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sbillinghurst
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I hope I am not doing something frowned upon. Please allow me to change it if it doesn't meet the guidelines. On the subject of Reagents and
Apparatus Acquisition, I need to put down the words sourcing meth code 1234, and then I am going to try to Google it. If it returns this post, the
experiment was successful.
When you get here, go to the first post in this thread for a given list (I can't say if it's a good list. I don't think it covers sources in the US).
The whole idea is to replace objectionable speech with a code standing for that speech, so that the speech is in fact expressed and not suppressed or
self-suppressed.
This is language and we are human beings. I believe that we should distinguish between a description of something and its condemnation or
recommendation.
I am getting the infuriating cursor jump with every character, maybe as a result of a long post in 'quick reply'.
Yeah, we're human beings. Language was invented some time ago to make it possible to discuss rather than to perform an act. I just don't see anything
on the internet that is other than information. No chemicals are forthcoming out of a computer, just words.
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Magpie
lab constructor
Posts: 5939
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Location: USA
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Mood: Chemistry: the subtle science.
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Your whole process is frowned upon as far as I'm concerned. You've taken a labor of love from "I am a fish" and made it the bait for those who need
meth supplies.
Thinking through something is a rehersal for action. Don't give us that crap about words not being important.
The single most important condition for a successful synthesis is good mixing - Nicodem
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sbillinghurst
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Magpie wrote
Your whole process is frowned upon as far as I'm concerned. You've taken a labor of love from "I am a fish" and made it the bait for those who need
meth supplies.
Fine, that's what I asked. Now on to the act itself. To prove I did no such thing, let us ask, Cui bono? That means, "Who gains from it?" I
maintain that I gain nothing. I'm not "fishing" using "bait" for meth makers. Since I have nothing to gain from that, I encourage readers to treat
this statement with a healthy dose of skepticism.
Because there are intentions, and there are consequences beside the intended consequence, a lot of times people like you are cruel "for a reason"
when, admit it, your whole intent is to be cruel. You used Fish as a pawn in your personal attack on me.
The experiment worked just fine, BTW, as of now. It takes half a day for Google to index the post, and I can search 'sourcing meth code 1234' and
return this site high in the results. I don't care what you do now. Take it down if you want. Let's see how the search engine handles that.
Every action starts with a thought, sure, but not every thought comes out as action. That's just silly.
You have been gratuitously cruel, while justifying yourself. You thought you were kind. You were defending someone. Aww, does he need you to do
that? But, cruelty often starts that way. That's the road you are on, brother.
I guess there's nothing that penetrates to the core on you guys, which is surprising given the dedication to a life of science. They're holding
Wikileaks' founder now. I guess you side with the State on that one. Don't you wonder what else hackers can do, like, when they cover secrets instead
of expose them? You are home laboratory operators, and exactly those people have been persecuted in this "hunt" for drug makers. Is it worth it? I
mean, look at it as them getting destroyed today, and tomorrow, why, turn around and find it is you. Because, it stems from freedom. You don't get
it. By its nature, no-one has the right to give it to you. Freedom is something you give yourself. 
Oh, it says that is "cool". That must be frowned upon here, too. Y'all call us "kewls". Uh huh. But jeez, who are you guys? pix please. kthxbai
My "process". Well, my man, if I never said words were not important (I said they were not chemicals), and you said I said that, does your mind
change one iota being wrong about that? I don't think so, and that's sad. You must have a strange and cruel, not to say logical, agenda. You just
have to, and it is not based on something I said here today, but rather something of a long-standing hatred, and I do not deserve to walk into a
fusillade of abuse.
What are the words? That---language---allows us to think before (or instead of) acting, among other things, which is good. That's what it is there
for. It's very important, it's everything, and I never said words were not important. You did, with a little metaphor, "crap", a little fiction, and
managing to twist what I said by 180 degrees.
Don't laugh. I'm on the high moral ground here.
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Magpie
lab constructor
Posts: 5939
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Location: USA
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Mood: Chemistry: the subtle science.
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Whoa Nellie! I write 4 sentences and all that vitriol is unleashed. I'll bet you could write a set of encyclopedias based on the 2500 plus posts I
have made. 
