Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Collected threads re: Dr. Yong & related topics

Harbinger - 20-9-2014 at 07:09

Hello,

Here's the original news article.

http://www.cambstimes.co.uk/news/gallery_man_33_bailed_on_su...

The attached open letters and material below came into my Inbox recently.

Dr. Yong was a bona fide contractor working with the Defence Science & Technology Laboratory, part of the UK Ministry of Defence.

His last contract with them pertained to building a portable blood fridge that kept blood cool using the endothermic hydration of ammonium nitrate. He bought ammonium nitrate pursuant to his contract with Dstl.

The police came to his house, and Dstl witnesses gave concurring false testimonies to the police, saying that the agreed option to refrigerate the blood was to use sodium hydroxide :o

As a result he was locked up in prison for 2 months on remand until the police/prosecution got an expert chemist to tell them that sodium hydroxide could not work as a refrigerant in the capacity described by concurring Dstl witnesses. Dr. Yong was then released from prison.

He endured 14 months of criminal proceedings which ended in January. Eventually, the most serious Section 4 Explosives Act 1883 charges were dropped, and 4 new charges under the Health & Safety at Work Act 1973 were brought in. A conviction was not secured on the new charges.

Moral of the story:
1. Even if you have bona fide UK government contracts and a high security clearance, if you have a chemistry lab at home, you are a terrorism suspect.

2. The level of education in the UK has fallen so far that mid-high ranking officers in the Defence Science & Technology Laboratory have no clue that adding water to sodium hydroxide is an exothermic reaction, while adding water to ammonium nitrate is an endothermic reaction. If you are going to collude to lie, at least do your homework to keep your lies consistent with the laws of chemistry!

3. Apparently, the UK police and Crown Prosecution Service believe Dstl witnesses in preference to the laws of chemical thermodynamics.

4. In 2012, the UK Ministry of Defence publicly asked its contractors to help them with "Finding the Threat". Dr. Yong thought about the problem and figured out how to make a high vapour pressure neurotoxin using readily available equipment and chemicals. He was asked to submit the security threat to UK MOD in writing, and three weeks later his house was raided. If you think of similar public security risks, do yourself a favor, don't be a chump and tell the government, or you will become a security risk yourself in this day and age of chemophobia.

5. Spread the word. If you can find anyone who is in a position to assist Dr. Yong, particularly in terms of legal action (particularly in the malicious prosecution, wrongful imprisonment, breach of contract or human rights areas) or media/publicity, please contact him directly. His company was Novel Defence Engineering.

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[Edited on 20-9-2014 by Harbinger]

[Edited on 29-3-2015 by Bert]

British government treachery: CPS' deceit to try to get a conviction of a Dstl contractor

HMG Treachery - 26-3-2015 at 12:12

Dear Sciecemadness folk,

If you are thinking of working with Dstl (Defence Science & Technology Laboratory - part of the UK Ministry of Defence) - think again.

Lessons:
1. Don't work with, work for, help or trust the British government.
2. The British government makes a big fuss about human rights and rule of law, but they are the biggest breakers of it.


Hope you find the material informative.


Re: Dr. Yong/Dstl/CPS/Cambridgeshire police case

Some of the deceit employed by the British Crown Prosecution Service, to achieve a conviction.

Summary:

Malicious prosecution to shut down and end the career of a well-meaning British scientist/contractor, who identified a serious security risk at the British government's request in the form of an improvised nerve gas generator. The British government repaid Dr. Yong's goodwill for the safety of the British public with a stab in the back - 2 months wrongful imprisonment, 14 months sham prosecution and a ruined life/career.



We have received some documents about this case, and have decided to make them public.

Original indictment, 8/3/12:
http://document.li/FTP3

Correspondence between Sir Jim Paice, MP and Dr. Yong, 19/11/12:
http://document.li/04d4/

Correspondence between the Solicitor General, Oliver Heald MP, and Sir Jim Paice, 13/11/12:
http://document.li/I2S8/

New indictment, 7/11/12:
http://document.li/j6Q6

Pre-trial review court proceedings, 18/11/12:
http://document.li/iyGw

Letter from Dr. Yong's solicitor, to CPS, 21/11/12:
http://document.li/L9Jb

CPS' response, 28/11/12:
http://document.li/ykYS

Explanation:
1. The original indictment is provided: http://document.li/FTP3 . Dr. Yong was imprisoned on these charges. The Explosives Act offences are indictable offences which require the Attorney General's consent to charge. No such consent was obtained until after Dr. Yong was bailed from prison on 3/5/15.

2. Dr. Yong was an established Dstl contractor with an ongoing Dstl contract, a high security clearance that involved counter-terror checks and had bought the chemicals pursuant to his past, ongoing and future work with Dstl. Hence Dr. Yong enquired with the Attorney General, via his MP and unbeknownst to the CPS, whether the Attorney General had indeed consented to his prosecution. Dr. Yong's MP's response is provided here: http://document.li/04d4/

His MP, Sir Jim Paice, clearly understands that the Explosives Act offences have been dropped, and Health & Safety/regulatory offences brought in instead.

