pbmineral
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Looking for a rotary evaporator
Hello,
I recently bought a cheap Büchi condenser and I'm currently looking for a motor (rotavapor R)
Is there anyobody who can help me ?
Thank you very much !
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Phosphor-ing
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Lab X or Ebay
ebay rotovap
Is this what you are looking for?
[Edited on 13-8-2008 by Phosphor-ing]
[Edited on 13-8-2008 by Phosphor-ing]
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" -Ronald Reagan
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pbmineral
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Hello
Yes ! It's exactly what I'm looking for
BUT I live in France and the iutem is in Canada so shipping may be very high (3kg) moreover in France we use a 220V voltage ! But adaptors still exist
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Phosphor-ing
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look at a thread by stoichiometric_steve, he is selling a rotovap. I asked for a price and got an answer in euros so your in luck.
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" -Ronald Reagan
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Klute
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I don't think he is looking for the complete rotovap, only the motor as he already has the condenser, which would save him quite some euros..
\"You can battle with a demon, you can embrace a demon; what the hell can you do with a fucking spiritual computer?\"
-Alice Parr
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piracetam
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I'm also looking to get a rotavapor, and came across this one (an EL-130)
http://i1.ebayimg.com/02/i/001/2b/48/c6bc_1.JPG
http://i2.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/2b/48/c7d0_1.JPG
what I want to know is, does this use a vertical or horizontal condenser? (the vendor wouldn't know)
how much of a pain in the ass is it to get the parts for these?
[Edited on 19-1-2009 by piracetam]
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Sauron
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If all you have is the (diagonal?) condenser, you will need:
A Model R motor head preferably 220V 50 Hz
A Model R stand, preferably a jackstand
A vapor duct preferably with combi-clip and 29/32 joint
A rotary seal and some spare seals
Sample flasks
Receiving flasks
Clamp for receiving flask
Ground glass valve for vacuum control (fits in joint at far end of condenser)
PTFE tube from valve to flask side of vapor duct
Does your condenser have the plastic retaining cap and coiled spring retainer for mounting it to the motor head? If not you will need to get these as
well.
Some of these will never be found on eBay or LabX, and you will need to buy them from a Buchi distributor in France.
You will also need a water bath again preferably 220V 50 Hz.
And a vacuum pump, which can be just an aspirator type, particulkarly if your municipal water supply is nice and cold.
A vacuum controller is a nice luxury.
A McLeod gauge with appropriate scale and or a manometer are good ideas. If you have a digital vacuum controller you do not need the manometer or
McLeod.
----------------
There are two sorts of vertical condenser, actually four sorts
The vertical double coil condenser that fits the R type motor heads
The Dewar vertical condenser that fits same
and the versions of these that fit RE motor heads (actually they fit the distributor heads that go in between) and are used with the reflux glassware,
the Type E descending condenser glassware.
The reflux glassware sucks.
The Type E is great as it defeats frothing and bumping. But Buchi no longer offers this on current models, though they probablt still sell the
glassware.
Re motor heads use a different sealing system than do the R type heads, they do not have a vapor duct per se, or rather the vapor duct is built in to
the distributor head.
[Edited on 20-1-2009 by Sauron]
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piracetam
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so the EL model is decent?
I'd need to get a condenser, probably the shaft as well. I have a Gast DOA-P104 AA (those work just fine with rotavaps) , so the vacuum source is
covered. also have some collection flasks
do I really need the water bath, or can a hotplate with a glass bowl be used?
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not_important
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A glass bowl? Stainless steel or aluminium are better, both from heat transfer and ruggedness.
You want fairly good control of the temperature to avoid excessively fast boiling and all the problems that causes.
On my semi-homebrew one I used a not-so-slow cooker with its heating control ripped out and replaced by a DIY zero crossing triac based control with
temperature sensor. The cooker was an Asian beasty that has larger than normal heater and better than normal thermal insulation.
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Sauron
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The EL model and the later models use the same rotating seal system while the R and its descendants R110 series, RE-111, and so on use a stationary
seal while the vapor duct rotates.
The EL has no rotating duct, instead the duct is built into the distributor head. The distributor head has a 45/40 female joint on top and takes the
vertical double coil and the Dewar condensers interchangeably. The recovery flask mates to bottom of distributor head.
This setip permits reflux operations on rotavap. Or normal use (no reflux) selectively. There is a valve to opt for reflux.