[Edited on 16-12-2010 by Magpie]
The single most important condition for a successful synthesis is good mixing - Nicodem
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sbillinghurst
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Exactly. Why would we just go back and forth and not talk about chemistry? It's just impossible! I was drunk and I panicked, but the "vitriol", it
was not like that. When I saw your four miserable lines, it set off another challenge, I had the adrenaline pumping. I felt fear. Let's give that
out and consider how more reaction can necessarily derive from the insult, not how many words are put into it. We aren't weighing the words to say
they are evenly matched. Fuck, I'm doing it again.
If I say I am interested in how the big boys get away with it, you won't think I am trying to traffic in drugs. See, that is what usually happens.
You have to separate someone bringing up the subject from someone putting a plan into action.
I'm sorry if I was recruited for the drug trade here in San Diego. That was a long time ago. My experience and yours might be different because of
the demand. I don't see how you can have a home lab and keep paying for experiments.
It wasn't vitriol. Votriol is sulfuric acid. You were speaking in code again.
Now, how do the drug cartel hackers break into computers and have tons of raw materials shipped? Or, is the biz still conducted in secret by willing
participants, the shadowy figures?
Can the time be far off when drugs are made anonymously and automatically, and the human only enters the equation as a user?
When the petroleum starts running out, civilization will fold up like a circus, and all the science won't stop that catastrophe.
The medico-legal complex is an offshoot of the old theocracy, that's why the rights, responsibilities, mind, brain, insanity, suicide, and so forth is
important, because there is no God and it is all wrong.
You guys are thinkers. What would be the proper experiment design whose purpose is to probe the weak points in the supply chain?
As long as everybody's rich, poor people don't need to be junkies, but all that luxury is contained in a pill, so is it a viable alternative to
creating a huge carbon footprint to have fun and live the good life?
I know, it is bad to be high on drugs,. They have String Theory now, so they are saying stuff like, "There are five other worlds besides this one."
Okay, so let's visit them. Otherwise, theories just seem like a sign that society is getting further and further from reality and, not that it will
fail, so much as that it's overdue for becoming annhilated due to just cause.
I was telling myself, "Now, Steve, don't go on these web sites and talk sourcing", and I wonder, "Well, if mankind survives, it's because somewhere
along the line ppl had the courage to call a spade a spade."
Constructing labs is a necessary but insufficient part of answering the right questions. We may observe opposing views calling different things
science.
We are not so far apart, Mr. Pie, you and I. Actually, you took my line: "Gee, you really are harrassing me, just like a magpie." But, I am going to
look at some of those 2500 posts. I want to see if you are the guy with the fine lab pix, the "tour my lab" guy. Oh yeah, you are. I checked. My
commendations, sir, on an excellent set-up. You aren't just here running security. That thing has been sitting in your house for years? So, what is
the rate of use on that? Like I say, it would cost a fortune to keep full of experiments.
I worked as a chemist, but at the same time, I was just a person trying to support a family, so, there's nothing to be proud of. It is improper to
expect compensation for doing your hobby. I'm not Paul McCartney. He can afford to downplay his career.
The USA is big. I'm down here thisclose to Mexico, and the word is that "unspeakable horror" is just across the border, 30,000 killed since Calderon
took office in 2006. There was $200 million found in the house of Ye Gon, and he was a pseudoephedrine supplier to Mexico. That means the role of
methamphetamine in all this is unprecedented, and they used to say that speed could not suport a huge network infrastructure like heroin. They were
dead wrong.
We had the formula here. I was willing to have it go there. There were too many dwellings being ruined in the course of, now how can we change the
appalling loss of life? Wars do not end with the forces causing them still in place. We will soon have a completely failed state next door. That's
because methamphetamine is long-term. The corruption has forever to chip away until the society heads inexorably for a stable state, anarchy.
Sorry to get verbose. Hope you didn't have anywhere to be. Ah, to be forty again! Naw, it is time to put a lot of cops in jail, and for that we
need a pretty convincing manifesto.
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chochu3
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why not just PM all this to each other?
\"Abiding in the midst of ignorance, thinking themselves wise and learned, fools go aimlessly hither and thither, like blind led by the blind.\" -
Katha Upanishad
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Jon_Swars
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A source of Urea can be had at truck stops where it is sold in a 33% water solution for going into trucks.
Jon
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Neil
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WTF? No one calls a spade a spade, if you ever hear someone call a spade a spade tell them straight up that "No, it is a shovel" cause if someone is
going around calling spades spades, they're up to something.
On the note of readily available chemicals, I've been tramping all over but it seems all local pharmacies have all dropped Saltpeter (I feel like this
is the end of an era). I have a pharmacy bottle of KNO3, S and a few other things that I bought only a few years ago. Now relics of another time.... a
time when chemical wasn't just a scary word....
