising variety of stuff can be found on well known auction
sites etc. for a start, if you look.
[Edited on 2-2-2020 by G-Coupled] |
Which sites do you know that sell that? I've, so far, only found a single website that sells large amounts of toxic things and more rare chemicals,
but I can't find any other websites.
I was also wondering; which chemicals can you make at home legally? I'm guessing toxic and carcinogenic things would be illegal?
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Tsjerk
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Only very few chemicals are absolutely illegal to produce/pocess. The troubles start when questions are raised about what your intentions are. Did you
make that drug precursor because you were interested in the chemistry or did you make it to produce drugs?
In the EU there are very few examples were the defendant has to prove his innocence. As far as I know owning chemicals does not require proving
innocence.
Summary: as long as you don't make explosives or drugs (both are not allowed, in any amount), and more important; you don't have the intention to do
so, you will be OK.
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Draeger
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk | Only very few chemicals are absolutely illegal to produce/pocess. The troubles start when questions are raised about what your intentions are. Did you
make that drug precursor because you were interested in the chemistry or did you make it to produce drugs?
In the EU there are very few examples were the defendant has to prove his innocence. As far as I know owning chemicals does not require proving
innocence.
Summary: as long as you don't make explosives or drugs (both are not allowed, in any amount), and more important; you don't have the intention to do
so, you will be OK. |
Ah, alright. Thank you!
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sodium_stearate
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Zyklon B
Try getting some of that and watch what happens! 
"Opportunity is missed by most people
because it is dressed in overalls and it
looks like work" T.A. Edison
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B(a)P
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| Quote: Originally posted by Draeger | | Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk | One of the more specific questions I have seen today... This question can be answered with only one answer; whatever is not specificied by the law to
be illegal is legal.
Unspecific questions have unspecific answers. |
Sorry, I just didn't know how to detail it any more than that.
Thanks. I'll take a good look into the list.
| Quote: Originally posted by G-Coupled | | Quote: Originally posted by Draeger | | So, since I'm having problems with finding information about what is legal and what is not legal if you are a hobbyist, I guess I just want to ask for
your experiences and/or what you've heard. |
A surprising amount of stuff is perfectly legal for home hobbyists to own and use in the EU, even notoriously 'listed' reagents like Acetic Anhydride
for example.
The trick seems to mainly be finding someone willing to sell these items to you, and a surprising variety of stuff can be found on well known auction
sites etc. for a start, if you look.
[Edited on 2-2-2020 by G-Coupled] |
Which sites do you know that sell that? I've, so far, only found a single website that sells large amounts of toxic things and more rare chemicals,
but I can't find any other websites.
I was also wondering; which chemicals can you make at home legally? I'm guessing toxic and carcinogenic things would be illegal?
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Toxicity and carcinogenic effect are rarely drivers for regulating compounds.
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karlos³
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All the lice will drop dead?
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Cezium
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sodium_stearate> surprisingly still in production under name "Uragan D2" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zyklon_B#Legacy
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Draeger
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Since there seems to be special regulations on mercury, cadmium and lead, when are those legal or illegal? Sorry if it's obvious, but I really want to
make sure I understood it correctly.
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G-Coupled
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| Quote: Originally posted by Draeger | | Since there seems to be special regulations on mercury, cadmium and lead, when are those legal or illegal? Sorry if it's obvious, but I really want to
make sure I understood it correctly. |
Just don't dispose of them down the kitchen sink, and you'll be fine.
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Draeger
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| Quote: Originally posted by G-Coupled | | Quote: Originally posted by Draeger | | Since there seems to be special regulations on mercury, cadmium and lead, when are those legal or illegal? Sorry if it's obvious, but I really want to
make sure I understood it correctly. |
Just don't dispose of them down the kitchen sink, and you'll be fine. |
Alright. Thank you.
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Tsjerk
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Zyklon B is produced on a multi ton scale every day. It is such an important chemical building block it can't be abonded because of a bad name.
[Edited on 3-2-2020 by Tsjerk]
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sodium_stearate
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Lice
Well they sure put Zyklon B to good use
in Germany in the early 1940s! What with all
of those nasty lice to exterminate, it sure came
in handy!
EDIT(woelen): Serious warning!
This post at best is a very bad joke, which easily
can be interpreted in an extremely wrong way. It
might be something much worse than a very bad
joke. This is a serious warning to "sodium stearate"!
One more such issue and you will be banned
permanently! 
[Edited on 5-2-20 by woelen]
"Opportunity is missed by most people
because it is dressed in overalls and it
looks like work" T.A. Edison
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Tsjerk
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| Quote: Originally posted by sodium_stearate | Well they sure put Zyklon B to good use
in Germany in the early 1940s! What with all
of those nasty lice to exterminate, it sure came
in handy! |
I personally think this is a ban worthy post.
Sodium_stearate is an asshole who hasn't contributed to chemistry for at least a year an
Nothing wrong with HCN as is.
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G-Coupled
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk | | Quote: Originally posted by sodium_stearate | Well they sure put Zyklon B to good use
in Germany in the early 1940s! What with all
of those nasty lice to exterminate, it sure came
in handy! |
I personally think this is a ban worthy post.
Sodium_stearate is an asshole who hasn't contributed to chemistry for at least a year an
Nothing wrong with HCN as is. |
Is it...'hate speech'? {gasp}
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fusso
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| Quote: | | Godwin's law (or Godwin's rule of Hitler analogies)[1][2] is an Internet adage asserting that "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability
of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1";[2][3] that is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough,
sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which effectively the discussion or thread often
ends. |
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sodium_stearate
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off topic stuff now
Why all of the "off topic" stuff all of a sudden?
The O.P. originally asked about the relative legality
of certain chemicals in the E.U. and Germany.
Why all of a sudden the reference to some
delusional leader in history? Where did that come
from?
"Opportunity is missed by most people
because it is dressed in overalls and it
looks like work" T.A. Edison
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woelen
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@sodium_stearate: You've got a moderator warning from me, see your previous post in this thread!
[Edited on 5-2-20 by woelen]
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karlos³
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@woelen, I am sorry, I will abstain from all these off-topic remarks in the future.
@OP: have you checked the supplier site of the SM wiki?
Here: http://www.sciencemadness.org/smwiki/index.php/Lab_suppliers
I am located in the same country and used a lot of them already, they are all fine.
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G-Coupled
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It *did* kinda Godwin TBH.
[Edited on 4-2-2020 by G-Coupled]
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BJ68
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In short:
a) Narcotic Law https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/btmg_1981/ the attachments (Anlagen)
b) GüG Kategorie 1 substances https://www.bfarm.de/DE/Bundesopiumstelle/Grundstoffe/_node....
c) Neue-psychoaktive-Stoffe-Gesetz https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/npsg/
d) Verordnung zur Sanktionsbewehrung gemeinschafts- oder unionsrechtlicher Verordnungen auf dem Gebiet der Chemikaliensicherheit = REACH and Co. https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/chemsanktionsv/index.html...
e) 98/2013 https://www.umweltpakt.bayern.de/chemikalien/recht/eu/362/ex...
with a new regulation https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELE... where now even sulfuric acid is regulated. Not more than 40% for the public....
bj68
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karlos³
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Yeah but we can buy that regulated stuff easily outside of the country, inside of the EU.
We are still able to get almost everything easily.
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