Sample flasks are flanged and are retained by a collar and seal gasket. Or an adapter allows use of normal Buchi sample flasks.
EL models are nice if you need reflux, or if you evaporate a lot of problem solvents like toluene that are prone to bump or froth.
Otherwise the R type is a better choice.
The Type E glass is more common on 20 L Buchis and larger. Buchi makes rotavaps up to 100 L.
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piracetam
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hey sauron, have you received any info from Buchi reps on older equipment (i.e. a parts list, spec sheets etc.)?
I joined the Buchi community to request such info, I read in another thread that you said they still support their older equipment.
i just won this
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=18032...
[Edited on 20-1-2009 by piracetam]
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Sauron
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The EL130 is the EL version of R110 which was next model after original Model R.
Sold during 1970s I think. Last of the non-electronic Buchi rotavaps. As of the sucedding series, RE-111 etc, Bichi put in printed circuit boards to
operate gigital rpm displays and optional temperature displays. The downside is that when these pcb's die so does the rotavap. But R and R110, EL and
EL130 are not like that, only electronic component is a can type capacitor for motor start. They last approximately forever.
YES I have lots of Buchi brochures and support documents, parts lists, exploded drawings,, etc, and I just have to dig them out, scan them and can
upload for you.
I guess you want the ones pertinent to EL130 and its glassware options.
You can have reflux setup with dry ice Dewar condenser, same with vertical dbl-coil condenser, or Type E descending condenser for troublesome
solvents like toluene that froth or bump.
The regular glassware does not fit on EL/EL130
I own two of these.
eBay has taken down info on the auction, now no one can see pics but you. Did you get a complete rotavap or just motor head?
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piracetam
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just the motor head
(it should be still up, just gotta scroll down)
it was an auction for those two pics I posted a few posts up.
final (and only) bid was 19.99 USD
[Edited on 21-1-2009 by piracetam]
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Sauron
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You stole it.
However, you now need the jackstand, maybe the mating oart that fixes the motor head to the upright tube of the jackstand, a water bath, and a set of
EL type glassware of one of the three types I described above.
Distributor heads do come up for sale sometimes but people rarely know what they are and so misdescribe the,. If you spot one from photo you can
usually get it cheap. The rest of the glassware is another matter. If from Buchi, $$$. Easily $1-$2 thousand.
Yeah you can improvise a water bath BUT once you have all that $$$ invested in the glass you will be happier with the correct matching bath, which has
overflow protection and a thermostated temp control. You ought to be able to find one once you know what they look oike and the model number for
$100-$300 which will not repreent a great increase in your overall investment.
Remember the EL sample flasks are not same as the R type sample flasks. They are flanged. There is a special wrench for tightening ( and loosening)
the collar for this flange. Buy it, you will need it.
Recovery flasks are same 35/20 socket ground (spherical) joint. You need a matching spring loaded clamp with screw stop.
There is an adapter to allow use of R type sample flasks which you can get if you really must. In USA they sell 24/20 but in EU 29/32, the larger
joint is better and Buchi flasks are stronger. They are also very on center, while a non Buchi flask may turn out to be rather eccentric and will
cause problems in rotation.
Let go look at your pics.
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piracetam
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I figured it was a steal.
(you wanna talk about a steal, look at this one http://www.abbott-ir.com/program/fixedPriceMod.cfm?do=detail...
though I'm wondering if the electronics are shot, or if the condenser is cracked )
I know the glass won't be as cheap, and I know exactly which distributor head you're talking about; you described the orientation well enough in a
previous post, and I did some searches, so I know what to look for.
I probably will get a buchi water bath, but may improvise on a stand, something that's a bit tougher to find
I like the fact that the EL can double as a reflux app, but am wondering if I set myself up for misery, trying to find matching parts
[Edited on 21-1-2009 by piracetam]
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piracetam
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oh sweet..glad I joined the Buchi community, and asked for info
here's what they sent me
Attachment: R-110_120_130_efd_reduced.pdf (1.7MB)
This file has been downloaded 824 times
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Sauron
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Cool! Saves me the trouble of finding and scanning mine.
I have 2 R-110's 2 EL-130s, half a dozen Model R's, and an R-151 20 liter industrial model.
How did I end up with such a glut of rotavaps?
Long story and not really about chemistry. I used them to make absinthe.
