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Rogeryermaw
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Value of gold
in a different mindset, as chemists(that's why i ask this here)how valuable is gold really? it's weak structurally and therefore mechanically useless
other than perhaps corrosion resistance(and is way too expensive and rare for that) and has low chemical reactivity. so aside from its resistance to
corrosion and high electrical conductivity, what makes gold so valuable?
case in point: my own wedding ring is made of titanium which i see as being far more valuable than gold.
EDIT: removed information that may have been seen as too personal
[Edited on 5-10-2010 by Rogeryermaw]
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Lambda-Eyde
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It's shiny, easily worked into beautiful items, does not corrode with time and most importantly; it's rare.
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Polverone
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The "precious metal" designation seems to be a self fulfilling prophecy rooted in the historical composition of coinage. Mercury, selenium, and
bismuth are rarer than silver but are only a fraction of the price and never advertised as investment opportunities in popular media. Ruthenium and
rhenium are rarer than gold but only a fraction of the price (though still expensive).
PGP Key and corresponding e-mail address
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psychokinetic
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Supply and demand.
Gold is good for shiny experiments, just as it is good for shiny jewellery.
Though, I'm not a fan of gold jewellery.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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12AX7
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Gold is golden. Nuff said.
Copper is even more golden (it's coppery!), and alloys are gold, but they don't have the same shine.
Humans, like most animals, are attracted to bright, shiny objects.
There are a few technical purposes, but mostly it's because 1. it's shiny and 2. it's expensive.
Allow me remind you that, due to social feedback, it is reason enough for something to be expensive, for it to continue being expensive.
Tim
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Mr. Wizard
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Gold, Platinum, Palladium are all used in dental prosthetics and crowns. I recently had a couple of crowns put in, and thought they were a nickel or
stainless alloy, covered with ceramic. The dentist informed me he ONLY used a Platinum Palladium alloy. A little research online showed that gold was
also a popular metal for alloying in this field. Gold would have an advantage in a lower melting point, and ease of fabrication. Another use for gold
in dentistry is gold fillings, which many older dentists were required to learn. This method has fallen out of use with the UV hardened polymers now
available. Gold foil, sheet or sponge was gently tapped into the cavity, the metal pressure welding itself into a solid mass.
Tongue in cheek: This method has the advantage of being low technology, and ease of recycling.  I wonder how many morticians are precious metal recyclers?
http://www.discoveriesinmedicine.com/Com-En/Dental-Fillings-...
I don't believe being sensitive or allergic to gold is very common.
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metalresearcher
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Usability , occurrence and price are not always related. Price, in particular gold, is a very emotional and psychological issue.
Some elements are very expensive such as caesium, but it is useless as it is too soft and reactive.
Look at this graph in this article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abundance_of_the_chemical_eleme...
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hissingnoise
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Gold apparently, isn't always sought after . . .
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Croagh Patrick
Cruach Phádraig
The Reek
Elevation 764 m (2,507 ft)
Prominence 640 m (2,100 ft)
Listing Marilyn, Hewitt
Translation (Saint) Patrick's stack (Irish)
Location
Location County Mayo, Ireland
Coordinates 53°45′36″N 9°39′34″W / 53.760047°N 9.659536°W / 53.760047; -9.659536Coordinates:
53°45′36″N 9°39′34″W / 53.760047°N 9.659536°W / 53.760047; -9.659536
Topo map OSi Discovery 30, 31, 37 or 38
OSI/OSNI grid L906802
Croagh Patrick (Irish: Cruach Phádraig), nicknamed the Reek, is a 764 metres (2,507 ft) tall mountain and an important site of pilgrimage in County
Mayo, Ireland. It is 8 kilometres (5 mi) from Westport, above the villages of Murrisk and Lecanvey. It is the third highest mountain in County Mayo
after Mweelrea and Nephin. On "Reek Sunday", the last Sunday in July every year, over 15,000 pilgrims climb it. It forms the southern part of a
U-shaped valley created by a glacier flowing into Clew Bay in the last Ice Age. Croagh Patrick is part of a longer east-west ridge; the westernmost
peak is called Ben Goram.
