Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Scandium in Kona's bike frames.

Scandium in Kona's bike frames.

Romix - 28-8-2023 at 13:02

How to tell chemically if the frame contains Scandium or not?
A lot of modern Kona bike's frames containing 0.1% to 0.45% by weight.
Price of Scandium is more then 37k$ per KG.

I can recognize a Titanium bike, frames made of Titanium are very thin.
But Scandium containing Aluminum frames looks the same as Aluminum frames with out Scandium. There's no difference between them.
Ok if you not sure about Titanium frame, you can sand off a bit of paint of the frame and drop few drops of NaOH or KOH solution on it.
Titanium not reacting with bases like Aluminum do.

Romix - 28-8-2023 at 13:05

Titanium bikes:

[Edited on 28-8-2023 by Romix]

titanium12.jpg.0d9f122cc05d59a5fd78e8156f071c82.jpg - 279kB

titanium14.jpg.f67171938eb1a7e9242087512dd2de81.jpg - 327kB

Romix - 28-8-2023 at 13:07

These two are Scandium containing!!

[Edited on 28-8-2023 by Romix]

s-l1600.png.26cc5555a7bc06e66622b5540f3c5673.png - 1MB

kona1.jpg.180555e7d1c8c46d4173b69bf6dc341c.jpg - 207kB

Texium - 28-8-2023 at 13:28

The amount of scandium in a bike frame is going to be worth far less than the value of the bike itself… not even considering the amount of time, effort, and resources it would take to isolate the scandium.

Also I quickly found an eBay listing for scandium metal at a third of the price you quoted, and that’s for a single gram portion. Inevitably, the price would be even lower for bulk quantities: https://www.ebay.com/itm/394095765779?chn=ps

[Edited on 8-28-2023 by Texium]

B(a)P - 28-8-2023 at 14:03

Quote: Originally posted by Texium

The amount of scandium in a bike frame is going to be worth far less than the value of the bike itself… not even considering the amount of time, effort, and resources it would take to isolate the scandium.

Also I quickly found an eBay listing for scandium metal at a third of the price you quoted, and that’s for a single gram portion. Inevitably, the price would be even lower for bulk quantities: https://www.ebay.com/itm/394095765779?chn=ps

[Edited on 8-28-2023 by Texium]

That is actually about 300 times more expensive. OP was talking in kg. Regardless there is no way you could extract the scandium for that price. Not sure of the point of the thread though. A frame might weigh 5 kg, so you are talking 20 g at best of scandium in a bike. Or are you saying that a scandium containing frame has differing qualities and you want to know if a bike you are purchasing contains scandium? Lithium has also been used in an alloy with aluminium in an effort to make the alloy stronger and allow less material to be used. Just get a carbon bike.

Edit - My mistake, I missed the 'k' in the original post until I saw the post from violet sin. Agreed with what you said Texium.

[Edited on 29-8-2023 by B(a)P]

Romix - 28-8-2023 at 14:38

Quote: Originally posted by Texium

I don't know Scandium's price, never dealt with it.
Asked Google, it answered Scandium costs 37k$ per KG.

Romix - 28-8-2023 at 14:42

Quote: Originally posted by B(a)P

Quote: Originally posted by Texium

Hello Dear,
Yes, I want to know if a bike I've purchased contains Scandium in the frame as advertised.

Lithium??? And it's not washing out of the frame under rain???

B(a)P - 28-8-2023 at 15:09

Quote: Originally posted by Romix

Hello Dear,
Yes, I want to know if a bike I've purchased contains Scandium in the frame as advertised.

Lithium??? And it's not washing out of the frame under rain???

Metals behave differently once they are alloyed. Magnesium will readily corrode when exposed to the elements, but is an important part of most aluminium alloys.
There are so many different aluminium alloys, you are going to have a very hard time telling them apart. The only non-destructive way I could think of would be with the use of an XRF, though most hobbiests will not have access to this sort of equipment.

averageaussie - 28-8-2023 at 15:19

don't know where you are getting your metals from romix, but scandium is very expensive.
6.5x silvers cost, over 50 times the cost of uranium, 26th most expensive element per kilo.
there is a reason that the bikes have at most 0.45% scandium by weight.
so the price of 37/kg is very very low, and likely comes from a sketchy supplier.

violet sin - 28-8-2023 at 21:09

@averageaussie- I believe Romix has it listed as 37k$/kg => 37,000$/kg that doesn't sound cheap. Unless I misread that in OP

I was unaware that the material was SOoo expensive, wow. A good seller off bonanza has for 14$/g thanks for reminding me, he had another element I wanted also in my cart. Picked up the a gram of scandium and 10g of praseodymium for less than 23$ shipped.

Texium - 29-8-2023 at 06:25

Sheesh, apparently the Aussies can’t read today

B(a)P - 29-8-2023 at 12:49

Quote: Originally posted by Texium

Sheesh, apparently the Aussies can’t read today

Yesterday was national take your pet kangaroo to work day. We were all a bit preoccupied.

DraconicAcid - 29-8-2023 at 13:12

It's easy to miss that little k, especially if you're watching over a roo.

averageaussie - 29-8-2023 at 16:29

Quote: Originally posted by Texium

Sheesh, apparently the Aussies can’t read today

if only it was just one day...