Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Chemical extractions from OTC medicines

Chemical extractions from OTC medicines

thesmug - 1-3-2014 at 13:13

First off: I AM NOT ASKING HOW TO MANUFACTURE ILLICIT COMPOUNDS! I know that medicines can sometimes be good sources of compounds such as bismuth from Pepto Bismol and Salicylic acid from Aspirin and Iodine from iodine tincture (again, not for making drugs). I absolutely love doing extractions like these and would like more practice with them. I was wondering if you knew of any other medicines that you can get useful compounds from (please don't suggest Sudafed).

thebean - 1-3-2014 at 13:41

Hydrolysis of paracetamol gives 4-aminophenol if that is of any interest you. You will need sodium hydroxide and paracetamol (obviously). You can purify your paracetamol through recrystallization (isopropanol works great) beforehand if you wish, but I chose not to do this, but I still wanted a pure product. if 4-aminophenol was more water soluble you wouldn't need to recrystallize afterwards if you didn't care about a few minor impurities but it has very low solubility so you'll have to filter it out. To get a decently pure product without recrystallization beforehand you will be forced to recrystallize afterward from an organic solvent (don't use benzene, alcohols or haloalkanes, the solubility of 4-aminophenol is either negligible or null in these solvents). I recommend acetone because it's cheap and easy to find. There might appear that there is no benefit of recrystallizing afterward and that's because I can't really think of any benefits. It's more a preference thing as far as I know. You can make 1,4-benzoquinone (AKA p-benzoquinone) by oxidation of your 4-aminophenol, but take care not to spill the benzoquinone because it is highly toxic, stains everything and sublimates at room temperature. benzylchloride1's post has a great guide on 1,4-benzoquinone.

elementcollector1 - 1-3-2014 at 13:42

Bismuth from Pepto-Bismol: Acidify with strong HCl, remove salicylic acid (if precipitate), add aluminum. Melt product on stove (and make *absolutely sure* to horrify your parents with tales of radioactivity whilst doing so).
Iodine: Standard oxidation with a stronger ion (should give you all the clues you need right there).
I'm hoping one day to extract selenium from selenium pills for laughs, but why bother when I can go buy a selenium rectifier for $5 and extract it from that?

EDIT: Oh, I thought you were asking about those. Never mind.

[Edited on 3-1-2014 by elementcollector1]

thebean - 1-3-2014 at 13:53

Tell me how selenium extraction from the pills goes if you try it. I've been very curious about it.

Mailinmypocket - 1-3-2014 at 13:53

Extracting PABA from nutritional supplements is easy (just look at solubility temps in water) and useful for making benzocaine(ethyl p-aminobenzoate) as well as the other ester derivatives (isopropyl, methyl...). It crystallizes in huge long needles, quite beautiful if you cool the solution slowly.

Zephyr - 1-3-2014 at 13:55

I recently purified 4-Aminobenzoic acid from OTC vitamin tablets and after several crystallizations was rewarded with very pure crystals in 47% yield.
Here is the thread on PABA.

thesmug - 1-3-2014 at 19:20

Quote: Originally posted by Mailinmypocket

Extracting PABA from nutritional supplements is easy (just look at solubility temps in water) and useful for making benzocaine(ethyl p-aminobenzoate) as well as the other ester derivatives (isopropyl, methyl...). It crystallizes in huge long needles, quite beautiful if you cool the solution slowly.

Would it be possible to extract benzocaine from Orajel?

Mailinmypocket - 2-3-2014 at 08:35

Most likely(Id need to check the ingredients so say how though). Keep in mind the low concentration of benzocaine in a tube, the cost of a tube and the mechanical losses in isolation. Esterification of PABA with ethanol and catalytic sulfuric acid (procedures online everywhere, it's a common college lab) will yield benzocaine in the gram ranges at least.

I recall "strong" oragel being something like 2% benzocaine. 15ml tube of 2% won't yield much either, for 7$ a tube...

*edit* sorry... I'm not sure if you are only interested in extracting things just to extract them, or to extracting useful chemicals to do further projects with... In that case you could still try oragel or ask a pharmacist for some transdermal benzocaine. People get that to spread on areas a few hours before getting tattoos and it is of much higher concentration in benzocaine. It's quite expensive though and is more grease-like so it may be more difficult when you involve solvents.

