Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Potassium Chloride electrolysis
I have run the electrolysis for over 2 hours now, at 2.5 amps.
I used a carbon anode and a brass nail cathode.
When I took it off the electrolysis and filtered the carbon particles out I was left with a brownish solution.
I put this in an ice bath for about an hour to precipitate out the Potassium Chlorate but got nothing.
Does anyone know what I did wrong?
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I am going to run the same electrolysis with a more concentrated solution with 5 amps overnight.
|
|
|
Metacelsus
International Hazard
Posts: 2539
Registered: 26-12-2012
Location: Boston, MA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Double, double, toil and trouble
|
|
You put 5 Ah into the cell. This is equivalent to 0.187 mol of electrons. It takes 6 mol of electrons (under ideal conditions) to make one mole of
chlorate. Therefore, you made AT MOST 31 mmol of chlorate. With your electrode choice, and assumed lack of pH control, I'd estimate your efficiency to
be no more than 50%.
The answer to you question is that you didn't make enough chlorate for it to form a precipitate.
|
|
|
watson.fawkes
International Hazard
Posts: 2793
Registered: 16-8-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Does anybody know what you did?
It's not like you stated a number of important things, such as concentration, total volume, current density, etc.
|
|
|
ElectroWin
Hazard to Others
Posts: 224
Registered: 5-3-2011
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
you mention current, but we should also examine current density. at different current densities and temperatures, instead of making chlorate you could
make chlorite.
1. what is the surface area of the anode in contact with the solution?
2. what is the temperature of the solution during electrolysis?
|
|
|
bfesser
|
Thread Moved
11-7-2013 at 20:03 |
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
The electrolysis for 12 hours worked 
I got a load of chlorate at the bottom, it had lots of carbon powder in it(expected)
So, I decided to dissolve the chlorate in a load of boiling water then filter this solution with the carbon bits in it and then the chlorate would
crystalise out once I put it in an ice bath.
Well... It's been in the ice bath for about an hour and no crystals have formed. Does anyone know why?
|
|
|
hyfalcon
International Hazard
Posts: 1003
Registered: 29-3-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Reduce your volume by half, boiling till you see little crystals forming on the surface(saturated), cool to near freezing. As the temp approaches
freezing your chlorate should fall out.
[Edited on 12-7-2013 by hyfalcon]
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I thought chlorate was really insoluble in water so when you freeze it it just drops out
<!-- bfesser_edit_tag -->[<a href="u2u.php?action=send&username=bfesser">bfesser</a>: removed
unnecessary quote(s)]
[Edited on 7/12/13 by bfesser]
|
|
|
bfesser
Resident Wikipedian
Posts: 2114
Registered: 29-1-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
A given quantity of a low solubility compound will remain in solution if there is too much solvent. If you don't understand this fundamental concept,
then you shouldn't even have potassium chlorate! Besides, I would say that it's moderately soluble in water. Learn to read and do a little of your
own research before posting more of this nonsense.
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potassium_chlorate" target="_blank"> | Quote: | Solubility in water:
7.19 g/100 ml (20 °C)
8.61 g/100 m: (25 °C)
57 g/100 mL (100 °C) <img src="../scipics/_wiki.png" /> |
</a>
[Edited on 7/12/13 by bfesser]
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Too bad, i'm keeping it! I do understand that, maybe i'm making myself out to be an idiot..
Can you tell me how that quote was unnecessary? I was replying to that guy
<!-- bfesser_edit_tag -->[<a href="u2u.php?action=send&username=bfesser">bfesser</a>: removed
unnecessary quote(s)]
[Edited on 7/12/13 by bfesser]
|
|
|
bfesser
Resident Wikipedian
Posts: 2114
Registered: 29-1-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
There's no point in quoting the entire post immediately preceding yours, as it's obvious who you are replying to. We can all scroll and read. It's
disruptive to the flow of the thread, and is unnecessary with this forum software. Thanks for asking, though.
[Edited on 7/12/13 by bfesser]
|
|
|
watson.fawkes
International Hazard
Posts: 2793
Registered: 16-8-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
No, it's not always obvious. Deducible, yes. Quickly deducible -->
obvious, no.
Quoting an entire preceding post is usually pointless, but cutting down the quotation is perfectly fine, since it draw attention to a particular
point, rather than a post as a whole. It's what I've done with this post.
I've also saved this message in a separate text file, in anticipation I'll need to repost it after vandalism to the above quotation.
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Okay, noted.
I am boiling the solution down now, should I add a little bit of water once crystals form?
|
|
|
bfesser
Resident Wikipedian
Posts: 2114
Registered: 29-1-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Now why would I do a thing like that, <strong>watson.fawkes</strong>? You're setting a perfect example of how quotes can be used
effectively! 
Wherever possible, I like to address members by name rather than use quotes. [example]
|
|
|
watson.fawkes
International Hazard
Posts: 2793
Registered: 16-8-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Because you've done it
before, to this post of mine, which I had to restore.
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
You missed the sarcasm.
|
|
|
bfesser
Resident Wikipedian
Posts: 2114
Registered: 29-1-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Back on topic:
<strong>Manifest</strong>, look up a solubility vs. temperature curve for potassium chlorate in water, and base your crystallization off
that and your expected yield. I could easily find this for you, but it will be good practice for you to learn to do this on your own.
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
After I got my crude 'chlorate' sludge after electrolysis:
I:
1.Added boiling water
2.Filtered
3.Went outside and boiled this down until crystals formed, then added a little water
4.When this cooled down slightly I put this in an ice bath.
5.Crystals formed
I let these crystals dry and I tested with a little sugar and an excess of chlorate and vice versa.
I lit it, nothing happened, the sugar just browned.
I tried burning my chlorate in a flame and of course I got that yellow sodium contamination.
I'm pissed, I spent some time doing this I was sure it would work.
|
|
|
Manifest
Script Kiddie Asshole
Posts: 229
Registered: 7-12-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Could I recrystalise this once again to fix it?
|
|
|
bfesser
|
Thread Bumped
15-7-2013 at 06:25 |
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
