Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Fix or toss

bargles! - 8-5-2014 at 12:52




Should I try to have a glassblower fix this or would it be better to pitch it and get a new one?

Manifest - 8-5-2014 at 13:24

Welcome to SM! Ask around and see how much a glass blower will charge if anything, and then decide, if you can find someone to do it, I say go ahead.

subsecret - 8-5-2014 at 16:02

If, for some reason, a glassblower is unable to fix the problem, It could still work as a "messy work" condenser, or one that you don't really care about. Just use some epoxy to patch the hole, and stick a vinyl tube where that water inlet used to be. Then you'll have an old condenser for messy/dangerous experiments.

Welcome to SM.

Texium - 8-5-2014 at 16:15

Although I have not (yet) broken any major glassware, I would probably always keep it, just in case I could find an opportunity to get it fixed or use it for something different/less technical.
Looking into the broken glass bin in the lab at my school makes me sad, because I probably would have kept most of the stuff in there if it was mine, since it was mostly just stuff that got chipped. I've actually considered asking my teacher a couple times if I could go through it and salvage usable stuff!

gdflp - 8-5-2014 at 16:21

Haha, I know what you mean. I was throwing away a shattered graduated cylinder and there was a perfectly good liebig condenser with a tiny chip:(

Texium - 8-5-2014 at 16:29

Yeah, I think I'll go by after school tomorrow or sometime next week and look around. The bin is almost full and I could see plenty of very intact looking stuff in it. Although schools aren't supposed to give you stuff, if it's just "trash," it seems like that would be different!

Dr.Bob - 8-5-2014 at 17:55

If just the top tube was broken, then it might be easily repaired, but it looks like the top is also broken, which would be much harder to fix. It is also harder and harder to find a living glass blower now. I wish I could find one around here who was willing to do minor repairs. There is one local company, but they want an obscene amount of money to do work. But I am saving a bunch of stuff in hope that they will maybe give me a better deal on a box of work. You may be able to use the condenser as a reflux type condenser or even blow air through it for some higher boiling solvents.

But I do think I have one Friedrichs left if you need another. I think that is what it is.

Bob



[Edited on 9-5-2014 by Dr.Bob]

BobD1001 - 8-5-2014 at 21:30

I would have to agree with the previous posters in keeping it, you may be able to find a good glassblower who could mend the broken joint, and hopefully repair the top as well. If no such luck comes your way, I have had some great success in repairing large fractures with JB Weld. I use a diamond file to rough the glass surface (Silicon carbide sandpaper will work as well), clean it with some acetone, and then apply the mixed epoxy to the joint. Hasn't failed me yet, and the stuff is highly temperature resistant. Epoxy is also quite resistant to many chemicals, although I certainly wouldn't expect it to hold in the likes of strong mineral acids as well as some strong solvents.

aga - 9-5-2014 at 14:26

Quote: Originally posted by zts16  
I've actually considered asking my teacher a couple times if I could go through it and salvage usable stuff!


Route A : Ask and Ye Shall Receive, as says the Bible.

Route B : Take from the Garbage and It Is Now Yours.

A) is the Best plan

In fact, work out a Safety Plan : that would be their main objection.
I.e. how you would indemnify Them from any damage incurred by you taking broken glassware - they do not want a suit from a student saying 'They let me take broken Glass, and now i have cut myself'

Think of all the angles from Their point of view, and try to think of the Dangers to Them, and work out ways to make those Dangers go away.

If you get it right, they will be in More danger Refusing you to recycle perfectly good glassware, as the News Coverage would be negative.


[Edited on 9-5-2014 by aga]

[Edited on 9-5-2014 by aga]

jock88 - 9-5-2014 at 14:37


Could you grind an ground-glass-joint socket into it?

bargles! - 9-5-2014 at 14:44

I appreciate all of the thoughts! I will definitely not pitch this piece and see how well it can be repaired. I will update with my plan of action and we shall see how it turns out. I do know that glassblowers exist in a local capacity, I was just unsure of if its even possible to attempt repair in the first place.

subsecret - 9-5-2014 at 14:45

You could also cut the glass (rather difficult with such a large diameter) and use the bottom portion as a powder funnel.