[Edited on 2-3-2014 by Mailinmypocket]

Panache - 2-3-2014 at 15:00

I have often wanted to extract the calcium carbonate from calcium supplement pills, press it into a chalk stick and give it to my father in law as a gift. On the card i'll say this special chalk stick cost $40 (or whatever the medicine cost), you've bought hundreds of them you idiot.

Then I can launch into my bit on how everything is wrong with the world.

I don't want to do it now that I have had a chance to bore everyone here about it.

Zephyr - 2-3-2014 at 15:11

Panache, why not just use lime stone for the chalk?
You could also isolate iodine from tincture of iodine.

Panache - 2-3-2014 at 15:13

You could extract d-methylamphetamine from ADHD medication and use it as an intermediate to make the anti-Parkinson's disease agent Jumex!
I have to stop posting right now I'm being really annoying.

Zyklon-A - 2-3-2014 at 15:15

"You could also isolate iodine from tincture of iodine." Not easily, there are much better methods.

Maximus - 2-3-2014 at 15:24

Yes, extraction of compounds from meds is an interesting issue

At some time I worked with Povidone Iodine to extract the iodine from it, and no, my interest did not come from illegal uses for it, I can get 100 grams of iodine for 20€ if I neded it. I think one can spect 1,5 grams at best from 100ml of the standard solution (Witch I think it has 1 gram of free iodine and 0,5 grams of iodine asociated to the povidone as iodide, iodate, whatever) Trust me I tried every method under the sun and Povidone is a bitch, of course you can boil liters of solution or burn the hell out of it and then extract the iodides, buy I was looking for a more elegant method so I ended doing this: To a beaker with Pov-I soln. was added some aluminum foil and then, with stirring one adds little by little a NaCl + CuSO4 solution with a syringe. The Al foil reacts with the CuCl2 and one obtains copper powder that reacts to make copper (II) iodide and then copper (I) iodide witch is unsoluble and one can filter (The point of adding the solution little by little is to obtain a easier to filter precipitate) And there is where I gave up on that issue to try other things

thesmug - 2-3-2014 at 15:47

Quote: Originally posted by Panache

You could extract d-methylamphetamine from ADHD medication and use it as an intermediate to make the anti-Parkinson's disease agent Jumex!
I have to stop posting right now I'm being really annoying.

Wouldn't that be illegal?

Mesa - 2-3-2014 at 21:05

Quote: Originally posted by thesmug

Quote: Originally posted by Panache

You could extract d-methylamphetamine from ADHD medication and use it as an intermediate to make the anti-Parkinson's disease agent Jumex!
I have to stop posting right now I'm being really annoying.

Wouldn't that be illegal?

In case this was a serious post, I believe panache was being facetious.

Regardless; It's extra-ordinarily rare that a patient will be prescribed d-methylamphetamine for treatment of ADHD. d-amphetamine(or whichever enantiomeric mixture is still under patent at the time) is much more common, is this what you were referring to?

Edit: @OP;
Extracting benzoic acid from mouthwash might be interesting for you?

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by Mesa]

thesmug - 2-3-2014 at 21:11

Quote: Originally posted by Mesa

Quote: Originally posted by thesmug

Quote: Originally posted by Panache

You could extract d-methylamphetamine from ADHD medication and use it as an intermediate to make the anti-Parkinson's disease agent Jumex!
I have to stop posting right now I'm being really annoying.

Wouldn't that be illegal?

Do you have any references outlining the procedure for this? It seems interesting! And concerning the d-methamphetamine, I am in no way saying that I have tried this, ever will try this, or suggest that anyone try this but, I think you can extract d-methamphetamine from those Vick's inhaler spray bottle things.

Zephyr - 2-3-2014 at 21:46

thesmug, are you talking about asthma inhalers sprays? I thought that those contained anti inflammatory drugs such as Salbutamol.
On wikipedia it says that Salbutanol can be synthesized from acetophenone which can aparently be made fro salicylic acid.
Here is a thread on acetophenone although it has spiraled and no one synthesized it.

Crowfjord - 2-3-2014 at 22:54

I think the (nasal) inhalers have the levo isomer, which is only active on the sympathetic nervous system. On the label it says "levmetamfetamine," if I recall correctly. It's not a spray, but a little lip balm-looking tube that you stick into your nose and breathe from a couple times. They make them with other actives, as well.