3. It turns out that the Solicitor General, Oliver Heald MP did briefly consent to charging Dr. Yong - after he was released on bail from prison - which makes the charges on which he was remanded into custody on improper, and hence the detention unlawful. The Attorney General then withdrew his consent, after the Defence served papers and appropriate supporting documentation, such as his Dstl contracts.

The Solicitor General's letter clearly stated that a new indictment would be served on Dr. Yong, where the Explosives Act charges would be dropped and new Health & Safety charges brought in. The defence would be informed of this on 7 Nov 2012.

http://document.li/I2S8/

4. The CPS were represented by David Matthew of Seven Bedford Row and Marti Blair, Crown Prosecutor.

Apparently intent on convicting Dr. Yong by any means necessary (we will get to the false Dstl/Cambridgeshire police witness statements in a later post, and absurd evidence such as a chicken soup shopping receipt in a foreign language) decided to deceive the Honorable Judge, Court, Defence and Solicitor General.

Their letter on 7 Nov 2012 is here:
http://document.li/j6Q6

The letter states that new Health & Safety charges have been added, IN ADDITION to the existing Explosives Act charges.

5. Furthermore, according to the pre-trial court proceedings on 18 Nov 2012, there can be no ambiguity that the CPS intended to deceive all involved, by presenting the dropped charges as still viable. David Matthew said the CPS will accept guilty pleas for the Health & Safety charges, in exchange for dropping the Explosives Act charges.

The court proceedings can be found here:
http://document.li/iyGw

6. A letter from Dr. Yong's solicitor, condemning the CPS' ploy:
http://document.li/L9Jb

7. Response from the CPS, caught in the act and finally dropping the Explosives Act charges:
http://document.li/ykYS

Improvised nerve gas generator proposal for UK MOD, and the outcome

HMG Treachery - 26-3-2015 at 12:20

Dear Sciencemadness folk,

Don't even try thinking about trusting/working with/working for/helping the treacherous British government. They have no concept of quid pro quo and repay good with evil. Spread the word.

Dr. Yong worked with the British government (see attached contract documents). Naturally, Dr. Yong had a high security clearance which included counter-terror checks.

Dr. Yong discovered and told the British government, at their request, about a security risk in the form of a portable, improvised nerve gas generator (see attached redacted document).

This is the outcome:

http://www.cambstimes.co.uk/news/gallery_man_33_bailed_on_su...

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[Edited on 26-3-2015 by HMG Treachery]

Loptr - 26-3-2015 at 12:40

I can't view the content.

What chemicals are we talking about? And what are the claims again?

HMG Treachery - 26-3-2015 at 12:55

We have uploaded the files to the SM server.

We understand that Dr. Yong had a laboratory/workshop as part of his past, ongoing and future work with Dstl. It had a lot of chemicals but the CPS cherry-picked the possible combinations which could be used to make explosives in the future (named in the indictment were RDX & HMTD), and left context out of the picture by ignoring the explosively-benign chemicals such as sodium hydroxide, potassium chloride, silica gel, ethanol, methanol, hydrochloric acid, etc.

There is an explicit, open license to the public to possess rocket candy for model rocket purposes, pursuant to Schedule 1 Part 2 of the UK's Control of Explosives Regulations 1991. We will also be posting in another thread how Dr. Yong actually asked Cambridgeshire police if it would be OK to make rocket candy, and they did not advise him it would be illegal to do so. It is perverse to prosecute him despite there being such a license to the public, and despite his enquiries to the police in good faith.

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Loptr - 26-3-2015 at 13:01

What does the nerve agent have anything to do with most of the attachments here? What exactly happened?

What is he being charged with?

Loptr - 26-3-2015 at 16:28

Looks like he got caught on gun charges, and then had some very general reagents, that if intended could be brought together under very specific circumstances to form the compounds of interest by the police.

So what does the nerve gas have to do with anything?

[Edited on 27-3-2015 by Loptr]

HMG Treachery - 26-3-2015 at 21:26

From our understanding, in 2012 as a result of the UK's new budget, the remit of the UK Ministry of Defence expanded from defence to defence and security. They asked their contractors (Dr. Yong was a Dstl/MOD contractor) to help find security risks to the public with the promise of funding to research and mitigate these risks.

The DIY method to make an improvised nerve agent was identified and proposed by our good Dr. as a potential risk to the British government. The results were two police raids, 2 months wrongful imprisonment, 14 months kangaroo court proceedings and a destroyed reputation. The UK Poisons Act was amended 2 years later in 2014 to reflect the precursors.

The charges that were brought against him were all baseless charges and he was eventually aquitted of all chemical-related charges. The charges are on the Indictment on the other page. Essentially they accused him of "causing or preparing to cause an unlawful explosion" and then changed it to improper storage of chemicals.

