I need help! for electrodeposition of copper

guys plz have a look at this

And this

as you can see the deposited layer of Cu is seprated it looks like a hat! for that Al object , when i was removing it i used lots of force ! and the Cu thing is strong enough that wont be torn apart with ease!

[Edited on 18-7-2014 by wish i had a kraken!!!]

The Cu object achived by electrodeposition of Cu on Al

a softer plate may be helpful for adherence. meaning the tensile strength of the copper is decreased with an alternative plating bath. sulfamic acid is known to lay down copper and nickel with low tensile strength. it can be advantageous when mobility is required, or if the strain of the copper would otherwise impede the metal below. looking into the sulfamic acid method, it was stated that some articles plated with standard acidic copper baths would actually lay down with so much strain it would lead to early failure of the metal below with mild/moderate use, even steel.

all my pdf's on sulfamic acid are on another computer, sorry I can't just link or attach them. on the hathi book trust site there are several books available about electroforming/electrodeposition of nickel for rocket thrust cones. they went into a fair amount of detail while describing the method of laying cooling and preheating plumbing into a solid nickel inner jacket, or filling over other metal jackets. Ill try to find one of those real quick,...
NASA technical memorandum:
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uiug.30112106563783;vi...
pg. 3 starts to talk about the sulfamic acid electrodeposition of nickel with a boric acid pH adjustment to ensure proper finished material characteristics.

handbook of practical electroplating:
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015000449119;vie...

electroplating for the metallurgist, engineer and chemist:
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=wu.89089717318;view=1u...

plating on aluminum, a thesis for bachelor degree:
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=wu.89085049575;view=1u...
pg. 3 " pure aluminum, when exposed to air, is acted upon by free oxygen in air, with a resulting layer of alumina. a studies of aluminum rectifiers has revealed the fact that it takes but approximately one one-thousandth of a second for a layer of alumina to be formed on the aluminum, where the metal is used as an anode in an electrolytic cell"

development of a soft soldering system for aluminum:
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015078488718;vie...

that should get ya started there is a LOT of freaking info on that site. I fully suggest getting the hathi-helper program to snag searchable pdf's. once you start downloading, you will find they have books on things you didn't even know you were interested in
-Violet Sin-

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin

a softer plate may be helpful for adherence. meaning the tensile strength of the copper is decreased with an alternative plating bath. sulfamic acid is known to lay down copper and nickel with low tensile strength. it can be advantageous when mobility is required, or if the strain of the copper would otherwise impede the metal below. looking into the sulfamic acid method, it was stated that some articles plated with standard acidic copper baths would actually lay down with so much strain it would lead to early failure of the metal below with mild/moderate use, even steel. all my pdf's on sulfamic acid are on another computer, sorry I can't just link or attach them. on the hathi book trust site there are several books available about electroforming/electrodeposition of nickel for rocket thrust cones. they went into a fair amount of detail while describing the method of laying cooling and preheating plumbing into a solid nickel inner jacket, or filling over other metal jackets. Ill try to find one of those real quick,... NASA technical memorandum: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uiug.30112106563783;vi... pg. 3 starts to talk about the sulfamic acid electrodeposition of nickel with a boric acid pH adjustment to ensure proper finished material characteristics. handbook of practical electroplating: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015000449119;vie... electroplating for the metallurgist, engineer and chemist: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=wu.89089717318;view=1u... plating on aluminum, a thesis for bachelor degree: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=wu.89085049575;view=1u... pg. 3 " pure aluminum, when exposed to air, is acted upon by free oxygen in air, with a resulting layer of alumina. a studies of aluminum rectifiers has revealed the fact that it takes but approximately one one-thousandth of a second for a layer of alumina to be formed on the aluminum, where the metal is used as an anode in an electrolytic cell" development of a soft soldering system for aluminum: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015078488718;vie... that should get ya started there is a LOT of freaking info on that site. I fully suggest getting the hathi-helper program to snag searchable pdf's. once you start downloading, you will find they have books on things you didn't even know you were interested in -Violet Sin-

Quote: Originally posted by WGTR

You can't plate copper onto aluminum using a copper sulfate plating bath. The copper forms an immersion deposit immediately upon insertion into the bath, and this deposit is not adherent to the aluminum. There are extra steps that involve an immersion deposit of zinc onto the aluminum from a zincate bath, plating with cyanide copper, and then copper sulfate to build up the plating. Even then, it takes practice to get the cleaning and plating steps working so that the copper will stick.