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piracetam
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i'd imagine it left the glass all green 
*shudders* bitter stuff, that absinthe is.
so it seems the EL can be fitted with a soxhlet attachment.. i bet that is an obscure piece, which probably needs to be purchased through buchi (?)
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Sauron
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Not at all, unless you have been tasting the wrong sort. The macerated and undistilled sort as made in Andorra are bitter but that was not the way
real Belle Epoch absinthe was made, the stuff was always distilled. More modern (and until recently illegal) absinthe like Swiss La Bleu made and sold
in Neuchatel area (Jura, near Pontarlier) is not at all bitter. Jade absinthe made by my former partner in Pontarlier is not bitter. He makes it in
antique copper absinthe alembics in one of the last two absinthe distilleries still extant. For that matter Pernod is back to making absinthe, not
just pastis, but there is as you may no, no real connection except the name, between the old Pernod Fils and the modern Pernod Ricard. Pernod went out
of business in 1957, their old factory in Paris is now Bestle. Ricard bought the rights to the name in the 1970s. Contemparary "Pernod" absinthe I am
afraid is not very good in my opinion. Pernod Ricard does not care, absinthe is a niche market and P-R is a vast conglomerate with other fish to fry.
Authentic absinthe recreating the best of the Belle Epoch labels like Pernod, and a few others, is floral, finely balanced, bottled at 68-72 degree,
and made from only alcohol of grape origin, pure water and fine herbs. It has a lot in common with green Chartreuse, only no angelica. The color must
be natural herbal chlorophyll, no dye. and when done right is peridot green. It is bottled in dark Bordeaux one liter bottles, and corked (special
corks for high proof) then sealed over the cork. The traditional seal was lead, no longer permitted.
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piracetam
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the wife brought a bottle of La Fée 68% from london.
trying to remember if it was that one that was bitter, or the trash I once tried to make from wormwood and vodka.
It's an acquired taste, no doubt, and the alpha-thujone's pharm. effects are counter-intuitive to alcohol's, hence the more lucid inebriation.
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Sauron
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La Fee Verte is very similar to the new Pernod absinthe: obviously artificically colored and indifferently flavored. It is not as bad as Sebor's
(Martin Sebor in Prague was a chemist but killed himsel.f a few years ago.) And few are as bad as Hill's which is Czech sheep dip. Then there's some
stuff from Ibiza, radioactive looking green and monochromatic taste of star anise. Ugh.
I wrote the "Absinthe & Thujone" page fopr Oxford University's Chem Dept website's Molecule of the Month a long time ago.
Wormwood (A.absinthium) is actually a minor herb in absinthe despite the name, and the thujone content is in single digit ppm (by EU regulation <10
mg/Kg) When distilled the oils come over while the bitter principles remain in the pot, till at the end when the distallate starts to turn milky the
bitters start coming over and if you let any of that get into the absinthe, it will be bitter. The trick is knowing when to make the cut.
My partner spent years reverse engineering absinthe by GCMS study of antique premium Belle Epoque bottles still sealed. He drew small aliquots through
the cork with a syringe. From this work he was able to deduce the real herbs used by the top 3-4 Franco-Suisse makers and the type of alcohol used.
The history of absinthe is inseperable from that of the phylloxera blight.
Henri Pernod was Swiss. and his first distillery was in the Jura. But his main market was French, and the import duty was high. So he relocated to
Pontarlier! Clever these Swiss. The Swiss were the first to ban absinthe, a campaign led by the Blue Cross temperance movement, church based, and the
eau-du-vie makers from the German speaking cantons who regarded the Francophone absintheurs in Neuchatel as upstarts.
The French were the last to ban it in 1915, the campaign had been going on for decades funded by the wine industry who wanted their customers back
once they defeated the phylloxera. The government also wanted to sober the population up to fight the Germans. So the Vaud Commission banned all
herbal liqueurs (but a few years later the monastic liqueurs like DOM and Chartreuse were quiety exempted.) Pernod moved its absinthe operation to
Spain (where the drink was never illegal).
An interesting side note: when Chartreuse Diffusion succeeded in popularizing that liqueur, the government became envious of the profits and
nationalized the Carthusian distillery. The monks decamped to Spain. The government chemists and botanists were never able to duplicate the process
and their product failed. Eventually they went bankrupt and the townspeople of Grenoble bought up the property and gave it back to the Carthusians.
Production at the original site resumed. I suppose when God is on your side...
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