Lessons:
1. You do not need to be guilty of anything to have your life destroyed by the British government (and certainly others). Mere accusations are enough; you can spend the rest of your life and your savings trying to clear your reputation.
2. The British government will prosecute you not necessarily because they think you're guilty, but for other reasons as they see fit (we will go into more of this later)
3. Do not trust/work with/work for/help the British government in any way. They are treacherous betrayers with no concept of quid pro quo.

HMG Treachery - 26-3-2015 at 21:30

Did you spot the deceit by the CPS?

If not, re-read the documents and pay careful attention to the dates.

The CPS told the Attorney General that they would drop the Explosives Act charges (which he was imprisoned on remand). They then offered Dr. Yong a Fool's Deal to plead guilty to lesser Health & Safety charges in exchange for dropping the already dropped charges. The CPS also tried to fool the court, judge and the Attorney General by their deceit.

HMG Treachery - 27-3-2015 at 03:54

Thought we'd also include his security clearance, which we obtained along with other documents. It was active at the time of the police raid on Nov 23, 2012, his imprisonment and being charged with Explosive Act offences.

So even being known by the system, working for/with the system and having a high security clearance does not protect you from suspicion. In this day and age just knowing too much already makes you a suspect. It is better to be dumb and ignorant, busy playing computer games or fussing about what a film star is wearing or who s/he is sleeping with.



dva_clearance_redacted.png - 756kB

aga - 27-3-2015 at 03:58

Messing with Large Mafia groups is always dangerous, and should be avoided wherever possible.

Governments happily kill people as well, depending on how beneficial to them they feel it may be.

HMG Treachery - 27-3-2015 at 04:13

At least the mafia have a concept of quid pro quo! Can't say the same of the British government.

Loptr - 27-3-2015 at 08:11

This is all very fishy and ambiguous.

I am not the most familiar with UK laws, in fact actually pretty ignorant, but it sounds like something that happened to LittleGhost2. And we haven't heard from him in a while.

Loptr - 27-3-2015 at 08:15

Are you Dr. Yong? :(

blogfast25 - 27-3-2015 at 08:59

HMG, I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve by posting this case here. It certainly won't do Dr Yong's case much good, as few here will be motivated to trawl through these documents to detect the 'CPS's deceit'. I hope I'm wrong on that.

If you are, for whatever reason, trying to draw attention to Dr.Yong's case, I suggest you start a specific blog about it and maybe get some online petitions going to draw to traffic to it. SM is merely an amateur science blog, not renowned for its legal eagles. I doubt if any member here works with HMG or the MoD on science/technology related matters, never mind nerve gases.

As regards:
Quote:
If you are thinking of working with Dstl (Defence Science & Technology Laboratory - part of the UK Ministry of Defence) - think again.

Lessons:
1. Don't work with, work for, help or trust the British government.
2. The British government makes a big fuss about human rights and rule of law, but they are the biggest breakers of it.


That's such opinionated hyperbole that it's clear you're suffering from cognitive bias. Stick to the facts and let others decide who or what they'll believe.

Has this been reported/discussed anywhere in British print media/alter media so far? If so, where?




[Edited on 27-3-2015 by blogfast25]

aga - 27-3-2015 at 11:15

Threads merged.

Damn. I don't have moderator powers for some inexplicable reason.

aga - 27-3-2015 at 12:15

Having read the documents, frankly the dates are rather uninteresting.

Clearly the CPS has been instructed to hound you until some sort of conviction is arrived at, thereby disabling your reputation and certainly barr you permanently out of any government work, either directly or via a contractor.

It's the normal way they deal with workers who piss them off somehow, circumventing pension rights, severance pay, etc etc.

The fact that you're still alive indicates that :-

1. The work you were doing was not very sensitive.
2. Any knowledge you were given was of a low security nature.
3. Any information you hold is of no practical threat to any high-ranking serving HMG officer.

The key things you have omitted to disclose is Why all of this came to pass.

Principally, what did you actually do in order to piss off HMG so throughly ?

Secondly, why on earth did you have a pathetic 'explosive' mixture hanging around ?

All i can think of is that you did in fact discover/rediscover some portable nerve agent process, and tried to get some cash out of them for that, on top of normal wages.

I stand to be corrected.

aga - 27-3-2015 at 14:33

People go offline for all sorts of reasons, so don't go all Secret Service about it.

Zombie recently went all quiet too.

Arkoma has been off since a short time before LG2 came online.

Don't get it wrong : Governments are identical to Mafias, just Bigger.

The USA Mafia, sorry, Government is one of the biggest.

Loptr - 27-3-2015 at 14:39

I was just speaking to the similarity of a pytotechnic chemical gone wrong in the UK.

Yeah, where is Zombie?? I havent heard from him recently.

blogfast25 - 27-3-2015 at 15:56

HMG:

Why have you now opened a SECOND thread on the same subject? It smacks of desperation.

I'm still not convinced of HMG's wrongdoing in this case. For instance:
Quote:
At least the mafia have a concept of quid pro quo! Can't say the same of the British government.