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by Crowfjord]

Mesa - 3-3-2014 at 05:56

Quote: Originally posted by thesmug

Quote: Originally posted by Mesa

Quote: Originally posted by thesmug

Quote: Originally posted by Panache

You could extract d-methylamphetamine from ADHD medication and use it as an intermediate to make the anti-Parkinson's disease agent Jumex!
I have to stop posting right now I'm being really annoying.

Wouldn't that be illegal?

Procedure for what? Extracting Benzoic acid? I'd assume forming a benzoate salt, then displacing with a stronger acid would work. I've never tried it myself, just noticed most mouthwash bottles list benzoic acid as an ingredient.

The vicks inhalers you are referring to used to* contain l-methamphetamine, not d-methamphetamine. I believe it has been replaced by some cycloalkylamine in the last few years, though I'm not certain.

Note: l-methamphetamine has so little CNS activity that you would likely die from PNS related effects before you noticed any neurological changes. In case some dumb teenagers decide to huff inhalers all day long(probably too late on the warning though)

blogfast25 - 3-3-2014 at 11:30

Not a medicine of course, but zirconyl chloride can extracted from roll on antiperspirants (but not aerosol, apparently).

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by blogfast25]

thesmug - 3-3-2014 at 12:57

Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25

Not a medicine of course, but zirconyl chloride can extracted from roll on antiperspirants (but not aerosol, apparently).

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by blogfast25]

I'll try that!

elementcollector1 - 3-3-2014 at 13:02

Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25

Not a medicine of course, but zirconyl chloride can extracted from roll on antiperspirants (but not aerosol, apparently).

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by blogfast25]

I would imagine the yield is extremely low, correct?

thesmug - 3-3-2014 at 13:08

Quote: Originally posted by elementcollector1

Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25

Not a medicine of course, but zirconyl chloride can extracted from roll on antiperspirants (but not aerosol, apparently).

[Edited on 3-3-2014 by blogfast25]

I would imagine the yield is extremely low, correct?

I've seen them with up to 15% by weight.

Zephyr - 3-3-2014 at 15:46

Here is the thread on zirconium from roll on anti persperants.
It doesn't look like any one was very successful, and you are right, the yields were very low.
I am working on getting zirconium for my element collection from zirconium silicate from a pottery store.

jock88 - 3-3-2014 at 18:36

How about Codeine from Solpadeine (over the counter). I would love to grow some beautyfull (I believe) codeine Hydrochloride crystals. The pills contain approx 8mg Codine Phosphate Hemihydrate + 500mg Paracetemol (more crystyal?) + 30 mg Caffeine.

Cheers.

[Edited on 4-3-2014 by jock88]

thesmug - 3-3-2014 at 21:51

Quote: Originally posted by jock88

How about Codeine from Solpadeine (over the counter). I would love to grow some beautyfull (I believe) codeine Hydrochloride crystals. The pills contain approx 8mg Codine Phosphate Hemihydrate + 500mg Paracetemol (more crystyal?) + 30 mg Caffeine.

Cheers.

[Edited on 4-3-2014 by jock88]

I'll try that but I'm not making heroin

blogfast25 - 4-3-2014 at 05:30

Quote: Originally posted by Pinkhippo11

Here is the thread on zirconium from roll on anti persperants.
It doesn't look like any one was very successful, and you are right, the yields were very low.
I am working on getting zirconium for my element collection from zirconium silicate from a pottery store.

Actually, that was my extraction and it was quite successful. The Zr obtained was about 15 % of the product. It does have the advantage that everything happens at RT. Today I would do that slightly differently but in essence that method works.

There's another thread of mine on zirconyl chloride from Zircon (ZrSiO4) by alkali fusion on this forum somewhere.

Here:

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=13868#...

[Edited on 4-3-2014 by blogfast25]

Panache - 7-3-2014 at 07:45

I was joking and yes the ADHD medicine variants using d-methamphetamine are very rare, in Australia they are not cleared, in the US I believe their prescription rates tiny.
The nasal spray comments I believe are true however under Australua law if you extract this you will be could be prosecuted for methamphetamine possession as there is no disctinction in law for the enantiomers.

Zyklon-A - 7-3-2014 at 08:03

Quote: Originally posted by jock88

I'm totally doing that, I have access to promethazine with codeine. (cough syrup).

jock88 - 7-3-2014 at 17:17

and how are you going to do it?

dorkwad - 10-3-2014 at 14:18

You can extract acetaminophen from tylenol type pills and get para-benzoquinone from that, which is used in old school darkroom chemistry