Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Remote controlled nitration and recrystallization equipment

Remote controlled nitration and recrystallization equipment

aldofad - 23-3-2015 at 04:18

Hello world,
hasn't someone ever thought to develop a project for a remote controlled hardware equipment especially dedicated for nitration and recrystallization operated in small scale by enthusiasts at home?
I mean a tipical Arduino project, economic, open source and 3D printed for the most parts.
The remote controlled operations should be:

The most obvious, put in place a remote camera watching the chemical harware
Turn on/off and regulate the stirrer and the hot plate's temperature
lift and rotate a beaker even from inside a water bath
pour powder in a beaker (this already cheaply exists, just need to remote control)
pour liquid drops in a beaker

Am I correct today? Do you agree with my idea? Will you give me a Nobel prize if I develop all this stuff?

No more dummies hands and eyes lost, just a big boom in the worst case and a new kitchen to buy.

Let me know your opinions please!

hissingnoise - 23-3-2015 at 06:42

Quote:

Will you give me a Nobel prize if I develop all this stuff?

Were they within my remit, I'd certainly award you the Prize for not developing a way of removing that frisson that got me into nitration and 'blowing shit up' in the first place!

[Edited on 23-3-2015 by hissingnoise]

vmelkon - 23-3-2015 at 11:53

It would be nice to have such equipment. Do you have a 3D printer? If not, you are going to have to buy the hardware.

morganbw - 23-3-2015 at 13:58

It would be a neat project. Not something I am up to but it is something I could respect.

aga - 23-3-2015 at 14:12

When i first encountered Energetics, i thought pretty much the same thing: Remotely controlled small scale chem synthesis lab.

Personally i just avoided Energetics instead, thereby avoiding all the work involved in making such a rig.

It would be pretty Cool though.

The tricky bit would be the Sensors, so you could know for sure that the rig was safe to go and look at in person.

aldofad - 23-3-2015 at 21:36

I'll work on this project, it will not take so much time as the development of my electronic detonator.
I'll start adapting one of many robotic arms cheaply available on the market

morganbw - 26-3-2015 at 13:01

Quote: Originally posted by aga

When i first encountered Energetics, i thought pretty much the same thing: Remotely controlled small scale chem synthesis lab.

Personally i just avoided Energetics instead, thereby avoiding all the work involved in making such a rig.

It would be pretty Cool though.

The tricky bit would be the Sensors, so you could know for sure that the rig was safe to go and look at in person.

I personally stepped away from Energetic's when the Oklahoma City bombing happened. It was very disturbing to me and I expected very strong government interdiction. Many years have passed and I think that I am happy that I stepped away by the very meaning of Energetic. ( I still have my fingers, etc... )

I might do some gentle things in the future such as a K-chlorate cell as I have some DSA's, but will have to soul search to go beyond.

sorry for the edit but some misspelling

[Edited on 26-3-2015 by morganbw]

[Edited on 26-3-2015 by morganbw]

The Volatile Chemist - 26-3-2015 at 14:14

It would be pretty frikkin great to go to a party, and every so often go to a corner to manage a Grignard reaction or chromatography experiment from a smartphone. Actually, that'd be great. Just don't let anyone hack the connection.....

aga - 26-3-2015 at 14:22

Erm, maybe you go to different parties these days.

As i dimly recall, at your age i went to parties hoping madly to get to have sex.

Never worked, yet that was more the idea back then.

The Volatile Chemist - 26-3-2015 at 14:30

Quote: Originally posted by aga

Erm, maybe you go to different parties these days.

As i dimly recall, at your age i went to parties hoping madly to get to have sex.

Never worked, yet that was more the idea back then.

I would be. Oh, yes aga, we all would be. But, you see, not all of us get invited to the parties. Thus, the going to the party part is just as hypothetical as the getting a phone part, and as the being able to manage a Grignard part, as the being able to do it from my phone part...as the not getting kicked out of the party for making puns, as the not chlorinating their alcohol supply...

aga - 26-3-2015 at 14:37

One Part may be in your control : host a a Party ?

Edit:

... then you get to do the Inviting.

[Edited on 26-3-2015 by aga]

The Volatile Chemist - 27-3-2015 at 08:10

Haha, but who would I invite? I don't have any friends!

No, I have like four friends, and they're all nerdy guys. It'd be pretty weird

And they'd all be intrigued by the device, so I wouldn't be able to feel condescending

blargish - 27-3-2015 at 08:43

This could be an idea that I bring to my hockey team's rook party

Chemistry themed rookie hazing! Now that's something nobody will see coming

On the topic at hand: That seems like a really interesting idea! There probably should be safety measures in place too in case of runaway or something of the sort.

The Volatile Chemist - 27-3-2015 at 09:40

Hazing through nitration? Just chlorinate their alcohol supply!

aga - 15-9-2016 at 11:06

Quote: Originally posted by The Volatile Chemist

It would be pretty frikkin great to go to a party, and every so often go to a corner to manage a Grignard reaction or chromatography experiment from a smartphone.

