Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Thoughts on this 'lab kit'

strangelove - 1-4-2012 at 15:30

Hi,

I'm finally looking into creating and stocking a home lab, and I ran across this a few days ago. I have a few questions:

Are PP beakers any good for anything more than dilute solutions? Would it be worth asking the seller to replace the PP beakers with glass ones?

Bomex has quite a bad reputation, is that likely to affect a home user such as myself who is just starting out? Should I go for something like Pyrex or Kimax?

Would it be worth the effort of sourcing the pieces individually to obtain better quality?

Other than a scale, is there anything essential that this kit leaves out if I were to use it as a shopping list?

Thanks for your time
Alex

Mailinmypocket - 1-4-2012 at 15:40

Quote: Originally posted by strangelove  
Hi,

I'm finally looking into creating and stocking a home lab, and I ran across this a few days ago. I have a few questions:

Are PP beakers any good for anything more than dilute solutions? Would it be worth asking the seller to replace the PP beakers with glass ones?

Bomex has quite a bad reputation, is that likely to affect a home user such as myself who is just starting out? Should I go for something like Pyrex or Kimax?

Would it be worth the effort of sourcing the pieces individually to obtain better quality?

Other than a scale, is there anything essential that this kit leaves out if I were to use it as a shopping list?

Thanks for your time
Alex


It really depends on what type of chemistry you are looking to do. This kit is geared towards biodiesel testing etc so as long as you are using common bases like sodium hydroxide and no solvents beyond basic alcohols like methanol, ethanol etc as well as aqueous solutions of common reagents you should be okay.

PP beakers are not at all my first choice... do you plan on heating anything on them by flame or hot plate? If yes then definitely go for glass. I have a few Bomex items and despite them not being as high quality as Pyrex and Kimax or Chemglass and Quickfit amongst others they are quite good. I would much rather have a few Bomex beakers and flasks than a bunch of PP items.

Look for items individually when it comes to equipment, try and purchase from the same supplier to save on shipping. Glass beakers are cheap and I recently bought some 250ml Kimax new from a lab supplier for 3$ ish/each, if I remember correctly. Some places like unitednuclear sell basic chemistry sets with glass tubes and beakers etc which may be of interest.

The items as described (minus being PP) seem good for a basic chemistry set, I would also try and get some glass tubing and stoppers with holes, maybe a burner too



[Edited on 1-4-2012 by Mailinmypocket]

[Edited on 2-4-2012 by Mailinmypocket]

strangelove - 1-4-2012 at 16:04

Quote: Originally posted by Mailinmypocket  
*


Hi, thanks for the reply.

The fact that the kit contained PP beakers was my main qualm with it, obviously as you say they can't be used for heating and they aren't compatible with all reagents. The kit includes a small spirit burner but I may look into getting a small butane torch with a stand to use it in a bunsen burner orientation.

I'd like a magnetic stirrer/hotplate but the price is what bothers me, I'm on a limited budget. I'll keep an eye out on eBay.

Unfortunately I'm in the UK so the delights of United Nuclear are unavailable to me, although supplies of reagents and lab sundries are easily available.

I've ordered a copy of Robert Bruce Thompson's "Illustrated Guide To Home Chemistry" which is due to arrive tomorrow so I'll look at what those experiments entail and proceed from there.

Alex

Mailinmypocket - 1-4-2012 at 16:16

Yeah magnetic stirplates are pricey even when purchased used. I just bought a used Corning PC-420D for about 250$ CAD but they are well worth the money if you can manage it.

Ebay has lots of glassware and whatnot, also if you do a google search for "(your city) scientific supply" or (your city) laboratoryt supplies" it might turn up some interesting results.


My main supplier is a medium size science company that sells reagents, glass and everything else to individuals and industry alike, prices are a bit higher but quality is excellent. Dont bother with the big guys like Alfa, Sigma, Fisher for chemicals etc as they wont sell to individuals and it is just disappointing.

I am in Canada though so things may be different in your part of the world... For the items you are looking for though considering you arent mentioning any chemicals it shoudnt be hard. I think Australia and perhaps the state of Texas are places that may be risky for importing certain glassware to.

strangelove - 2-4-2012 at 14:42

Unfortunately, the big guys like Sigma Aldrich are just as inaccessible to us as they are in Canada. However, some reagent suppliers like these guys state that they're happy to supply to hobbyists.
This supplier sells Pyrex and Duran and is also happy to sell to private individuals, but the price is a bit high compared to eBay. I might keep them in mind for more unusual bits and pieces. I've had a look at the equipment list in the book, and it seems like the most cost effective option is to buy the kit and then supplement it with some more beakers, as well as some Erlenmeyer flasks and other bits from eBay.

