SgtAltek
Harmless
Posts: 4
Registered: 20-1-2017
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Thermal Decomposition of TCCA
Hey all! I was wondering what the products of the thermal decomposition of TCCA would be. I was thinking NCl3, but I'm not really sure. I've also
heard it can decompose to Cl2 and Cyanuric Acid.
Besides that, are there any other interesting uses for TCCA besides a Cl2 generator with HCl? I use that quite a lot to produce iodine from KI haha.
Thanks.
|
|
|
gdflp
|
Thread Moved
12-8-2017 at 22:12 |
CRUSTY
Hazard to Others
Posts: 139
Registered: 5-6-2016
Location: Nearby
Member Is Offline
Mood: High-Order
|
|
Google is your friend. 
The MSDS attached lists the thermal decomposition products as chlorine, nitrogen, nitrogen trichloride, cyanogen chloride, "oxides of carbon", and
phosgene.
Cyanuric acid however, is a result of exposure to water or moisture, not thermal decomposition.
Attachment: 178537_145241928.pdf (118kB)
This file has been downloaded 3159 times
|
|
|
VSEPR_VOID
National Hazard
Posts: 719
Registered: 1-9-2017
Member Is Offline
Mood: Fullerenes
|
|
Wow, that does not sound like something we want decomposing. Considering how much labor goes into preventing terrorists from making chemical weapons,
imagine the damage that could be done with phosgene generated from TCCA. Just condense the phsogene with cold water and store it.
|
|
|
Assured Fish
Hazard to Others
Posts: 319
Registered: 31-8-2015
Location: Noo Z Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Misanthropic
|
|
| Quote: |
Just condense the phsogene with cold water and store it
|
Are you insane, phosgene for one boils at 8*C making condensation with even ice water, extremely difficult.
Then the idea of storing it, i doubt anyone would want to store it given that it exothermically decomposes on contact with water, which would drive it
to evaporate and build up pressure inside any container you have put it in. This would mean that you would need to dry the phosgene before storage and
likely store it inside an ampule.
Remember that one of the decomposition products of TCCA is H2O which makes drying an absolute necessity.
In fact phosgene is likely to only be a minor byproduct of the decomposition of TCCA which would by itself make the idea of generating phosgene from
from TCCA futile.
A better option would be to simply avoid decomposing TCCA and in the case where you needed phosgene for preparing thionyl chloride or whatever, then
it would be a far better idea (albeit and insane idea) to prepare it via the oxidation of chloroform.
|
|
|
ninhydric1
Hazard to Others
Posts: 345
Registered: 21-4-2017
Location: Western US
Member Is Offline
Mood: Bleached
|
|
And then there's chlorine and cyanogen chloride. Chlorine I might work with, but no way in h*** will I work with cyanogen chloride. Only if I had a
respirator, oxygen tank, cyanide antidote kit, a fume hood with maximum venting ability, and quick exit from the lab would I work with cyanogen
chloride.
|
|
|
nezza
Hazard to Others
Posts: 324
Registered: 17-4-2011
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: phosphorescent
|
|
And of course NCl3 is another really benign agent. It explodes if you look at it wrong and has maimed some famous chemists in the past.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5126
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
The thermal decomposition products listed in MSDS are usually a guess, rather then the result of experiment.
I doubt the yield of phosgene is any good.
|
|
|
VSEPR_VOID
National Hazard
Posts: 719
Registered: 1-9-2017
Member Is Offline
Mood: Fullerenes
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by Assured Fish  |
| Quote: |
Just condense the phsogene with cold water and store it
|
Are you insane, phosgene for one boils at 8*C making condensation with even ice water, extremely difficult.
Then the idea of storing it, i doubt anyone would want to store it given that it exothermically decomposes on contact with water, which would drive it
to evaporate and build up pressure inside any container you have put it in. This would mean that you would need to dry the phosgene before storage and
likely store it inside an ampule.
Remember that one of the decomposition products of TCCA is H2O which makes drying an absolute necessity.
In fact phosgene is likely to only be a minor byproduct of the decomposition of TCCA which would by itself make the idea of generating phosgene from
from TCCA futile.
A better option would be to simply avoid decomposing TCCA and in the case where you needed phosgene for preparing thionyl chloride or whatever, then
it would be a far better idea (albeit and insane idea) to prepare it via the oxidation of chloroform. |
My mistake, and I suppose that is a win for Humanity in general. I should have figured that if Phosgene was so easy to produce and store it would find
more of purpose in contemporary chemical weapons. I redact my earlier claim.
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
