runninfarmer
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K metal from KOH, Mg, and Diacetone Alcohol
I've been studying this Nurdrage video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAo2F9ymKXA
Nurdrage uses tertiary alcohols to catalyze KOH reduction with Mg. He does it at 200C though and tert-butanol boils at 83C. Diacetone alcohol is
also a tertiary alcohol but boils at 160C. It'd be nice to do the reaction without reflux. Has anyone ever tried this? I wonder if the ketone group
would interfere with the reaction? I'm contemplating trying it out but curious to see if anyone else has tried it.
[Edited on 11-10-2015 by runninfarmer]
[Edited on 11-10-2015 by runninfarmer]
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j_sum1
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There is extensive discussion on this topic here.
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=14970
I am not sure if anyone has tried using diacetone alcohol. I don't recall reading it. You could always give it a try.
The tricky thing for most people seems to be coming up with a suitable medium to perform the reaction in. Paraffin oils are a bit hit and miss. The
oil needs to meet specific requirements and not all of them do. For this reason, I suggest duplicating the method using standard reagents and then,
having achieved success, attempting with the diacetone alcohol.
I recommend also requesting a mod to merge this with the main thread so all information is in one place.
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blogfast25
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Quote: Originally posted by runninfarmer  | I've been studying this Nurdrage video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAo2F9ymKXA
Nurdrage uses tertiary alcohols to catalyze KOH reduction with Mg. He does it at 200C though and tert-butanol boils at 83C. Diacetone alcohol is
also a tertiary alcohol but boils at 160C. It'd be nice to do the reaction without reflux. Has anyone ever tried this? I wonder if the ketone group
would interfere with the reaction? I'm contemplating trying it out but curious to see if anyone else has tried it.
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This really belongs in the relevant sticky thread. I suggest a moderator move it there:
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=14970&...
Per se not a bad idea but I think the oxygen from the caboxyl group will react with any K formed, assuming even it does form. Try a test tube
experiment?
[Edited on 11-10-2015 by blogfast25]
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blogfast25
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| Quote: Originally posted by j_sum1 | | Paraffin oils are a bit hit and miss. The oil needs to meet specific requirements and not all of them do. For this reason, [...]
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I have to disagree a bit here: quite a broad variety of inert/aprotic sovents were found to work: Shellsol D (Pok, Nurd, me), paraffinic oil (Nurd),
baby oil (Nurd), kerosene (me), Decalin (Nurd)... all worked.
As long as it's dry, BP around C and aprotic/inert it will work in all likelihood.
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j_sum1
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| Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25 | | Quote: Originally posted by j_sum1 | | Paraffin oils are a bit hit and miss. The oil needs to meet specific requirements and not all of them do. For this reason, [...]
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I have to disagree a bit here: quite a broad variety of inert/aprotic sovents were found to work: Shellsol D (Pok, Nurd, me), paraffinic oil (Nurd),
baby oil (Nurd), kerosene (me), Decalin (Nurd)... all worked.
As long as it's dry, BP around C and aprotic/inert it will work in all likelihood. |
Ok. Paraphrase. Mine didn't work. I am looking for an alternative oil. Kero was next on my list.
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