| Pages:
1
2 |
mycoguy
Harmless
Posts: 12
Registered: 7-1-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cognos
You need to Google a bit harder... A safrole containing oil (90%+) is available from an aromatherepy supplier in the UK... 30ml for about £8 and they
have an online ordering system so you don't need to even call them or anything. You'd need to spend about 80 quid for a decent amount which
is a little steep relatively speaking. Possibly ordering 10 bottles might be a bit hot, who knows. |
80 quid for 300ml? WTF? YOU need to google harder!
|
|
|
Cognos
Harmless
Posts: 2
Registered: 19-3-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
So what price have you seen for a 90%+ oil, from a UK supplier who will sell to the general public?? Of course one could order it much
cheaper from oversees based companies, but that adds extra risks. If one was in the business of making exotic soap, then considering the amount that
could be produced from 270ml of safrole, it is still a bargain at £80 for an obscure, less well known and therefore less suspicious (than sassafras)
safrole containing oil.
[Edited on 20-3-2005 by Cognos]
|
|
|
Nerro
National Hazard
Posts: 596
Registered: 29-9-2004
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Whatever...
|
|
Eugenole is very similar to safrole. There must be a simple way make safrole out of it. You only need to remove 2 H+.
Is Eugenole easier to come by?
UPDATE!
After UTFSE I discovered (aye matey!) that clove-oil containes 82%~87% eugenole! That should be usefull.
[Edited on 21/3/2005 by Nerro]
#261501 +(11351)- [X]
the \"bishop\" came to our church today
he was a fucken impostor
never once moved diagonally
courtesy of bash
|
|
|
FrankRizzo
Hazard to Others
Posts: 204
Registered: 9-2-2004
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
This should be useful.
http://chemlabs1.tripod.com/chemistry/methylenation.html
The site also contains an easy microwave syth.
http://chemlabs1.tripod.com/chemistry/eugenol2safrol.html
[Edited on 22-3-2005 by FrankRizzo]
|
|
|
mycoguy
Harmless
Posts: 12
Registered: 7-1-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
eugenol can also be had OTC, for use in some soft of temporary dental filling. Or so I've heard.
|
|
|
JohnWW
International Hazard
Posts: 2849
Registered: 27-7-2004
Location: New Zealand
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Eugenol mixed with some sort of zinc and/or magnesium oxide cement, I think, is in the temporary dental filling.
|
|
|
Nerro
National Hazard
Posts: 596
Registered: 29-9-2004
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Whatever...
|
|
correct. It can be found in temporary fillings as as a means of dumbing out the pain you might suffer in a hollow tooth. (what's the word again?)
But as I said, clove oil exists out of 82%~87% eugenole 
#261501 +(11351)- [X]
the \"bishop\" came to our church today
he was a fucken impostor
never once moved diagonally
courtesy of bash
|
|
|
CherrieBaby
Hazard to Self
Posts: 91
Registered: 4-3-2005
Location: London
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
| Quote: |
clove-oil containes 82%~87% eugenole!
|
- not that much. A % of that will be acetyl-Eugenol (~8%) which is NOT the same as Eugenol even thought it
can be converted to such. 99% Eugenol can be got from Clove oil via an A/B extraction. Kings Chemistry Survival Guide By Jared B. Ledgard,
(ubiquitously available on the net) has a suitable extraction procedure from Cloves which can be modified for Clove Oil. Here is another method from
an old Rhodium mirror:
http://chemlabs1.tripod.com/chemistry/guest.eugenol.txt
(Experimental Organic Chemistry"; Durst, Gokel, Durst, Gokel; McGraw Hill; 1980; p. 467.)
| Quote: |
You only need to remove 2 H+.
|
- You need to remove the methoxy group and then to add a methylenedioxy group. You can't just remove
the two H's (no chemistry I know of will do that).
Eugenol is piss easy to get hold of and those unable to get Eugenol you can get Oil of Cloves from the local Chemist shop or buy larger quantities
after a Google search.
