Diurea
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Cryo Refrigerated Well ... thingy
I was hoping one of you guys could help me. I saw random picture of someone with a typical distillation setup except there receiving flask had an
electronic cooling device. I assume it was refrigerated. It would be like a heating mantle except cold.
Anyone know what you call such a thing?
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DavidJR
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Refrigerated cold trap.
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Dr.Bob
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They make Cold plates that use Peltier cooling to chill a small metal plate.
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njl
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Cryogenic cooling. I remember applied science using a real cryo machine in his anhydrous ammonia video. The more accessible option is usually dry ice
in a suitable liquid (acetone or alcohol usually). Very useful and very cheap.
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Diurea
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Thanks for all replies. If anyone comes up with a link. Please post. I’ll try and find the picture again. I am going to say it’s not a perkier
junction because it seemed like it was in place of doing dry ice so it would be outside temp range of a peltier.
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DavidJR
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Quote: Originally posted by njl  | | Cryogenic cooling. I remember applied science using a real cryo machine in his anhydrous ammonia video. The more accessible option is usually dry ice
in a suitable liquid (acetone or alcohol usually). Very useful and very cheap. |
Only more accessible if you live somewhere that you can easily get dry ice. I wish I could just waltz into a shop and pick some up. But I can't. If I
want dry ice, I would have to order it online, at ridiculously high prices, and of course you can't really store it long. That or the fire
extinguisher method, I suppose...
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Tdep
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I'd be very interested in a Peltier cooled flask container thing, if a good one exists. Even just to freezing, it would be very convenient to have for
example a vacuum pump trap just be plugged into the wall and go cold each time you turn on your pump, not having to try and get ice and replace the
ice and get an icebath etc etc
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Diurea
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Hmmm...
Pricey but could be an interesting mod
Whynter ICM-15LS Ice Cream Maker, Stainless Steel
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004N8KD5M/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_c_api_i...
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violet sin
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Not sure if this is what you mean
https://www.labdepotinc.com/p-63202-thermo-scientific-ek-imm...
If money were free ^^^, at least the shipping is only 40$
You can find old models on sale if your lucky or know where to look. I ended up with one of these on random chance of stopping by a thrift store.
80$. Thing weighs over a hundred pounds easy, not fun to load. I really lucked out, he bought an auction from Chico state University, and it
languished in his shop till I walked away.
NESLAB CC-100 IMMERSION COOLER
The specs say -25°C to -90°C with the lower being a no load stat.
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unionised
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Something like 4 : 30
here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_DD2_7QkRk
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S.C. Wack
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One would want to take a close look at the specs. A typical Peltier has little ability to transfer heat under ideal conditions. Perhaps the newer
models use fans instead of water. Something with a metal bottom and insulation might get pretty cold, but it'll take a while. Some sort of "thermal
grease" is almost necessary with glass.
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XeonTheMGPony
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if you can do quality soldering (Brazing preferred you can make a -80c cold trap
Attachment: Alcohol_Cold_Trap.pdf (684kB)
This file has been downloaded 318 times
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S.C. Wack
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tdep | | Even just to freezing, it would be very convenient to have for example a vacuum pump trap just be plugged into the wall and go cold each time you turn
on your pump, not having to try and get ice and replace the ice and get an icebath etc etc |
Labconco makes a basic refrigerated cold or colder trap for their centrivap evaporator, and the cannabis distiller bro supplier industry has a
modified baffled KF insert for the current version of it. These are a bit pricey new, but it seems that's what they can charge.
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Diurea
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Unionised Nailed It
@Unionised Nailed it. You can see why I was looking at ice cream makers now lol. I even though you could modify the ice cream mixer for a stir bar...
can’t think of a use though.
I can’t seem to find whatever that thing is called though ?? Love to find one for sale (although the cost may be upward). Got a name? I got to get
my headset to listen to video..
@Violet Sin - I like the immersion cooler. But for my needs I’ve modified a 5 gallon bucket with a copper coil in it in a half size freezer (used
from ebay). 0deg is cold enough. Just tired of going through ice really on recirculating water. I have to use antifreeze in my water (pure oversight
second time I used inside pipe froze).