A seam of gold was discovered in the mountain in the 1980s: overall grades of 14 grams (0.45 ozt) of gold per tonne in at least 12 quartz
veins, which could produce 700,000 t (770,000 short tons) of ore — potentially over 300,000 troy oz of gold (worth over €300m). Mayo County Council elected not to allow mining, deciding that the gold was "fine where it was".
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bbartlog
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I would suggest reading something about the origins of money to understand why gold was chosen as currency. It doesn't corrode, is easily portable, is
not too difficult to test for purity and quantity, is not trivial to produce more of - these are all important factors. Grain-based currency suffers
from the fact that the grain eventually goes bad, so it can't function as a store of value. Salt and iron were used at times, but both are bulky and
need to be kept kind of dry. Copper, silver and gold are durable, compact and corrosion-resistant...
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hissingnoise
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| Quote: | | I would suggest reading something about the origins of money to understand why gold was chosen as currency. |
Does it have something to do with the fact that people like to look at it?
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psychokinetic
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Probably. As usual, those with the power decided what was worth dying for.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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cyanureeves
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gold
dont forget maleability.one smidgen can be made into a sheet1000x bigger and still retain its properties, luster and not corrode.amazing how it found
its usefulness again with computers.platinum wouldve took its place probably if it hadnt been to difficult to isolate.and yes its eye catching. at
least for every people on every continent.
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Rogeryermaw
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what i say is that if i had gold and someone else wanted it and saw it as being of value, i would easily trade every bit i had. i can use iron. i can
use aluminum. i would trade it for your gunpowder and then shoot you and take it back waiting for the next fool who thought it really had value.
if the economic systems of the world collapsed and barter and service were the standards for trade, gold would end up in the trash pile. i suppose it
could be melted down and used for bullets but lead is doing such a good job of that as it is.
from what i have read in alchemical texts, gold is supposed to be the last mutation and most mature form of metal and i believe it was lead that was
the first or youngest. the attempts of the alchemists at turning base metals to gold was thought to be a process of maturing. possibly due to its
rarity of course but i just don't see it.
| Quote: | the only thing that distinguishes one metal from another, is its degree of maturity, which is, of course, greatest in the most precious metals; the
difference between lead and gold is not one of substance, but of digestion; in the baser metal the coction has not been such as to purge out its
metallic impurities. if by any means this superfluous impure matter could be organically removed from the baser metals, they would become gold and
silver.
http://books.google.com/books?id=zcFjgcW-M_8C&pg=PA37&am...
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perhaps my vision is flawed but to me usefulness is about utility and the utility of gold is very limited. not necessarily because it is not useful
for several things but a combination of that and its rarity and cost making it prohibitive to use for such tasks.
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bquirky
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why is gold valuable as a money? the way i see it is this..
It is rare enough to be of value in pocketable quantity's
There is a limited amount of new gold available at a time (important as digging more up works the same as printing money)
It is chemicly stable and wont corrode away in your pocket
and it is rellitivly easy for a layperson to identify as opposed to other rare metals that kinda all look the same.
So in general i think that anything that fits those criteria can be used as a monetary instrument and that includes paper money with legal penalty's
for private print runs.
on a lighter note.
I was once told to never think to hard about what money and the economy actuly IS as it will only make you nervous.
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hissingnoise
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Quote: Originally posted by cyanureeves  | | dont forget maleability.one smidgen can be made into a sheet1000x bigger and still retain its properties, luster and not corrode.
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And so thin you can see through it - through gold leaf, the sun is green as grass . . .
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spong
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I hate that gold is so valuable, it's pretty much useless compared to virtually all other metals, it has some uses in dentistry and electronics but
not all that much else. Plus, there is a LOT of it, apparently there is enough gold in bank vaults around the world to keep up with the current demand
for the next few thousand years. People keep mining it of course, because it's so expensive 
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madscientist
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Another interpretation for why gold has always been considered a standard of value is because it encapsulates a large amount of labor from the
discovery and mining process, is easily stored and transported, and does not deteriorate. Hence it makes for a good unit of value to trade for other
goods. Other potential currencies such as hamburgers, nails, horses, etc. don't take nearly as much work per pound to produce, hence you must haul
around much more weight to make trades; also, hamburgers and horses are subject to deterioration.