Recently i came across IoT and have been doing a bit of work on it.

The instant i encountered IoT, i remembered that post by TVC.

In the not-too-distant future what was hoped for may be actually easy and cheap to achieve - if what i'm messing with works out of course (need the Chinese to co-operate).

I've asked before, yet will ask again - is there any member who can do java/ajax/php/website design on a paid-for basis ?

The brief is for a website for which the flow & logic have already been worked out.

Knowledge of javascript would be essential, although i'll do all the ajax/php/sql backend stuff.

Basically i need a good looking website/front end with nice looking blobs that people can drag around the screen.

Bert - 15-9-2016 at 19:34

Please check out the USA attempt to construct a remotely operated (safe, right?) BLACK POWDER MILL.

Unfortunately, when developing a new chemical/energetic materials processing line, although it may be intended to run without human presence in production mode- Those implementing said installation, new facility that such would be, must be present and frequently RIGHT NEXT TO THE DAMN THING while doing start up, test runs, getting everything calibrated and dialed in...

And that is how the primary entrepreneurs and majority of the technical staff of that USA powder mill startup all got killed in a single accident, before shipping even the first cases of finished powder.

Sorry. Machines made by amateur and beginner explosives enthusiasts are possibly the only thing MORE likely to have a serious incident than an actual amateur attempting to learn energetics synthesis and processing the good old fashioned way- hands on, their own eyes on, olfactory lobes involved and no extraneous electrical/mechanical devices to screw the operation up- and a healthy dose of FEAR for their own safety informing their decisions.

AJKOER - 17-9-2016 at 06:26

Remote controlled chemistry gives me a good movie idea!

The police move in or a clandestine lab. There is absolute quiet. They break down the door and start shooting (in self defense of course) to find a robot (now deceased, apparent suicide) and a remote run lab.

Movie fiction or the future?

[Edited on 17-9-2016 by AJKOER]

The Volatile Chemist - 17-9-2016 at 08:35

Quote: Originally posted by aga

Quote: Originally posted by The Volatile Chemist

It would be pretty frikkin great to go to a party, and every so often go to a corner to manage a Grignard reaction or chromatography experiment from a smartphone.

Quote: Originally posted by Bert

Please check out the USA attempt to construct a remotely operated (safe, right?) BLACK POWDER MILL.

Unfortunately, when developing a new chemical/energetic materials processing line, although it may be intended to run without human presence in production mode- Those implementing said installation, new facility that such would be, must be present and frequently RIGHT NEXT TO THE DAMN THING while doing start up, test runs, getting everything calibrated and dialed in...

And that is how the primary entrepreneurs and majority of the technical staff of that USA powder mill startup all got killed in a single accident, before shipping even the first cases of finished powder.

Sorry. Machines made by amateur and beginner explosives enthusiasts are possibly the only thing MORE likely to have a serious incident than an actual amateur attempting to learn energetics synthesis and processing the good old fashioned way- hands on, their own eyes on, olfactory lobes involved and no extraneous electrical/mechanical devices to screw the operation up- and a healthy dose of FEAR for their own safety informing their decisions.

Haha, I remember posting that. It was assuming I'd ever get to go to a party...

I'm sorry I can't do programming for you aga, I'd love to. You've got a cool idea. But for me, all I'd want would be a camera on the reaction, a temp readout, and a remotely controlled hotplate adjuster or addition funnel. And I'm no pyro enthusiast. It would be for fun, and although you are right in that it would be much less safe, it most certainly wouldn't be for milling powder or making something dangerous. It would be for nitrations, for knowing when to stop distilling a product, etc. And in reality it would only be able to work for short absences form the lab, not for partying...

aga - 17-9-2016 at 08:38

Quote: Originally posted by AJKOER

find a robot (now deceased, apparent suicide) and a remote run lab.

Movie fiction or the future?

That is entirely possible with off-the-shelf components today, although it would take a fair bit of skill and $ to put a system like that together.

Where drugs are concerned, human robots are cheaper and more easily replaced.

[Edited on 17-9-2016 by aga]

aga - 17-9-2016 at 08:50

Quote: Originally posted by The Volatile Chemist

all I'd want would be a camera on the reaction, a temp readout, and a remotely controlled hotplate adjuster or addition funnel.

Remote cameras are out of the scope of IoT, but you can get cheap internet cameras online for peanuts.

temp readout = remote thermometer.
hotplate = remote PID controller
stirrer = same
addition funnel stopcock = remote servo.

For a simple distillation i'd set it up to maintain whatever C in the pot until the thermometer hits whatever the target temperature is, use a servo to shift the condenser output to the collection bottle, then shut it all down when the thermometer hits an upper limit or a timer expired, then press Go.

On the way to the party i'd buy some booze, then 'test' it to make sure it was OK.

12 hours later, wake up naked in a bush somewhere with a new tattoo and a traffic cone on my head.