...is emotive twaddle and nonsensical. Even if Dr.Yong was the finest and most upstanding citizen with a record of usefulness to HMG, that would not even absolve him from a traffic offence, never mind something more serious. That's how the Law is SUPPOSED to work. 'Quid pro quo' simply doesn't come into it.

Please don't start anymore threads on this thing.

A moderator should now merge these two threads.

Chemosynthesis - 27-3-2015 at 16:18

The arrest was publicized in the Telegraph, I believe. I did see a story on it when it occurred, though I am not from that region.

As for Little_Ghost, I hope he is doing alright, but he did mention being terminally ill.

blogfast25 - 27-3-2015 at 16:28

One dstl contract is about research into "Self-limiting shape charge jets", another research topic involved nerve gas-related research.

From that cambstimes article (webpage, your link):
Quote:
Police dogs, a bomb disposal unit and a specialist search team were called to the incident. Investigations took place inside the property and in a nearby garage.


If Dr.Yong was researching these subjects in a domestic dwelling and a "nearby garage", then despite having relevant licenses, he may have been breaking several Laws at once. The Law being what it is (complex for starters and sometimes self-contradictory), one thing does not necessarily exclude the other. Licenses to conduct certain types of research doesn't free one of other obligations re. storage (e.g.) of certain materials.


[Edited on 28-3-2015 by blogfast25]

blogfast25 - 27-3-2015 at 16:42

Quote: Originally posted by Chemosynthesis  
The arrest was publicized in the Telegraph, I believe. I did see a story on it when it occurred, though I am not from that region.

As for Little_Ghost, I hope he is doing alright, but he did mention being terminally ill.


Unless the Dr was named, it could be hard to find the article via Google. It's likely to be unreliable anyway.

Yes, Little_Ghost is terminally ill.

[Edited on 28-3-2015 by blogfast25]

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 06:59

Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25  
One dstl contract is about research into "Self-limiting shape charge jets", another research topic involved nerve gas-related research.

From that cambstimes article (webpage, your link):

Quote:
Police dogs, a bomb disposal unit and a specialist search team were called to the incident. Investigations took place inside the property and in a nearby garage.


If Dr.Yong was researching these subjects in a domestic dwelling and a "nearby garage", then despite having relevant licenses, he may have been breaking several Laws at once. The Law being what it is (complex for starters and sometimes self-contradictory), one thing does not necessarily exclude the other. Licenses to conduct certain types of research doesn't free one of other obligations re. storage (e.g.) of certain materials.


[Edited on 28-3-2015 by blogfast25]


Dr. Yong did not break any laws as you describe. If he did he would have been successfully prosecuted on them. Furthermore the fact that Dstl issued him contracts on the basis of the work proposed and the working/storage conditions attests to the fact that even they were satisfed with the proposal.

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 07:01

Quote: Originally posted by Loptr  
Are you Dr. Yong? :(


I am not, the material came to my Inbox about a week ago.

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 07:08

Quote: Originally posted by aga  


Clearly the CPS has been instructed to hound you...


Not me, but how did you conclude that the CPS had been instructed to hound him?
Quote:
until some sort of conviction is arrived at, thereby disabling your reputation and certainly barr you permanently out of any government work, either directly or via a contractor.

It's the normal way they deal with workers who piss them off somehow, circumventing pension rights, severance pay, etc etc.


What other examples do you have to proclaim this as "normal"?
Quote:
The fact that you're still alive indicates that :-

1. The work you were doing was not very sensitive.
2. Any knowledge you were given was of a low security nature.
3. Any information you hold is of no practical threat to any high-ranking serving HMG officer.

The key things you have omitted to disclose is Why all of this came to pass.

Principally, what did you actually do in order to piss off HMG so throughly ?


So even you concede that his prosecution was on grounds other than his guilt?
Quote:
Secondly, why on earth did you have a pathetic 'explosive' mixture hanging around ?


Looking at other papers, we believe Dr. Yong had the rocket candy for model rocketry. Perfectly legal and the public has an explicit open license to it in the Control of Explosives Regulations 1991, Schedule 1, Part 2.
Quote:
All i can think of is that you did in fact discover/rediscover some portable nerve agent process, and tried to get some cash out of them for that, on top of normal wages.

I stand to be corrected.


The whole point of the bidding process that Dr. Yong was involved in was to fund R&D. He was asked by Dstl to submit the proposal about the DIY nerve gas generator.

Loptr - 29-3-2015 at 07:26

I have this feeling this guy wants us to ask about the details of the nerve gas generator. Then it looks like we are interested in a DIY weapon of mass destruction.

Why did you come to us of all forums? Why not the media?

(I am not saying this is a trap, just thid thing is really fishy)

Bert - 29-3-2015 at 07:28

Threads merged- Please don't start multiple threads on same subject.

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 07:36

Quote: Originally posted by Loptr  
I have this feeling this guy wants us to ask about the details of the nerve gas generator. Then it looks like we are interested in a DIY weapon of mass destruction.

Why did you come to us of all forums? Why not the media?