They've also stopped carrying Boric acid in all but a few places where they sell it to people who want it for killing ants. I think it's USP it's sold
as a wound disinfectant. It cost as much for 125g as I then paid for 4Kgs of borax. Some people really spoil their ants.
They clearly don't sell sulfur and all those other nice little things that they still did just a few years back.
And last but not least I gave up on trying to find KNO3 and so I searched for cold packs with ammonium nitrate, they've all suddenly switched to urea.
I couldn't even find distilled water... whats wrong with this place?!
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digitalemu
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JD Photochem has not existed since 2006... Updae your lists.....
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digitalemu
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Quote: Originally posted by Neil  | | Quote: Originally posted by sbillinghurst | | They've also stopped carrying Boric acid in all but a few places where they sell it to people who want it for killing ants. I think it's USP it's sold
as a wound disinfectant. It cost as much for 125g as I then paid for 4Kgs of borax. Some people really spoil their ants. |
It's commercialism..... Why would they make a $3 container of Boric acid available when they can sell some bottle filled with who knows what for $15.
Better yet for the manufacturer if they take that same borax and boric acid, put it in a bottle with a pretty label with cartoon ants, and then make
a massive profit on that bottle of the same raw ingredients you used to be able to buy on their own. That 25 cents of raw material can be sold for
$15 or more! I still see Borax around at the occasional grocery store, but even that is becomming rare especially at the large grocery store chains.
They would rather make the big profits from a laundry detergent that tells you its got superior cleaning power(Probably because they put Borax in it)
than sell you a 3$ box of Borax which can boost the cleaning power or a cheapo box of noname detergent. Cold packs and ammonium nitrate? Mostly all
gone now as they think some terrorist will buy a whole bunch of em and do something bad. Potassium Nitrate, same thing... These days if you want
raw materials, you really have to dig.... |
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overload
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Mood: miserable fat slave
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| Quote: Originally posted by sbillinghurst | | Exactly. Why would we just go back and forth and not talk about chemistry? It's just impossible! I was drunk and I panicked, but the "vitriol", it
was not like that. When I..... |
I would hate to be stuck in the same room as this guy..
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manofsteele
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Amazon.com for chemicals
Hello everyone. I hope I am not repeating a question that has already been answered.
I was looking around on Amazon.com recently and I discovered that they sell chemicals.
Has anyone bought chemicals off of Amazon.com? If so, how was your experience and do they ship to a home address?
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DieForelle
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Well, since it's come up, I'll say I have ordered from an Amazon reseller. Further details not to be disclosed. Nothing you can't buy at a hardware
store, but I wanted a safe-to-consume (in very small quantities!) for a food/dietary supplement formulation experiment I was doing. (and no, it
isn't psychoactive...) My interests are different from most people here. I've done the igniting cool stuff gig when I was teenager - not to imply
anybody is immature for wanting to do it as an adult. But it's out of my system, however I completely respect what should be the right of people to
do this kind of hobby if they so desire. But I almost wish the tip about amazon wasn't posted here. Why? It seems like "people willing to sell
certain chemicals to individuals" go through a kind of cycle: it starts with wanting to make money that way, being willing to take on the risks, and
to widely varying degrees (i.e., 0 to 100, not 15 to 75) having cognizance of the possible diversion of their product to whatever illicit activities.
For example, not to besmirch him if I'm wrong, but my general understanding is the Science Alliance guy in TX was knowingly selling organics that had
little use other than as not-yet-watched-by-DEA precursors. Eventually, one of several things happen: they either get big enough that they decide
just to deal with "legit" business, they majorly f--- up in some way and get shut down or punished, or they just go out of business. Because it seems
to be a low margin business, really. And there's always the risk Amazon's lawyers just start freaking out and tell their sellers they can't resell
anything requiring a HAZMAT or ORM-D shipment. Easy to imagine: some misguided 14 year old lurker here orders some acid "from Amazon", burns himself
because he doesn't know how to safely handle it, suddenly, REAL bad publicity problem for amazon.
