Lillica - 29-3-2017 at 12:01
I asked one of my chemical suppliers about ordering some PBr3 and was told that he is unable to order Phosphorous Tribromide or any other DEA related
items or phosphorous compounds. This puzzled me as PBr3 is not listed anywhere on the DEA website nor is it on any list, not even the special
surveillance list. I found this strange because users here on sciencemadness told me that PBr3 is commonly used among hobby chemists.
Can anyone provide me any sort of advice here?
clearly_not_atara - 29-3-2017 at 12:46
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEA_list_of_chemicals mentions PCl5 but not PBr3.
Supposedly the DEA tracks dehydrating agents because they're commonly bought by drug chemists and usually require dangerous oxidizing agents or high
temperatures to prepare. I've even heard of oddities like carbonyldiimidazole and dicyclohexylcarbodiimide being watched for this purpose. However
it's not clear how serious they are.
[Edited on 29-3-2017 by clearly_not_atara]
Lillica - 29-3-2017 at 12:54
I'm familiar with most of the DEA lists from working at a chemical company for several years, but PBr3 (or PCl3) isn't on any of these lists. I know
for instance Thionyl Chloride is on the special surveillance list, but even that list doesn't require reporting; it just requires that sellers keep an
eye on who buys those items. PBr3/PCl3 isn't even on that list.
I know that other Phosphorus compounds are restricted, but PBr3 isn't, which is why I believe this chemical supplier is getting confused by the name.
I know for instance that PBr3 is sold by one chemical supplier which is known for selling to hobby chemists, and they don't list anything on their
website other than that it is hazardous. I sent that latter chemical supplier an inquiry to get their comments on the item.
JJay - 29-3-2017 at 14:44
If they refuse to provide you requested materials and know who you are, they can and probably do report you to the DEA and/or ATF and/or DHS, who
undoubtedly get a lot of reports of that nature and find most of them boring and useless. I'm not sure how common it is, but most hobby chemists who
use PBr3 make it themselves. I would probably just buy it from a different supplier; lawbreakers would probably be buying phosphorus and making it
themselves or (more likely) using different chemicals, and while buying some might draw some attention, unless some government agency is aware that
you are ordering it with some suspicious chemicals, they'll probably just make a note of the attempted purchase on your file and throw the report in
the trash can.
Alternatively, the supplier might just not have any in stock and want to act like the lack of sale is somehow your fault rather than appearing as
though they have a poor selection. Salespeople....
Lillica - 29-3-2017 at 15:13
It's not a stock thing. I only really go to this supplier when I need to order things from Sigma or other large chemical suppliers. Being a small shop
he hardly ever has anything in stock.
If all it takes to purchase some of these things is to show my ID and allow myself to be reported to the DEA, I wouldn't mind. Years ago I would be
terrified of any such possible interactions with law enforcement, but as of the last few years, I have had to give law enforcement a tour of my lab
twice, so at this point I am desensitized to it. I'm not doing anything prohibited anyways.
Fortunately I think I have managed to find an alternative reagent for my purpose to avoid the hazardous PBr3.
[Edited on 29-3-2017 by Lillica]
JJay - 29-3-2017 at 15:24
I have never given law enforcement a tour of my lab but one time when I was doing chemistry in an area of public accommodation, I was visited by
someone who claimed to be a government security contractor, who seemed interested mainly in explosives. I still have his business card in my wallet.
I do think they watch my residence sometimes when I bring things through customs. I don't really like it, but at least I'm not getting robbed.