Sciencemadness Discussion Board - My First Chemistry Lab

My First Chemistry Lab

numbcomfort - 15-2-2007 at 11:17

Hello chemistry type people!

I'm just now taking my first college chemistry class (little bit in highschool 3 years ago, plus it was conceptual so it doesn't count...) so I don't know a whole hell of a lot, but I want to learn.

Now, I don't know if this is a valid question, or one of those questions where theres no real answer, but the question is this:

I'm interested in buying some basic lab supplies and chemicals so I can try things at home as well as the once-a-week lab at school. I know what kind of equipment to buy, my question is what are some interesting starting chemicals for someone who's just learning starts out with?

DeAdFX - 15-2-2007 at 11:36

Well some good chemicals to start out with might be some common acid/bases, possibly some salts and a couple of solvents.

Acids...
Sulfuric acid
Nitric acid
Hydrochloric acid
Phosphoric acid
Acetic acid/vinegar

Bases...
Sodium Hydroxide
Potassium Hydroxide
Urea
Ammonia

Solvents
Acetone
Xylene
Toluene
Methyl Ethyl Ketone
DMSO

Misc
Hydrogen Peroxide
various metal oxides (Iron/copper/etc)

Salts
Calcium Sulfate
Ammonium Nitrate
Potassium Chlorate/Nitrate
Sodium Fluoride
Calcium Carbide

I see these chemicals are used in chemical synthesis alot so they would have some general all around good use for the beginner and advanced chemist.

Most basic chemical synthesis seem to use some variation of these chemicals so this should be a good starting point. Depending on your interests in chemistry you should be able to eliminate the need of some chemicals. IE if you are into inorganic chem your probably will not need any organic solvents....

[Edited on 15-2-2007 by DeAdFX]

YT2095 - 15-2-2007 at 11:55

your best bet is to have a look through your chem text book and make notes of the things used in it, that`s exactly what I did when I started out, also buy a few generic chemistry sets, most of the stuff isn`t great, but it`s usable, get your glassware off eBay, but have a good science and Chem catalogue with you so you don`t over-pay for an item! it`s always good reference material

speak to the Lab technicians at school also, they get treated like invisible crap most the time and invite chat (inteligent chat), they will have old ordering catalogues

other than that, get whatever you can get your hands on also, it may not be useful Today, but next week it may be exactly what you need!

in fact a good 40% of my chem stock room has things in it that I don`t need or have a use for, but you`d be surprised how many times you see an interesting synth and you just KNOW you have the stuff to do it with

better to have and not need, than to Need and not Have!

Levi - 15-2-2007 at 19:59

Don't forget to stock up on alcohols, too.

Isopropyl (rubbing alcohol)
Methanol
Ethanol (vodka or similar)
Beer <-- not for use in reactions but a good idea to have around in case you get thirsty.

Isopropyl and Methanol are quite poisonous so don't drink them

Cool Stuff

Xenodius - 15-2-2007 at 21:01

If you want lots of misc. cool stuff, check out UnitedNuclear.com.

Stuff to check out: Magnets, supermagnets,(CAREFUL) MagnaView fluid.
Sodium Polyacrylate.
Gibberellic acid.
Flame colorants (Lithium Carbonate is my favorite).
Woods metal (Melts in hot water).

Those are my favorite.

woelen - 16-2-2007 at 00:24

In the past, this question was asked many times, and so I decided to write a page on setting up a home lab, especially about which chemicals to buy as a starter.

http://woelen.scheikunde.net/science/chem/misc/homelab.html

Hopefully it helps you a little bit further.

[Edited on 16-2-07 by woelen]

The_Davster - 16-2-2007 at 05:21

Quote:

Originally posted by YT2095
your best bet is to have a look through your chem text book and make notes of the things used in it, that`s exactly what I did when I started out

I did the same. But try to get an older text, perhaps early 60s era, as the experiments will be more interesting, lots of the experiments in modern books are pretty neutered.

There may not even be "experments"..

Chemist514 - 17-2-2007 at 03:08

.. in a givin text these days, they come in extra packages for the instructor. You will end up needing very modern text/s (the one for class should do nice..) and older for yourself aided by the more up to date theory..
All the best.

numbcomfort - 18-2-2007 at 15:29

Thanks people, I feel like I have a LITTLE more direction now. But I still feel like the chemicals I'm thinking about buying are decided on randomly. Maybe I should just slowly buy small ammounts of things that interest me so I don't spend too much, and then later I'll find a use for them.

The_Davster - 18-2-2007 at 15:41

Find an experiment you want to start with. Get the chems for it. Repeat. Eventually you will have a very nice lab.

This is how I started.

Please follow the davster's recomendation..

Chemist514 - 19-2-2007 at 00:57

I bought a chemistry set and all the chemicals/equipment in it, then downloadd some texts and repeated, etc, wasted ALOT of money on mistakes in repurchasing chems youll use once or twice, and end up buying more of some others.. same for equipment. The very very best to you.

16MillionEyes - 11-3-2007 at 12:46

Hey, I'm getting starting on this too but it's so hard to find anything 'pure' enough around the house to do something, it's frustrating. I also have no idea where to get basic things like glassware, balances and common chemicals (please don't say the internet because that's as good as nothing for me) so I've been thinking of 'homemade' replacements but it's rather useless and complicated. How the hell do you isolate NH3 from windex for instance? Things of the sort is that I try to deal with.

joeflsts - 11-3-2007 at 14:42

Many, many common household items are relatively pure enough for the hobbyist. For example you can obtain 10% Ammonia at the Grocery store. There are some wonderful threads in this forum to assist you. I hate to say it but you should UTFSE (Use the F'ing seach engine). Don't be offended but you'll find the forum expects you to be as self-sufficient as possible.