I have found ways to get most things I want, but it's been a real PITA. I have a reseller for a couple of the major lab chem. suppliers that I buy
from, but I'm not going to say who it is. For all I know, they only deal with me now because I gave them a fairly big order back in the early 2000s,
I think if you just called them up and asked "do you sell to individuals" they would probably say no. I wish Aldrich were easier to order from, but
they don't seem to be interested in having a reseller network, a few members of whom can bend "the rules", versus the other companies. And I worry
how long the other companies will be interested in the latter business model. We'll see. For Spectrum it was probably a necessity; when I worked in
a corporate research lab in the 90s, Spectrum was kind of considered a joke whose chemicals were only suitable for making cleaning solutions. They do
have a nice variety, and I'd rather trust a USP grade chemical I might ingest to them than to some random ebay seller, even if I have to pay 5X as
much.
See my post under "graingers for supply" for further thoughts on this.
[Edited on 2-4-2012 by DieForelle]
[Edited on 2-4-2012 by DieForelle]
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Digital Hepatitis
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It's generally a good idea to dry/purify all of these as much as possible, but look at what you can easily get in pure form.
And just so you fellas don't think I'm just being a tease, I'll more or less give these out. The bottom line is that I don't think a lot of people on
the forum are looking hard enough... I mean, if you wanna distill ethyl acetate from fingernail polish remover or whatever that's fine, but that's
something that is very easily procurable with absolutely no suspicion at all.
Heptane -- "adhesion promoter 42" and "ef accelerator 58"
Cyclohexane -- "zeroing fluid"
Nitroethane -- "cyanoacrylate remover". Also 50-100% of some European nail removers.
Nitromethane -- "debonder solvent"
N-methyl-2-pyrrolidine -- "spray foam equipment cleaner"
DCM -- "acrylic adhesive 125" and 'equipment flushing solvent 11'. Also 100% of at least one toy/model glue not that long ago.
THF -- "conformal coating remover"
Anhydrous IPA -- from electronics stores
Really, there's almost no solvent (except for maybe diethyl ether and dimethylformamide) that you can't procure completely innocuously (and even those
two are not at all impossible to get.) True, there's been a few changes in the last decade or so (my local photo shop doesn't carry glacial acetic
acid anymore, for instance) but it's probably easier than ever to get basic reagents.
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ItsAChitzen
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sbillinghurst, I feel like you have clearly spent too much time with your own chemicals.
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SM2
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well, methylacrylate co-polymer is no longer available as those water beads/diaper absorber prills. it's now some sodium acrylate blende with poly
acrylic acid
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Digital Hepatitis
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Another good one
"super glue cyanoacrylate debonder remover" that is 100% dimethylformamide.
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tetrahedron
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very nice find Digital Hepatitis (although pricey at $10 for 100mL). msds
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Glucose Oxidase
Harmless
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Registered: 31-12-2012
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Mood: Researching Alchemy
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Potassium Sulphite
Formula: Na2SO3
Synonyms: –
Suppliers
• Some alternative photographic suppliers sell it.
Photographers' Formulary (USA)
the formula is wrong please correct it
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declined
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| Quote: Originally posted by Zinc | | I don't understand how can someone buy picric acid online, perhaps you need some "explosives license" to buy? I somehow doubt they would sell it to
anyone. |
I bought a pretty gigantic jar from Sigma last year, and had it shipped to my university .
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palico
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For european customers I advice one website for glassware apparatus:
http://www.spaziani.com/
They have typical apparatus and on request they build special for you.
And for chemicals:
http://www.farmaciavernile.it/
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Zephyr
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4-Aminobenzoic acid is sold at pharmacies for weight loss.
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roXefeller
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Noticed at Meijer today that the instant cold compresses they sell are labeled as ammonium nitrate on the box, but urea on the bag. Inside they are
definitely urea.
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Artemus Gordon
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Calcium Hydroxide
I just bought 3.25 oz. of food grade Ca(OH)2 for $1.99. I am in SF Bay Area (California, USA).
It was at a mexican supermarket called Mi Pueblo. The Mexican term for it is "Cal" and it can be found in the spices aisle.
I confirmed it is real hydroxide and not carbonate (garden "lime" is often carbonate) by making lime water and confirming that it gets cloudy when
CO2 is bubbled through it.
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Mesa
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A potential Australian online shop I found a few weeks ago:
http://www.auschems.com
It seems too good to be true and I have a suspicion that this may just be the case. The website is registered to an address that doesn't exist in the
postcode specified(possibly a typo though.)
On the other hand, the email address is also registered to a user on a UK Pyro's forum, and the sheer variety of chemicals listed that are generally
unavailable to the public makes me tempted to try a test order.
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