This conversion has been haggled over for years on the net. The final conclusion was to do a microwave demethylation using pyridine HCl (perhaps
something less nasty will work instead like tri-ethylamine HCl or piperidine HCl? - won't know till it's tried). There are other
demethylations too, including other microwave demethylations. Maybe I should post a review?
You need to consider the work-up. Organic base.HCl demethylation should be easy to extract allyl-catechol from, which makes it a winner in my book.
This has already been discussed here in post 3373.
The best methylenation looks to be one of those using PTC (from the point of view of OTC reagents) although there was a recent US patent
http://l2.espacenet.com/espacenet/viewer?PN=US5936103&CY...
(USP 5936103) with high yields done in N-methylpyrrolidone solvent.
The relevant Rhodium document to read is
https://www.synthetikal.com/Rhodiums_pdfs/chemistry/methylen...
|
|
|
sg43
Harmless
Posts: 4
Registered: 15-4-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
sassy...
Hrm.....I donno if this helps but
http://www.sassafrasoil.com/ seems to look pretty good, high prices but they seem to provide alot bigger quanitys...if anyone know if this is a
real source please let me know.
|
|
|
Nerro
National Hazard
Posts: 596
Registered: 29-9-2004
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Whatever...
|
|
LOL! $1000 for 4,5kg of the oil.
If I were Betty Ford I would jsut buy eugenole somewhere and convert it. As I understand it you don't need any huge quantities anyway. It should be a
viable enough way to make your soaps.
[Edited on Mon/Dec/2005 by Nerro]
#261501 +(11351)- [X]
the \"bishop\" came to our church today
he was a fucken impostor
never once moved diagonally
courtesy of bash
|
|
|
sg43
Harmless
Posts: 4
Registered: 15-4-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
WHOA!
4-5 KILOS! are yous serious? first of all you only need about 8-16oz of it....and secondly im sure that would raise some red flags LOL!
|
|
|
JohnWW
International Hazard
Posts: 2849
Registered: 27-7-2004
Location: New Zealand
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
It would raise some red flags"? Of course, because the stuff is good for you.
|
|
|
tom haggen
Hazard to Others
Posts: 488
Registered: 29-11-2003
Location: PNW
Member Is Offline
Mood: a better mood
|
|
Heres a synth you safrole buffs might be interested in....
Attachment: Synthesis of Safrole - [www_rhodium_ws].mht (8kB)
This file has been downloaded 2899 times
N/A
|
|
|
sg43
Harmless
Posts: 4
Registered: 15-4-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Just cause im a nice guy
Im going to let you guys in on a litte secret: http://www.asianexports.cn/products/essentials.html
You can thank me later!!
|
|
|
ADP
Hazard to Others
Posts: 120
Registered: 4-4-2005
Location: USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Productive
|
|
Is it not possible to extract sassifras oil from Sassafras Albidum roots?
Perhaps the roots could be cut and soaked in a solvent such as ethanol for some time and then filtered and distilled to obain sassifras oil which is
very high in safrole?
|
|
|
Odin
Harmless
Posts: 15
Registered: 27-11-2005
Location: Toronto
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
safrole is a precurser for MDMA,MMDA as well as MDA.
Safrole and Safron is extracted from the oil from sassafras or can be obtained from the flower ' Crocus Sativa '
I dont have to go into the detail of the amount of flowers required to obtain a satisfactory yield of extract.
Having a field of these flowers is the equivilent of having possesion of a Class A Precurser in Canadian Drug Laws for the purpose of clandistine
activities
|
|
|
evil_lurker
National Hazard
Posts: 767
Registered: 12-3-2005
Location: United States of Elbonia
Member Is Offline
Mood: On the wagon again.
|
|
I'm from the southern USA, and have probably at least a kilogram of sassy growing in frong of my house.