HgDinis25 - 9-5-2014 at 15:21

You can also break it up into small pieces and use as boiling chips. Then you could claim to have homemade boiling chips even more expensive than those fancy boiling chips you get from suppliers...

bargles! - 9-5-2014 at 20:45

Quote: Originally posted by HgDinis25  
You can also break it up into small pieces and use as boiling chips. Then you could claim to have homemade boiling chips even more expensive than those fancy boiling chips you get from suppliers...


Best idea so far! I'd been needing to figure out how to get some nice boiling chips. I hear the more expensive they are, the fancier they work.

jock88 - 11-5-2014 at 13:43

HgDinis25 is an awful man

Manifest - 11-5-2014 at 13:47

Good idea, put them in a ball mill to polish them so you don't cut yourself

aga - 11-5-2014 at 15:59

Quote: Originally posted by Manifest  
Good idea, put them in a ball mill to polish them so you don't cut yourself


Glass dust ...

HgDinis25 - 12-5-2014 at 10:20

Quote: Originally posted by jock88  
HgDinis25 is an awful man


Sorry, can't avoid it...

Fantasma4500 - 13-5-2014 at 11:44

ah.. on normal school my teacher nearly threw the broken glassware at me
but highschool..
uhoh nope..
dont know where the idea of giving away trash got dangerous or whatever?

perhaps you could try to toast it with some reactive metal powder to try and see if you could get some bor out of it?
otherwise you could use the kind of sealant used for sealing windows, the stuff that comes in big plastic tubes usually sold at hardware stores, totally blank of what it could be called in english, and as another user said: use abit of plastic tube aswell, then it should work again, especially if its just to handle water with

chemrox - 13-5-2014 at 12:36

Never ask for permission. Rather ask for forgiveness after you've helped yourself. In the US chemistry has been usurped by lawyers so scavenging the dustbins is "liability" i.e they can't say yes.

Fix it by all means!

cal - 14-5-2014 at 01:35

I have had several items fixed by the following company for a reasonable price.
http://www.specialtyglassinc.com/contact.html :cool:

aga - 15-5-2014 at 13:34

Quote: Originally posted by chemrox  
Never ask for permission. Rather ask for forgiveness after you've helped yourself. In the US chemistry has been usurped by lawyers so scavenging the dustbins is "liability" i.e they can't say yes.


That is Immoral.

You *must* ask permission first.

Who you ask is debatable.

The Garbage 'Owner'? Yourself ? God ?

God always says OK.

Fantasma4500 - 10-6-2014 at 10:34

we once were to make benzoic acid, me and a classmate
somehow it got totally fucked up and we got zero benzoic acid at all, it was through H2SO4, KMnO4 and benzyl alcohol
so we went in and took abit of sodium benzoate and abit of hydrochloric acid
teacher got very quiet when he saw our yield topping the vacuum filtration cup
since then he has informed me that if similar happens i wont be allowed in chemistry ever again and might get thrown out of school

forgiveness is not a word when we are talking common core

aga - 10-6-2014 at 11:16

I would suggest that you misunderstood more than one thing that was happening.

#1 is that the object was not 100% perfect performance in making benzoic acid, or looking good.

The idea was/is to Learn.
So why didn't it work out ?
By exploring Why, you would Learn something, probably more than if it had worked.

By faking the result, you learnt Nothing, and THAT is most likely what pissed the Teacher off.
(it's their job to Teach, which means Help people Learn, and they're usually passionate about doing it).

I'd suggest you go appologise in person, and explain why you did it, and be totally honest.
I'd also ask to be allowed/helped to find out what went wrong with the experiment, so you know.
Scary prospect, but i think you'll find it pays you back in many many ways.

pichoro - 10-6-2014 at 16:44

As a teacher, I agree with aga. If I had a student do what you did, I probably would've done more than simply warn them. lol Nevermind that you fudged the numbers, although that does piss me off when I catch it in my classes; the bigger issue for me would be that of a student apparently helping themselves to the chemical supply. Even if that one reaction was safe, that doesn't mean the next one will be.