Aesthetic and industrial uses of course are a big part as well. We monkeys go crazy over shiny trinkets.
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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bbartlog
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| Quote: | | So in general i think that anything that fits those criteria can be used as a monetary instrument and that includes paper money
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But paper money suffers from the risk that whoever is in charge of it will decide to abuse it and print a bunch (see: Zimbabwe, Hungary, Bolivia and
others too numerous to mention...). Granted gold or other precious metals have the analogous risk that a huge deposit will be uncovered and/or new
processes found to make them cheaper, but historically that doesn't seem to be as likely. Which is why, while paper money *can* be used as a monetary
instrument, it generally requires government backing to force people to use it.
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psychokinetic
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Perhaps it is good that gold is so valuable, rather than something potentially useful.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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zed
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Gold is an important industrial metal.
Its current high price isn't based on that usefulness however.
Gold has for a long while been an investment of choice, in perilous times. It's highly portable, and it never loses all of its value.
During the DotCom boom, Gold was pretty cheap. Here in America, we were rolling in money. Investors were making tons of money in the stock market,
and all was well.
The initial PC madness lapsed around 2000, and the Stock Markets crashed hard. Recently, both the stock & real estate markets have crashed hard
again.
There is no real faith whatsoever, in the world's financial systems, and in the US, even home prices have fallen.
For the moment, investors are flocking to Gold.
In October of 1999, when things were still apparently well with most of the World's economy......Gold was about $300.00 (US Dollars) per ounce.
[Edited on 7-10-2010 by zed]
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psychokinetic
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And when it was realised that the money-that-wasn't-real wasn't there anymore, we were all fucked.
That's a value of gold - it's touchable.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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Panache
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the commodity price of palladium bumped by 37% in one days trade yesterday, any idea why?
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arsphenamine
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Yes, the markets crashed,
but the stocks didn't fall -- they were pushed.
The Glass-Steagal Act was repealed in 1999 so that a financial entity could act as a commercial bank, investment bank, and insurance company. In
plain terms, the investment bank could gamble with commercial depositors' funds and underwrite the losses with the insurance company.
The 2000 DotCom collapse was a direct result of venture capital lost through risky investment speculation after the 1999 Glass-Steagal repeal.
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psychokinetic
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Like lemmings they was.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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S.C. Wack
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LONDON, Oct 8 (Reuters) - Russian miner Norilsk Nickel, the world's biggest producer of autocatalyst metal palladium, said it expected Russian
state stocks of the white metal to be "finished" next year.
"This year will be the last year when any substantial quantity from this stock has any chance to enter the market," the company's deputy general
director for sales and distribution Viktor Sprogis said at a briefing in London.
"That is why we expect that next year this stock is finished." Officially levels of Russian metals stocks are a state secret.
Palladium prices have risen to 9-year highs in recent weeks amid speculation supply would fail to keep pace with a recovery in demand, particularly
from U.S. and Chinese carmakers, this year and next.
The white metal hit a peak of $602.50 an ounce on Thursday, its strongest level since mid-2001. Sprogis said the outlook for the palladium market is
"very, very positive".
Sales of metal from Russian palladium stockpiles have been a key component in overall supply for a number of years. Metals refiner Johnson Matthey
estimated in a report earlier this year that such sales amounted to 960,000 ounces in 2009.
Without these sales, the palladium market would have been in a deficit of some 200,000 ounces, according to JM data, rather than in the surplus they
actually recorded. (Reporting by Julie Crust and Jan Harvey; Editing by William Hardy)
This has been building through the year, it was reported earlier:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-05-19/russian-state-may-h...
I doubt the SA mines will ever take prices below Russian stockpile prices, just like gold prices have never gotten anywhere near Swiss stockpile sale
prices not long ago. Ironically I could not afford to invest anything when that happened, but I saw the opportunity and was blown away by how
commentators unanimously felt that buying gold was still a bad idea at ~$350/oz.
I bought enough Pd low after it had been high, then it went high again, and when it came back down again you were warned:
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=10982&...
It went down to maybe $300 delivered (extra big markup for rounds and bars this time, plus extra for nicer items) and won't be going that low again.
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