(I am not saying this is a trap, just thid thing is really fishy)


Nothing will be gained by publishing the non-redacted details of the DIY nerve gas generator. Potentially, much will be lost if it is published and falls into the wrong hands.

Do you or anyone here have any media contacts who would be interested?

hissingnoise - 29-3-2015 at 07:38

By posting on your two almost identical threads simultaneously you give the impression that you're incandescent with rage at what you see as unfair treatment by your former employer and that you're tripping over yourself to find some way to get back at them!

Unfortunately for you, it's highly unlikely that anyone here is thinking of working for the MOD!

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 07:40

Quote: Originally posted by Bert  
Threads merged- Please don't start multiple threads on same subject.



Thanks. It was actually two different subjects, but we realize it might look like the same thing to someone who wasn't previously aware of the case.

Thread A: Focused more on the MOD's/Dstl's response to betray their own
DIY nerve gas generator public security risk + Active security clearance -> Submitted to UK MOD/Dstl -> Police raid

Thread B:
Solely focused on the CPS' deceitful conduct to try to secure a conviction

HMG Treachery - 29-3-2015 at 08:17

Quote: Originally posted by hissingnoise  
By posting on your two almost identical threads simultaneously you give the impression that you're incandescent with rage at what you see as unfair treatment by your former employer and that you're tripping over yourself to find some way to get back at them!

Unfortunately for you, it's highly unlikely that anyone here is thinking of working for the MOD!



The threads were different. One focussed on Dstl's response to the DIY nerve gas generator, the other focussed on the CPS' response.

We are not Dr. Yong and do not think he is in a position to be incandescent with rage. Right now he is probably more worried about how to put food on his plate or find a place to stay, which is why we are picking up his cause for him.

Last we heard he sold his computers and tech, was homeless, jobless and a refugee, living terrified of further British government persecution. From what we hear, the British government also forcibly closed all his Natwest/Barclays/HSBC/TD Direct Investing/etc. bank accounts without any judicial oversight and seized his assets (Google: Can the British government extra-judicially close accounts) which has only made a dire situation worse.

blogfast25 - 29-3-2015 at 08:21

Quote: Originally posted by HMG Treachery  
If he did he would have been successfully prosecuted on them. Furthermore the fact that Dstl issued him contracts on the basis of the work proposed and the working/storage conditions attests to the fact that even they were satisfed with the proposal.


So are you now saying that he wasn't prosecuted after all? Only investigated? Or charged but acquitted?

What evidence have you got that Dstl was satisfied with the "working/storage conditions" of Dr Yong? That seems to me like yet another contentious presumption on your part.

Are those who bid for Dstl business even checked at all for the conditions of their laboratory? I somehow doubt that. If they did, then it seems astonishing they accepted his proposals for research (into explosives and nerve gases, no less!) to be conducted in a domestic dwelling and nearby garage, set in a non-industrial area.

Your case against the 'treacherous HMG' remains flimsy to me. Use of emotive terms like 'kangaroo courts' and such like make your strong confirmation bias shine through like a torchlight.

I'm 100 % for scrutiny of governments and law enforcement but I think you're not going about it the right way, IMO.
Quote: Originally posted by HMG Treachery  

Last we heard he sold his computers and tech, was homeless, jobless and a refugee, living terrified of further British government persecution. From what we hear, the British government also forcibly closed all his Natwest/Barclays/HSBC/TD Direct Investing/etc. bank accounts without any judicial oversight and seized his assets (Google: Can the British government extra-judicially close accounts) which has only made a dire situation worse.


And you heard this where? From whom?

Googling for “Can the British government extra-judicially close accounts”, yielded (related to Dr Yong):

Nov. 29, 2014, by ‘J.’ (guest)

http://www.accountantforums.com/threads/urgent-advice-can-na... (one post, no replies)

March 26, 2015, by ‘H.Jones’ (external usenet poster)

http://www.financebanter.co.uk/uk-finance/15374-can-british-... (one post, no replies)

‘H.Jones’ also posted the same text on google groups. Are ‘J.’ and ‘H.Jones’ one and the same poster?


[Edited on 29-3-2015 by blogfast25]

Bert - 29-3-2015 at 10:19

So someone ran afoul of the British government? Historically, that's a low odds of winning, surviving even is a poor chance.


Quote:

As long as they stick together under a strong Imam, they’re hard to beat. But after the Turks left in the mid-17th century, the Yemenis faced a much smarter empire: the British. Very few countries held off that Empire for long. Between the Americans’ victory in 1783 and Irish independence in 1922, not one country was able to eject the Empire. Tens of millions died trying — brave, brilliant empires like the Sikhs and the Zulus; no one succeeded. We forget that now, because . . . well, you know that amnesia flash device from Men in Black? It was actually the British Empire that invented that thing, and asked the world to smile and say cheese when it decided to dissolve itself around 1960. And like Tommy Lee Jones in that movie, their last act was to use the flash on themselves, so they could say in all truth, “Empire? What Empire?”


The War Nerd often comes across the spoor of these perfidious scum and the wreckage they left across the globe during centuries of successful looting.