Oh.. If you want NH3 in a more pure form you should be careful. I was cleaning glassware today using 10% solution and it will kick your ass.

Joe

[Edited on 11-3-2007 by joeflsts]

16MillionEyes - 15-3-2007 at 08:55

Well thanks for your advice but the internet is as good as nothing as I've mentined before. I can't buy anything online so that advice doesn't help me much. What I've been thinking on doing now anyway is try to see what stuff comes in fair enough concentrations to be of use around hardware stores and things of the sort. As for even more serious business I plan to see where I can find some sort of chemical supply shop around here. That should help out.

Magpie - 15-3-2007 at 11:39

Quote:

How the hell do you isolate NH3 from windex for instance?

Learning how to purify consumer products to get the chemical that you want teaches you chemistry every bit as much as starting with ACS grade materials.

Quote:

I plan to see where I can find some sort of chemical supply shop around here.

In what country do you live? I know of no such thing in the US.

16MillionEyes - 15-3-2007 at 13:58

Quote:

Learning how to purify consumer products to get the chemical that you want teaches you chemistry every bit as much as starting with ACS grade materials.

I'm certain it would, the problem is how do I even get started? With my extremly limited knowledge of chemistry I'd be hopeless when faced with such fact. If I knew a safe way to do something such as to mess with household products I would do it. Doing it in a kitchen doesn't sound very safe to me.

Magpie - 15-3-2007 at 14:27

Quote:

Well thanks for your advice but the internet is as good as nothing as I've mentined before. I can't buy anything online so that advice doesn't help me much.

I don't understand why you can't buy anything off the internet. Please explain.

From what's available on ebay you can, with a little patience, completely outfit a home lab. Many chemicals are available this way also.

Have you UTFSE? If not try "readily available chemicals."

I agree working in your kitchen has limitations. Most of us work outdoors, in a garage, basement, or outbuilding.

[Edited on by Magpie]

[Edited on by Magpie]

joeflsts - 15-3-2007 at 18:30

Quote:

Originally posted by __________

Quote:

Learning how to purify consumer products to get the chemical that you want teaches you chemistry every bit as much as starting with ACS grade materials.

I would suggest hitting your local used book store and buying a decent high school level chemistry book. Read it - cover to cover - and work the problems. This will help with your self proclaimed Extremly limited knowledge of chemistry.

Joe

16MillionEyes - 17-3-2007 at 06:07

Well, I'm actually a student of chemistry as of now. I do know basic chemical reactions, quantitative measures and basic lab methods. When I say my "extremly limited" knowledge of chemistry I generally mean it as I still don't know enough to do everything I'd like to do.
I want to experiment because that's the best way to learn new things -- through discovery. But for me to set into such a complex task as to isolate chemicals from household cleaning products is too advanced (I feel) for me, not to mention they usually contain many other toxic chemicals and doing it in a close space like a kitchen would be a bad idea.
The reason why the internet is of no use for me is simply because I don't have the "means" to buy stuff on the internet. I depend on direct basis supply, but as I've said anyhow, there must be places around here where you can get basic things. If not I'll figure something (perhaps even my college will sell me some although it's doubtful).
Thanks for all of your advices anyway.

uncompromisedfreedom - 30-3-2007 at 09:50

Numbcomfort:

You say that you don't have the "means" to buy stuff on the internet. But the same money that buys things over the 'net is the money that buys things from local "chemical supply stores" which you stated you are seeking -- and which you're not likely to find anywhere near you (and if you do you're not likely to find one that will cater to you.)

I cannot imagine anyone going very far without hitting the Internet for equipment, at the very least.

If you don't have the means for internet shopping, you don't have the means for any shopping and hence for getting the supplies for chemistry.

I am interested in hearing you clarify!

numbcomfort - 30-3-2007 at 10:04

uncompromisedfreedom:

Clarification: I never said that I didn't have the means to buy things from the internet, that was the person above you...who also doesn't seem to have a name for one reason or another.

I'm able to buy things off the internet just fine.

16MillionEyes - 31-3-2007 at 08:35

Sure, the same stuff that buys things on the internet is the same stuff that buys things over the counter. What you failed to realize is that there is different types of money such as cash and credit. Over the counter stuff accept whichever, the internet doesn't. I don't have a credit card nor any of that, the internet is useless for me in that sense.

not_important - 1-4-2007 at 03:37

In some countries it is possible to purchase prepaid 'credit cards' similar in concept to prepaid phone calling cards. You can pay cash for the card, and accept that you'll likely have a little unused value left on the card.

Of course you still need a shipping address. In my day, when postal money orders were used, the ideal shipping location was student housing where a house would be occupied by N students with frequent churn. The ship to name given was a dummy, or someone who had left without paying the money they owed. In either case if someone came to ask about the recent shipment of perchlorate and aluminium powder, that person had moved out. This worked best if you looked good wearing a thin blouse without a bra.

16MillionEyes - 1-4-2007 at 05:57

I've never heard of that here but if there is then that would be a savior. I'll try to see where to get those if any at all.
"This worked best if you looked good wearing a thin blouse without a bra."
Hahha, I hope you mean a woman.