All in, it looks like the equipment is going to cost around £100 ($158 Canadian Dollars / $160 USD) . This is before even looking at reagents! A bit much considering I'm 15, I think I'll need to do a bit of saving.

I don't think I've ever seen a more useless piece of legislation than the requirement to register an Erlenmeyer flask. It could be said that most Texans are in violation of the law, posessing "a filter", "a heating mantle" and "a transformer" combined into a coffee machine!

I'll probably get a domestic kitchen hotplate if I find myself wanting to distill flammable solvents.
Alex

[Edited on 2-4-2012 by strangelove]

Organikum - 3-4-2012 at 09:17

Call the suppliers of laboratory equipment in your town and ask them who sells used equipment locally. Say you have no money but are interested in the science you might find most will be helpful or at least try to be.

Ebay of course but the prices are not so good actually (in Germany).

I found out that a online shop which is directed at schools and likes has by far the best prices on glassware here. They claim not to sell to individuals but that is only true for chemicals not for basic equipment.

Quality, or "what I would like to have if I could afford it":
Schott-Duran. Nothing else.
Simax (czech has good prices and quality, look on their webpage for the english distributor.
Pyrex is IMHO completely overrated, I was pretty disappointed.

The lab-stuff is despite China still completely overpriced. But sometimes it can be circumvented, for example I discoverd and use a hotplate which is actually a kitchen hotplate but a infrared heating one which has up to 1800W a glass-surface and inverter with hysteresis controlled power - to adjust in 5° increments from 20° to 450°C. 50.-€- Imagine this from IKA! 500+ I estimate. The infrared heating has the advantage that I can fix a RBF over the surface on a stand and I get good heating nevertheless for no direct contact is necessary. When the heat is switched off is it really OFF a big benefit for all those reactions which need heat to start but get pretty violent soon after. Actually most reactions I do....

Found on Amazon.

/ORG

strangelove - 3-4-2012 at 10:40

Hi Organikum.

Thanks for suggesting schools suppliers, I had a look at one that supplies my school and their price per item is about one quarter of what the first supplier was charging. The price even rivals eBay by quite a margin, and I suspect that this is where the major glassware suppliers on eBay buy their stock. The glass is Simax, which I hear rivals Pyrex and Schott Duran. They also sell Kimble for a slightly higher price, and Pyrex higher again. The only problem is that the only way to order is in boxes of 10, but I would happily sell a few on eBay or to another member on the forum.

Using an Infrared hotplate sounds like quite a good idea, I especially like the precise temperature control and rapid heating/cooling. If I don't eventually find a professional magnetic stirrer/hotplate I'll look into it.

MrHomeScientist - 3-4-2012 at 10:45

"The Illustrated Guide to Home Chemistry" is an excellent place to start - great choice! I bought that too and it's been quite handy. His YouTube channel, TheHomeScientist, also has some good videos. He actually took the name I was going to use for my own channel, that's how I found him! His book includes lists of all the chemicals, equipment, and glassware you'll need for any of his experiments. I second the recommendation to go for glass - much less worry about chemical compatibility and heating issues. Also, put getting a combination hotplate/stirrer high on your list - it's been SO nice to have. It's very useful to have a controllable heat source, and automatic stirring speeds many things up significantly.

I also might suggest that if you're just getting started with home chemistry, start with making copper compounds. Copper sulfate is easily found in hardware stores (at least where I am) as root killer for plumbing, and from there you can make all sorts of interesting and colorful compounds.

strangelove - 3-4-2012 at 11:19

Hi MrHomeScientist,

It is an excellent book, I feel that I could follow the steps while performing an experiment, and the equipment lists have been a great help. I hardly put it down for about a day after I got it! I also enjoyed his videos, I really wish he would upload more but I get the feeling that he filmed a few videos as a one-time thing. A stirrer/hotplate was listed recently, but it looks very old and battered and lacks the precise temperature controls that make lab hotplates so useful.

I've also found your videos very interesting, particularly the one on The Briggs-Rauscher Iodine Oscillator, I hope you'll continue with the Purifying OTC Chemicals series.

MrHomeScientist - 4-4-2012 at 05:29

Thank you! I'm glad people are enjoying my videos. The last couple months have been very busy for me, so I haven't had much time for home chemistry. I've got a big list of video ideas though, so I hope to get things rolling again pretty soon. Good luck in your own endeavours!