Pardon me if I have little interest in the minutiae of this particular event, we kicked HM to the curb a few centuries back and have our own crop of lawyers, bureaucrats and other such shit weasels to contend with. The good Dr. should count himself lucky to not have committed suicide on a lonely moor with a dull penknife while under the influence of a cocktail of over-the-counter medications.

S.C. Wack - 29-3-2015 at 13:17

3rd thread

https://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=34423

aga - 29-3-2015 at 13:56

I think you can safely say that :-

1. There's nothing anyone here can do about it.

2. We don't really care at all.

Please stop posting the same thing.

Marvin - 31-3-2015 at 03:47

I, for one, would like to hear of a positive conclusion to this.

CPS certainly behaved shittily, but much of the rest seems to be mistakes/idiocy caused by the police worried about terrorism, not a deliberate attempt to persecute anyone by the defence community.

aga - 31-3-2015 at 08:55

The Facts are scant and we certainly haven't heard even half the story yet, so it'd be impossible to come to any Judgement at all.

Even if we all did come to some judgement or other, it'd make absolutely zero difference to Dr Yong's case, as we're just a bunch of amateur scientists, not a legal-eagle Star Chamber.

Then very best place for this is in the hands of Legal Specialists and/or the Press.

Open letter 3: Working with Dstl

jtate - 21-9-2015 at 05:18


Highlights:

1. Ex-Dstl scientist & contractor Dr. Matthew Yong discovers, upon Dstl’s request to do so, how to synthesize nerve gas in an improvised/DIY setting using readily available chemicals and equipment in 2012
2. Scientist also discovers a further invention of “potential national interest” – apparently an electrical power source for directed energy weapons and electromagnetic pulse weapons
3. Dstl betrays & backstabs their co-worker and colleague, and get Cambridgeshire police & CPS to arrest & prosecute – using the scientist’s own research proposal he submitted to Dstl as requested, as evidence
4. Dstl officers Andrew Hall, Roger Neal Smith, Maj. Ronald Thomas Cunningham Harley and Angela Howells issue false witness statements to falsely incriminate and condemn scientist, contrary to Sections 89 – 90 of the Criminal Justice Act 1967.
5. Andrew Hall, Roger Neal Smith, Maj. Ronald Thomas Cunningham Harley and Angela Howells remain unprosecuted despite committing serious criminal offences contrary to the above act
6. Scientist is wrongfully imprisoned without proper charges for two months and endures 14 months of tinpot CPS prosecution over “evidence” as contrived as a shopping receipt for chicken soup ingredients in a foreign language
7. Scientist is prosecuted for having “explosives” despite the rocket candy:
a. Being well under the license-able thresholds
b. Rocket propellant being exempted from licensing under Schedule 1 Part 2 of the Control of Explosives Regulations 1991
c. Not being an explosive in the ordinary sense of the word
8. CDE/Dstl steal the technologies. They repay his good faith with false witness statements, and do not pay him for his ongoing contract with them
9. Scientist is rendered homeless, jobless and a de facto refugee
10. British Parliament made an amendment to the UK Poisons Act in 2014, that makes the precursors to the nerve gas, previously readily available, now license-able
11. Paranoid atmosfear, devoid-of-common-sense “terrorist-around-every-corner” agenda suits power-drunk British police and CPS funding budgets very well; never mind whether innocent people, let alone loyal British subjects who worked for the public interest such as Dr. Yong, are destroyed in the process

Key Words:
Jonathan H. Lyle DSTL, Richard J. Bishop DSTL, Roger Neal Smith DSTL, Angela Howells DSTL, Major Ronald Thomas Cunningham Harley DSTL, Lynne Sheridan Reah DSTL, Andrew Hall DSTL, Matthew J Parish DSTL, Sarah L. Harper DSTL, Fiona Cotter DSTL, Ben R Swindlehurst DSTL, Jim Haley DSTL, Jonathan A. Byrne DSTL, Lesley A. Shellard DSTL, Jacqueline M. Pude DSTL, Steve Eley DSTL, Matt J. Chinn DSTL, Philip J. Packer DSTL, Vicky M. Torraca DSTL, DI Dave Murphy, DC Nigel Sutton, DC Peter Valvona, DC Gary Loth, Judge Nic Madge, David Matthew Crown Prosecution Service Seven Bedford Row, Marti Blair Crown Prosecution Service, Dr. Margaret Glendenning Cambridge University, Dstl, Defence Science & Technology Laboratory, Centre for Defence Enterprise, Crown Prosecution Service, Cambridgeshire Police, Ministry of Defence Special Branch, Serious Organised Crime Agency, Peterborough Crown Court, National Authority, Oliver Heald QC, Attorney General's Office, repay good with evil, Dstl contractor, perversion of the course of justice, CPS malicious prosecution, CPS Fool's Deal, Dstl false witness statements, DC 1626 Mark Yendley Cambridgeshire police false witness statement, wrongful imprisonment, wrongful police search, wrongful arrest, detention without proper charges, Dstl breach of contract, Dstl wrongful termination of contract, Section 4 Explosives Act, Health & Safety at Work Act 1974, Manufacture & Storage of Explosives Regulations 2005, Control of Explosives Regulations 1991, Firearms Act 1968, Criminal Justice Act 1967, rocket candy, RDX, HMTD, in situ portable DIY nerve gas generator, neurotoxin, DSTL Chemical Biological & Radiological STC, Dr. Matthew Yong, Thomson Webb Corfield solicitors, Roger Harrison One Paper Building barrister, Nick Barnes, Gemma Richardson.