I have an idea for recirculating ethanol in dry ice for really cold efficient condensing. I figure ethanol might be pump seal friendly (unlike
acetone). Anyway I’m hijacking my own thread, off subject.
[Edited on 24-6-2020 by Diurea]
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Refinery
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I remember there was a discussion about reefed cold traps sometime ago.
In that topic it was stated that the capacity of ordinary chest freezer pump can easily be exceeded, but this can be compensated by filling the
freezer with large thermal mass, in order to buffer the temp. Freezing 100 liters of CaCl2 solution to -35C gradually over time creates huge buffer,
which can be used to cool down quite large coolant masses. The lid can be changed into an insulating panel for throughputs for circulating tubes.
Anything that boils down to -30C should be able to be condensed with such setup, because condenser tubing can be elongated, compensating the low
temperature difference.
Cheapest chest freezer (100L volume) goes for $99 and it freezes 9kg per 24h, or 375g/h, or ~0.1g/s. Whenever I get a space for my lab, I will invest
into one whenever I need cryogenic coolant.
Not sure if ordinary aquarium pumps can handle -35C liquids, though.
Problem with dry ice is that for most people it is hard to obtain and extremely expensive compared to unit per use. A single procedure can easily cost
50 bucks including shipping and handling of the ice, and the procedure will be time sensitive from the moment the dry ice is handed over, because it
sublimes in no time. Even larger bulks of it can only last for a couple of days in well insulated boxes.
[Edited on 24-6-2020 by Refinery]
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Diurea
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Freezer comment - that’s exactly what I’d do. I take a five gallon bucket with 1/2” copper tubing spiraled from top to bottom. The base of the
tubing (output tube) takes a 90 degree upward turn to meet back with input tube and both tubes exit through holes I put in the freezer. Unfortunately
it takes some forethought and disassembling to figure out where to put the holes to miss the coils in the freezer. I fill the bucket with water
(thermal mass). Takes two days to really freeze solid.
First time I ran. Worked great. Second time or attempt rather I realized I left water in the pipe... oops. Antifreeze is your friend. Plus automotive
green stuff makes your condenser look cool under black light....
Regard to pump cold ethanol. - I had the same concern about the pond pump and frigid temps. If I ever try I’ll definitely post. My first thoughts
are viscosity would be fine for ethanol at that temp and I’m purely guessing on corrosion or breaking down seals. Hard to say material selection,
glues if any, etc during manufacturing. I don’t think cold alone is enough to damage anything in that style impeller pump. Please point out
anything you think I’m missing.
Agree on dry ice cost although I just run to the local grocery store.
Thank you guys for all your input.
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Refinery
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CaCl2 is good coolant and used in food industry. Corrosion is issue for what it matters.
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XeonTheMGPony
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why I prefer glycol secondary loops.
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Diurea
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Freezer comment - that’s exactly what I’d do. I take a five gallon bucket with 1/2” copper tubing spiraled from top to bottom. The base of the
tubing (output tube) takes a 90 degree upward turn to meet back with input tube and both tubes exit through holes I put in the freezer. Unfortunately
it takes some forethought and disassembling to figure out where to put the holes to miss the coils in the freezer. I fill the bucket with water
(thermal mass). Takes two days to really freeze solid.
First time I ran. Worked great. Second time or attempt rather I realized I left water in the pipe... oops. Antifreeze is your friend. Plus automotive
green stuff makes your condenser look cool under black light....
Regard to pump cold ethanol. - I had the same concern about the pond pump and frigid temps. If I ever try I’ll definitely post. My first thoughts
are viscosity would be fine for ethanol at that temp and I’m purely guessing on corrosion or breaking down seals. Hard to say material selection,
glues if any, etc during manufacturing. I don’t think cold alone is enough to damage anything in that style impeller pump. Please point out
anything you think I’m missing.
Agree on dry ice cost although I just run to the local grocery store.
Thank you guys for all your input.
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Heptylene
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A recirculating chiller? Refrigerated bath?
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Refinery
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The freezer cannot sustain refrigeration on long run, but if it's filled with 100kg of -35C ice, it'll take quite a while to bring that over 0C.
Of course any cryogenic trap should only be used directly for this only purpose. Circulating high temp coolant would be just plain stupid.
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