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vlassen
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HNO3..
Hello,
I just found this way of making nitric acid..
http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=48&t...
It looks like this
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=401
this method (1st link) seems to work quite well (and cheap)...
What do you think?
[Edited on 14-3-2011 by vlassen]
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ScienceHideout
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I have my own way of making HNO3. I adapted it from the 2nd part og the following NurdRage video. Even though it is not pure or concentrated, it
works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yE7v4wkuZU
hey, if you are reading this, I can't U2U, but you are always welcome to send me an email!
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vlassen
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I tried this method and the yield was low IMO. Do you get a good yield with your process?
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ScienceHideout
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I use peroxide like nurdrage, and I use lots of copper and heat it. I never titrated it, but as long as it eats copper it can serve most of my
purposes.
hey, if you are reading this, I can't U2U, but you are always welcome to send me an email!
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Formatik
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It would be very impure. Despite that silver treatment, and though Ag2SO4 has slight solubility it is much more soluble than AgCl. Also, Ag2SO4 has
increased solubility in acids, HNO3 enhances solubility. This can become a lethally problematic impurity if the acid was mixed with organics, and a
detonating silver compound forms. The acid will also have some sodium contamination. Distillation is needed.
Another way to make it from NaHSO4 is by heating. NaHSO4 heated with KNO3 will drive off some nitric acid, or CuSO4.5H2O mixed KNO3 at modestly low
heat (65 to 235 C) drive off HNO3 and NO2. The vapors can be captured in cool H2O (better is moderate H2O2 since it oxidizes nitrogen oxides). But I
would always use H2SO4 and do the regular distillation. Besides good for sheer experimentation, I don't like roundabout methods.
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plante1999
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you should chec the way i use , it is a the end of the page (yellow picture).
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=15211
I never asked for this.
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vlassen
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ScienceHideout, Formatik: Thank you for your help
plante1999: you say in your topic that you got ammonium nitrate from instant cold pack.. How? (In 2009, it was banned along with nitric acid, some
nitrates/chlorates etc. I guess you know the "Explosive Act"..)
[Edited on 16-3-2011 by vlassen]
[Edited on 16-3-2011 by vlassen]
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hissingnoise
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And since said roundabouts produce nothing worth the effort they're mostly just a waste of time!
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Bot0nist
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Quote: Originally posted by vlassen  | ScienceHideout, Formatik:
plante1999: you say in your topic that you got ammonium nitrate from instant cold pack.. How? (In 2009, it was banned along with nitric acid, some
nitrates/chlorates etc.
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I still get it in cold packs in the USA. Just bought some last Friday. Ingredients: Ammonium nitrate and water. Some have urea in them instead though.
You have to watch out for that.
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vlassen
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bot0nist | | Quote: Originally posted by vlassen | ScienceHideout, Formatik:
plante1999: you say in your topic that you got ammonium nitrate from instant cold pack.. How? (In 2009, it was banned along with nitric acid, some
nitrates/chlorates etc.
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I still get it in cold packs in the USA. Just bought some last Friday. Ingredients: Ammonium nitrate and water. Some have urea in them instead though.
You have to watch out for that. |
But what about Canada? Especially Quebec.. That's what I can get there
http://www.formedica.com/en-ca/produits/premiers-soins/gel-p...
but it doesn't say anything about ingredients..
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Bot0nist
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I'm not sure about Canada. If the product is a 'gel' like it says then I doubt it would be useful. The ones I use are just a white bag filled with
little beads (prills?) of NH<sub>4</sub>NO<sub>3</sub> and a little brittle bag of water inside. The ingredients state only
dihydrogen monoxide and ammonium nitrate. The NH<sub>4</sub>NO<sub>3</sub> prills are very hygroscopic, so I pulverize them
with a rolling pin, and then heat it between paper towels at 110F in the oven for 20 minutes. I then seal immediately in a water tight container.
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vlassen
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It's not a gel, it's exactly like your white bag (white beads and a bag of water). But, I fear that it might be urea.
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Bot0nist
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Some simple tests could determine if its urea I imagine. Is it pure white? Does it smell of ammonia when heated?
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plante1999
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in live in qc and you could get easily ammonium nitrate cold pack
I never asked for this.
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vlassen
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bot0nist | | Some simple tests could determine if its urea I imagine. Is it pure white? Does it smell of ammonia when heated? |
Yeah it's white.. I have never heated it, but it stinks anyway*. I'll try to determine the solubility, I think it might be a good way to determine if
it's ammonium nitrate or urea (or anything else)
*In fact, I think the smell comes from the bottle..
plante1999: which brand?
[Edited on 16-3-2011 by vlassen]
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cyanureeves
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urea also smell of ammonia.walmart has a prilled cold pack that says non-toxic and its urea.50/50 prills and baking soda boiled should get you sodium
nitrate,you can then evaporate and mix with sugar(a la nurd rage)and burn it or just make gun powder if its ammonium nitrate prills. i got an oldie
cold pack and the water pack has a green liquid and the powder looks like baking soda.never seen this before.
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vlassen
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So if I mix a solution of ammonium nitrate and sodium bicarbonate it should make bubbles.. I'll try that
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vlassen
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It didn't work, I didn't see any bubbles.
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Bot0nist
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I meant the Urea smells like HN<sub>4</sub> not the AN. I don't know if the 'bubble' test will work. Its not an acid. Does the metathesis
create CO<sub>2</sub> or something?
If it smells like HN<sub>4</sub> its urea IIRC.
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vlassen
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bot0nist | I meant the Urea smells like HN<sub>4</sub> not the AN. I don't know if the 'bubble' test will work. Its not an acid. Does the metathesis
create CO<sub>2</sub> or something?
If it smells like HN<sub>4</sub> its urea IIRC. |
It's not an acid, but:
NH4NO3 + NaHCO3 -> NH3 + CO2 + H2O + NaNO3
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bbartlog
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Why wouldn't you get ammonium bicarbonate if this reaction were conducted at room temperature, i.e.
NH4NO3 + NaHCO3 -> NH4HCO3 + NaNO3 ?
Granted ammonium bicarbonate is itself pretty unstable and would easily decompose (even if it formed) to the products you list, but I'm not sure it
just happens right away.
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cyanureeves
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bubbles? you mean because baking soda fizzes in water?i never paid no mind to the bubbling, but ammonium nitrate and sodium bicarbonate make a bunch
of ammonia when boiling. take advantage of the ammonia.just dry your yield and add sugar then burn it.
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vlassen
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bbartlog: what do you mean? If 2 gases and water are produced, then I think it's spontaneous
cyanureeves: well I thought that if it produces NH3 (gas), then I would see bubbles or something like that o.0.. I'll try to boil it then.
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Formatik
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Urea boiled with bicarbonate will also form NH3. I would mix conc. aq. NaOH with the suspected NH4+ salt, if it gives off NH3 at room
temperature, then it's NH4+.
Mostly true. But reagents may be harder to get in some areas, and increased restrictions can make one or the other harder to obtain. The versatility
is good.
[Edited on 17-3-2011 by Formatik]
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Bot0nist
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Now there's an idea...
Still, this will only tell you if it contians an NH<sub>4</sub>_, not if its contaminated with urea i suppose.
[Edited on 17-3-2011 by Bot0nist]
[Edited on 17-3-2011 by Bot0nist]
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