Download pdf with supporting documentation here:
http://kvisit.com/QQ/_UY
http://www.keepandshare.com/doc14/9085/ol3-working-for-dstl-...


Attachment: OL3_working_for_dstl.pdf (1.1MB)
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aga - 21-9-2015 at 08:03

Is this the same thing as was started last year about this time ?

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=61926

[Edited on 21-9-2015 by aga]

Bert - 21-9-2015 at 08:11

As an acquaintence once said to (visiting the USA for first time English guy, an associate of the Rev. Ronald Lancaster): "We don't hate you because you're a gay man. We hate you because you're ENGLISH!!!"

aga - 21-9-2015 at 09:11

Jealousy.

Open letter 4: Working with Dstl

jtate - 4-10-2015 at 09:44

Fourth open letter in the series.

This open letter focuses on the false witness statements by Dstl officers Roger Neal Smith, Major Ronald Thomas Cunningham Harley and Angela Howells (Andrew Hall's false witness statement was dealt with in Open Letter 2).

It also demonstrates how top Dstl management (Jonathan Lyle, CEO Dstl & Richard Bishop CPO Dstl) were aware that their officers' witness statements to Cambridgeshire Police were untrue, but took no effort to correct it.

It may also be downloaded here:
http://www.pdf-archive.com/2015/10/04/ol4-working-with-dstl/
Quote:

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

-- Martin Niemoller


Attachment: ol4-working-with-dstl.pdf (3.8MB)
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jtate - 4-10-2015 at 09:47

Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Is this the same thing as was started last year about this time ?

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=61926

[Edited on 21-9-2015 by aga]


Yes it does concern the same thing, but from different angles. It is a complex case that can't be dealt with in a single post. One of the main challenges we are having in trying to present it to the public is to distill down the matter into chunks the public can follow.

Marvin - 4-10-2015 at 12:33

Why was the material about the blood fridge not in open letter 3?

aga - 4-10-2015 at 12:37

What blood fridge ?

aga - 4-10-2015 at 13:13

OK.

Fed up with this now.

The Facts please, and not the embellished bullshit.

1. What and where gained are Dr.Yong's qualifications ?
2. What was he Contracted to do - based on sight of the actual contract.
3. How much was he paid, as in actual monies received by him.
4. At what point in the contract did the police get involved (i.e. how many months).

Many more questions, however answers to those will do for starters.

This not a real Court.

Marvin - 4-10-2015 at 13:36

Everything apart from (3) is in the stuff previously posted. Dr Yong appears to be the real deal and what happened is shameful. I certainly hope he's on the up.

Bert - 4-10-2015 at 14:04

I will not allow any more threads on this subject to be started, one is sufficient.

OP, please post any updates HERE.

Bert - 4-10-2015 at 14:16

I stand by my previous observation...
Quote:

The good Dr. should count himself lucky to not have committed suicide on a lonely moor with a dull penknife while under the influence of a cocktail of over-the-counter medications, expiring from loss of a rather small amount of blood.


I really prefer the US's spook prefered strategy of ejection from tall buildings, overpasses and such. So much more direct- it suits international bankers particularly well.

aga - 4-10-2015 at 14:34

Right move IMHO - the thread i mean.

UK does similar with Imp[ortant stuff, which is why this thread is particularly annoying.

Dr Yong either tried to sell the results after getting the £, or something likel that.

UK gov would simply have erased his ass if it were something New, or serious.



Marvin - 4-10-2015 at 14:37

I was going to remark he was lucky to not be subject to extraordinary rendition, but yes Bert, that, very much that.

Edit,

Aga, nothing like that. He bought a large amount of ammonium nitrate and put it in some sort of lock up, and was duly arrested when it was reported. His alibi for needing it fell through when the company staff (mistakenly, it seems) reported to the police that the design for the blood fridge didn't use ammonium nitrate.

[Edited on 4-10-2015 by Marvin]

jtate - 5-10-2015 at 00:21

Quote: Originally posted by aga  
OK.

Fed up with this now.

The Facts please, and not the embellished bullshit.

1. What and where gained are Dr.Yong's qualifications ?
2. What was he Contracted to do - based on sight of the actual contract.
3. How much was he paid, as in actual monies received by him.
4. At what point in the contract did the police get involved (i.e. how many months).

Many more questions, however answers to those will do for starters.

This not a real Court.


I believe Dr. Yong is a PhD in aeronautical engineering from Imperial College. The police confirmed his qualifications with the university during the course of the proceedings, according to the documents I have.

