Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Ethanol synthesis

OBLONG - 18-10-2016 at 08:58

Hi, does anyone know of a way to synthesize ethanol other than fermentation or ethene hydration? Thanks

Metacelsus - 18-10-2016 at 09:48

There's a thread here on the hydrolysis of ethyl acetate, but ethyl acetate is itself synthesized using ethanol, so this is only useful if you can easily get ethyl acetate but not ethanol.

Also, there was a recent paper in the news on ethanol synthesis by electrochemical reduction of carbon dioxide at a specialized copper-carbon nanocatalyst.

Fidelmios - 18-10-2016 at 10:58

It seems to be like fermentation is the best method. Maybe buy drinkable ethanol and dry with a molecular sieve.

hissingnoise - 18-10-2016 at 11:39

Buying cheap, near-anhydrous ETOH on ebay is the simplest sol.?

careysub - 18-10-2016 at 12:29

Use those nanofactories engineered by genetic programming: i.e. yeast. They are tough to beat, all they need is sugar as a reagent (and oxygen) and a small amount of nutrient. High gravity yeast are available that make 22% ethanol.

But there is this:
"High-Selectivity Electrochemical Conversion of CO2 to Ethanol using a Copper Nanoparticle/N-Doped Graphene Electrode", Song et al, ChemistrySelect 2016, 1, 1–8.

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NitratedKittens - 28-11-2016 at 11:26

I agree with careysub, yeasts have had several million years to perfect the synthesis of ethanol from sugar. :D


Ferment.
Distill.
Dry.
Done!

careysub - 28-11-2016 at 13:28

Quote: Originally posted by NitratedKittens  
I agree with careysub, yeasts have had several million years to perfect the synthesis of ethanol from sugar. :D


It appears that the origin of Saccharomyces cerevisiae can be traced back with comparative genetic analysis at least to ~150 million years ago. Given that a yeast "generation" is 30 minutes, that is on the order of a trillion generations to get it right. (See PLOS paper).

Of course yeast does not really make ethanol as a target, it is the waste product of its anaerobic metabolism path. Oddly, it has a much more efficient aerobic path that does not produce ethanol, but only uses that when its access to sugars is low. Its seems to have evolved for a sugar-rich environment, which we are happy to provide.

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aga - 28-11-2016 at 14:10

Ethanol production has been rather well documented, inclluding how to distill/dry it to 99.9%

UTFSE, the SE being google, search phrase :-

site:sciencemadness.org Ethanol

Please report back with your success at making 100% ethanol - perhaps you can find a way nobody else did in the past few hundred years.

XeonTheMGPony - 29-11-2016 at 17:22

I been buying bioflame alcohol fuel as it is just Ethyl Acetate, ethanol, and some sort of contaminant, So distill, reflux over sodium hydroxide for an hour you end up with pure Ethanol!

I just spend the last 2 days doing just that, as I all so want to make Glacial acetic acid. So that rout you get ethanol, Sodium acetate, so two very useful substances.

Tsjerk - 30-11-2016 at 01:25

Quote: Originally posted by careysub  
Quote: Originally posted by NitratedKittens  
I agree with careysub, yeasts have had several million years to perfect the synthesis of ethanol from sugar. :D


It appears that the origin of Saccharomyces cerevisiae can be traced back with comparative genetic analysis at least to ~150 million years ago. Given that a yeast "generation" is 30 minutes, that is on the order of a trillion generations to get it right. (See PLOS paper).

Of course yeast does not really make ethanol as a target, it is the waste product of its anaerobic metabolism path. Oddly, it has a much more efficient aerobic path that does not produce ethanol, but only uses that when its access to sugars is low. Its seems to have evolved for a sugar-rich environment, which we are happy to provide.


Alcohol is a very useful "waste" product for yeast though, it kills many other micro-organisms and yeast is one of the few that can use ethanol as a carbohydrate ones oxygen becomes available. So they put all there effort in producing ethanol, outcompeting bacteria and such by using their carbon source, killing them with the ethanol as a bonus and if oxygen becomes available they have a nice carbon supply no one else seems to like (except humans that is).

Ofcourse that doubling time is only reached in optimal lab conditions, nowhere in nature yeast will reach 30 minutes.

[Edited on 30-11-2016 by Tsjerk]

[Edited on 30-11-2016 by Tsjerk]