Mind you that is a LOT of digging and steam distilling.
|
|
|
ADP
Hazard to Others
Posts: 120
Registered: 4-4-2005
Location: USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Productive
|
|
So the general method for the extraction would be simply steam distillation of roots. I like the root beer smell.
|
|
|
moecat
Harmless
Posts: 2
Registered: 24-11-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by ADP
Is it not possible to extract sassifras oil from Sassafras Albidum roots?
Perhaps the roots could be cut and soaked in a solvent such as ethanol for some time and then filtered and distilled to obain sassifras oil which is
very high in safrole? |
I like to think there's little difference between a steam distilled oil and the vacuum distillate of say....a hexane extraction.
[Edited on 4-12-2005 by moecat]
|
|
|
hell.fire
Harmless
Posts: 11
Registered: 11-12-2005
Location: in the middle of nowhere :-P
Member Is Offline
Mood: hyperactive :-P
|
|
There are many sources for safrole. Ive found at least 5 sources in the UK. Here's a clue search Star Anise it contains safrole and you can get 1kg
of the actual plant for £12. There's loads of plants available just keep searching google it takes time and patience to find reliable sources but it
will pay off in the end. 
|
|
|
CherrieBaby
Hazard to Self
Posts: 91
Registered: 4-3-2005
Location: London
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Star Anise contains anethole in larger quantities, which has very similar properties to safrole and is very difficult to separate. Anethole undergoes
similar reactions to iso-safrole and will give PMMA. You will end up getting a very different experience to the expected MDMA one.
I hope no one follows your advice and uses Star Anise.
|
|
|
hell.fire
Harmless
Posts: 11
Registered: 11-12-2005
Location: in the middle of nowhere :-P
Member Is Offline
Mood: hyperactive :-P
|
|
Wow your right ive done more searching in to it and it would seem your right. But still tere's loads of plants left seriously it just takes time.
According to Rhodium nut-meg can be used it contains 120 - 2,720 ppm in Seed not much but there's some there all you have to do is separate the
mycristin (sp) form the safrole.
EDIT: Lol just been doing some more searching on google and i've found sassafras albidium available in the UK.
'albidum'
very upright tree spreading by suckers with aromatic leaves and good autumn colour. A rare tree in the UK
Small £9.75 or Large £22.50 or Specimen £45.00
[Edited on 12-12-2005 by hell.fire]
|
|
|
Fast Green FCF
Harmless
Posts: 1
Registered: 27-5-2015
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by CherrieBaby  | Star Anise contains anethole in larger quantities, which has very similar properties to safrole and is very difficult to separate. Anethole undergoes
similar reactions to iso-safrole and will give PMMA. You will end up getting a very different experience to the expected MDMA one.
I hope no one follows your advice and uses Star Anise. |
Boiling Point of Anethole = 233-235 deg C
Boiling Point of Safrole = 232-234 deg C
Boiling Point of Isosafrole = 253 deg C
Althought it is true you can't easily separate it from the safrole, the isosafrole will be easy to purify with a simple fractional distillation.
|
|
|
Shikimol69
Harmless
Posts: 11
Registered: 16-6-2013
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
It is now very difficult to get essential oil with significant safrole content. Forget about sassafras, nowadays camphor oil is really easy to source,
more specifically brown camphor oil.
But I will tell you something : if you buy brown camphor oil you will have a very bad surprise. Sellers, from east to west, apply specific treatments
that are destructive for safrole and this is never specified. They don't remove it, and can still claim that oils afford all benefits of safrole (what
I seriously doubt, if the molecule can't be found intact it just lost its properties). BUT you can ask to some of these companies to send you
unmodified oil with high crude safrole content. The price will not be the same, it will rise just as the risk to get caught by the nice people at the
customs!
BTW, any UK seller listing oils with high safrole content just lie (also rectified oil or just "fragrance"), safrole is banned over the international
platform...
[Edited on 7-6-2015 by Shikimol69]
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2 |
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