The common core doesn't protect a student from injury, nor me or my school from lawsuit if a student gets injured under my watch, so it has no relevance here.

[Edited on 6/11/2014 by pichoro]

aga - 11-6-2014 at 08:53

what exactly is 'common core' ?

IrC - 11-6-2014 at 09:23

Quote: Originally posted by aga  
what exactly is 'common core' ?


No one really knows for sure even though it is so pervasive nationwide.

I get the feeling it was invented by Groucho and Che while filming Reefer Madness in 1936. Ok, so Groucho was working elsewhere and Che was only 8 at the time but I have no doubt in spirit they would have been involved in it's creation if it had been possible. How else can one explain the insanity of it all?

Muffn Man - 11-6-2014 at 12:05

Wikipedia says:
The Common Core State Standards Initiative is an educational initiative in the United States that details what K-12 students should know in English language arts and mathematics at the end of each grade.

pichoro - 11-6-2014 at 13:24

It is the latest crap rethinking of education. I'm really not a fan of it, either. But I do not seem to have any control over the matter.

There aren't even common core science standards yet. But I'm sure they'll come along to give me one more reason to wonder if teaching is worth it. :)

Texium - 11-6-2014 at 14:16

Um, is it just me or does this thread need a little re-arranging? This last part of it really belongs in legal and societal, and has nothing to do with the original subject.

[Edited on 6-11-2014 by zts16]

IrC - 11-6-2014 at 15:47

Quote: Originally posted by zts16  
Um, is it just me or does this thread need a little re-arranging? This last part of it really belongs in legal and societal, and has nothing to do with the original subject.

[Edited on 6-11-2014 by zts16]


It's just you. aga asked a question about a term brought up in reference to a story in chem class which was further referenced by a teacher thus prompting aga's question. Where would an answer be given? Somewhere else where no one had a clue in context of the original question? The following posts are what is termed 'having a conversation', something best done without excessive 'thought policing'. While I liked bfesser, this over control was one of my problems with him. Usually it is best to allow conversations to be fluid as long as the original intent of a topic is not completely hijacked on a continuous basis, and/or where flaming is involved. The OP's question has as far as I can tell been answered already. You do have a point which one can say is valid yet I do not think minor digressions should be over controlled unless things are getting out of hand. You should have been here 6 or 8 years ago if you think it is bad today. So many sites exist where moderation is so oppressive I for one never go to them. If the place is so stiff there is no enjoyment of casual conversation why bother being there. If it makes you feel better I swear I will not mention CC anymore in this thread. I hope this helps.

aga - 12-6-2014 at 15:09

Is this a Forum where people Talk or is it a police state where people can say only Approved things ?

zts16, why on earth would you wish this thread to terminate ?
I now know what 'Common Core' is (i am English), and how some people feel about it.

Does it Offend you that the original question has been addressed, yet the thread continues due to Other Minds thinking about Other Things?

Yes. If the thread had been hijacked earlier by random nonsense, i would see the need for Moderation - by a Moderator.

We are now post-facto, so what is it that prompted your somewhat draconian interjection ?

[Edited on 12-6-2014 by aga]

Texium - 12-6-2014 at 18:40

Woah, I never said anything about terminating the thread. Just thought it would be good to split it in two, because the current way that it's organized doesn't make any sense. If this second part about Common Core was moved to a new thread called Thoughts About Common Core or something like that, then other people who are interested and might have otherwise not found it had it stayed a part of this thread can join in too. I think it's a perfectly legitimate and good conversation, and it deserves its own thread.
On the other hand, I guess there was no reason for me to interject there, as it wouldn't really do anything.

crystal - 24-6-2014 at 12:46

Looking at the bubble wrap I have to ask, you have just bought it and it arrived broken? If yes, you can ask for a repair or a new one, if the company you bought it from will refund you, thats another thing.