Aga, he was contracted to build a portable blood fridge to mitigate the death of British soldiers through exsanguination. The agreed work was practical in nature and required the construction of an actual technology demonstrator. The device AFAICS involved keeping blood packs in an insulated chamber cooled by the controlled hydration of ammonium nitrate if temperatures went too high.

He was not paid for this contract. Dstl does not pre-fund any expenditure, he sunk his own money into it and after he got raided by the police Dstl cooked up trite reasons for not paying him a dime. I've seen the contract termination letters and the reasons kept changing and are non-sensical. For example one reason given was that he didn't deliver the deliverables on time, but there are three "stop work until further notice" emails from Dstl prior to that which Dr. Yong followed.

The contract commenced on Oct 8 2012. The police got involved soon afterwards. The official reason was his purchase of ammonium nitrate, but the actual reason was his informing Dstl, at their request for security risks to the British public, of how to make a DIY nerve gas generator using readily available equipment.

jtate - 5-10-2015 at 00:23

Quote: Originally posted by Marvin  
I was going to remark he was lucky to not be subject to extraordinary rendition, but yes Bert, that, very much that.

Edit,

Aga, nothing like that. He bought a large amount of ammonium nitrate and put it in some sort of lock up, and was duly arrested when it was reported. His alibi for needing it fell through when the company staff (mistakenly, it seems) reported to the police that the design for the blood fridge didn't use ammonium nitrate.

[Edited on 4-10-2015 by Marvin]


Dstl is the R&D part of the UK Ministry of Defence. They aren't just any company, they are part of the Crown.

Marvin - 5-10-2015 at 04:27

jtate, what do you actually want?

Bert - 5-10-2015 at 05:39

Who are you?

What do you want?

Where are you going?

http://youtu.be/3aEH2v4_b4E

aga - 5-10-2015 at 08:55

Quote: Originally posted by jtate  
the actual reason was his informing Dstl, at their request for security risks to the British public, of how to make a DIY nerve gas generator using readily available equipment.

OK. So blood fridge contract etc are all just background Noise.

The issue is therefore 'none-of-the-above' but the Contract for the 'Security Risk Evaluation'.

Does such a Contract exist or was the work undertaken ad-hoc in the hope to sell the results to the MoD ?

[Edited on 5-10-2015 by aga]

Little_Ghost_again - 8-10-2015 at 01:57

Long read but I think I get it. The Dr had ammonium Nitrate which is not legit for anyone to have in the uk in small amounts. You can have large amounts but you need a reason.
So the Dr had large amounts for a fridge project/contract, this got stopped after he got the chems to do the job. In the mean time he was asked to identify security risks , in other words he was asked can you think of any ways that bad people wanting to do a lone wolf attack could do it in a way that causes a large amount of carnage.
He was working on this and for a reason I suspect had to do with probably getting screwed over for the fridge design, upset some on in the MOD.
So they arranged for PLOD to turn up at the place they would have known he had the ammonium nitrate, they saw ammonium nitrate and panicked (trust me I see this happen!). So the Dr says its ok guys I was/am/might still be working on a blood fridge that uses this stuff to cool it down. PLOD goto the MOD and ask if they fridge contract with the Dr, MOD say yes we do/did. PLOD ask does this fridge use the terrifying chemical ammonium nitrate?
MOD say NO mate it uses sodium Hydroxide to cool it down.
PLOD being PLOD then get CPS involved and the guy is bent over and arse fucked for no reason, except for two things I can see. 1) The MOD dont pay for things until delivered unless you have a mate at the top table in GOV or house of lords or you want to build a train set. So I suspect the actual argument that got him attention was his pestering them to pay him for work he did, but the MOD didnt want to pay, he made a fuss so they simply sent PLOD around.
The firearm thing dont get a gun in your mind, the device for spraying a nerve agent would be classed as a firearm. Most on here are probably thinking the Dr had a gun that got found, but from reading the papers and looking a bit deeper the firearms offense relates to the device he built to show them how an attack could be conducted.
The thread is badly put together and you have not released some of the facts, I can understand why but it wont help.
Many people have a LAB next to a property, my dad is one, ok its not a garage and we live on a farm type place not residential area. But he does it that way for security, far less chance to get burgled or whatever here than on an industrial estate.
In short The guy was stitched up, the real problem came when the CPS made a mistake. I dont know the reasons why but whenever they fuck up they go balls out to cover up, its almost like if you work for the CPS and make a mistake then they murder you, I cant think of any reason why the CPS do it every time. Surely cant be simple arrogance and pride that makes them behave like this.

For the record next year in the UK the shit hits the fan, you have no legal reason to hold many chemicals, this is why we are having a EU in/out vote. If we stay in the EU then the new regs are in conflict with EU law, if we vote out then the new regs are lawful. For chemists some of you need to start reading the small print of the new regs coming next year. Not just the pdf's put out but the actual wording of the statute.
Next year make nitric acid in the UK and you are Dr Yong