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin

they don't let most people download books. I have >20gb of books from there, use hathihelper to download the books, it cheats for you. http://qt-apps.org/content/show.php/Hathi+Download+Helper?co...

Quote: Originally posted by wish i had a kraken!!!

The Cu object achived by electrodeposition of Cu on Al

Wow. You've just made a copper crucible!

[Edited on 19-7-2014 by blogfast25]

Quote: Originally posted by wish i had a kraken!!!

The Cu object achived by electrodeposition of Cu on Al [/rquote] Wow. You've just made a copper crucible! [Edited on 19-7-2014 by blogfast25]

Thanks but its outter surface looks non-uniform it looks like tree ! :-) do u know any good application for it?

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin

blogfast25: could you be a little more specific on what you mean by this, please? I have gathered ≥20gb of books from hathi and I check my comppy with malwarebytes and avg at least a few times a month if not once a week. nev had any problems on my end.

@ Blogfast25:
ya I hear what you are saying, I have encountered that issue as well in the past. I have just never had any problem what so ever with hathi download helper though. I thought you were referencing a specific incident or problem. many a freeware programs have leach along programs, but many also can be carefully selected to not install. that is if you pay attention to each window that pops up while in the process. usually there are small boxes here and there, pre-checked, saying you want to install additional programs. so instead of just clicking, ya, ya, ya, ya, finish, you have to be a bit more discerning. and of course some installs just do it

I couldn't disagree more on your second statement though. to each their own I guess. almost all the papers/books from hathi are old, most not even close to today's technology. downloaded for reference and obscure practices/experiments. these guys have already been paid in full, lived a long life, and many have died since the time this was new. the only one not making a buck is the printers, and I am not taking physical pages from any one. its just data.
I am not one to screw people out of anything they deserve,.. golden rule and all... but I don't see how that applies here. I am not suggesting we ripp off current papers that took millions to research this year, and I doubt many people here would even have a problem with that. b/c, as amateurs we aren't making a living off this, we certainly aren't grabbing these and selling pdf's on ebay, we aren't building competing tech/info companies with stolen data, we do it for the curiosity of what we can accomplish in our lab/garage/basement/sheds across the world. specifically to understand it better, and of course a little braggin rights amongst our peers
knowledge was/is gathered for the betterment of all. this stuff should be free. technically, if I had the time and desire to do so, I could take screen shots of each page and build my own books. so if I can do it the really, really, painfully slow way with no law breaking. then why not use the silly program to do the same thing.

my 2¢, take it or leave it, your call.

Quote: Originally posted by arkoma

Copyright was instituted as a tool of political repression by Mary Tudor.

I would never charge for the info in any book I will/would have written( for a printed book of course, there are costs involved)... and you can hold me to that. the idea is to get more people interested in the field, and produce more progress. I have never felt at ease with those that would hide their work until finished out, just so their name could go down as the one and only visionary. only allowing others to simply clean up the scraps in tiny additional info packets as amendments...

reading on how older greats often chatted in groups about their research, and inviting friends over to have a look, put their spin on whats happening to get past stumbling blocks... amazing. showing a true care of the work and not the ego that seems almost completely gone now-a-days. every one wants to be famous and in books, spotlight firmly on them( for 5 min). then forgotten as we adapt their work for common use.

the worst part is practically being called a thief here... when I am clearly only borrowing it, lol. Alzheimer's to wipe the slate clean eventually, no?
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all that aside, it is killing me not to be able to get my electrodes in a bath and toy around( ). might have to visit the thrift store and devise some contraption. never fails you can mickey mouse something if you have patients, and a tacklebox of electronics bits, soldering gun, digi multimeter and random accoutrements. never leave the lab for long with out it.

I have a BIG pile of copper just staring at me. Slowly stripping it all, except a 16' foot pair of jumper cables I made the other day from some of the main 220v buss line copper + thrift store + hardware store = I will have something helpful to post in the next few days. instead of defending my honor as a non-thief in a fairly nonproductive conversation.
-Violet Sin-

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin

I would never charge for the info in any book I will/would have written( for a printed book of course, there are costs involved)... and you can hold me to that. the idea is to get more people interested in the field, and produce more progress.