Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Survey: Reagent Wish List

LabDIRECT - 12-5-2021 at 09:51

I'm branching this off from the last thread where I said "I'd love to hear everyone's wish list of reagents - if we can get a better idea of what people need most and what they can live without, we can focus on bigger orders for more popular items, which will lower the prices a LOT."

So everyone chime in:

- What reagents do you order/use the most?

Currently our biggest items are Nitric Acid (Sale coming today!), Sulfuric Acid, Diethyl Ether, Chloroform, Anhydrous EtOH - what should we focus more/less on.


And for extra credit:

- Is there anything we carry at www.LabDirectLLC.com that you would purchase on a recurring basis if the prices were lower?

njl - 12-5-2021 at 10:13

Definitely clean and undiluted H2SO4, HNO3, anhydrous alcohols, I'm always looking for NaBH4 - best verified deal I've seen was ~200 USD for 500 grams. Glacial acetic acid too. I think it's one of the most versatile simple reagents, and right now it's a bit of a pain to get for me.

[Edited on 5-12-2021 by njl]

earpain - 12-5-2021 at 12:04

To continue from the previous thread:
So delighted to hear about the DCM price drop.

Yes I believe I speak for many when I mention the standard laboratory volatile non-polars. Be it for liquid-liquid extraction, chromatography of whichever sort, recrystallization, or just washings, this makes up MOST of what people do in Organic chemistry labs.



The other two major ones would be diethyl ether, and chloroform.
However, for those two, there are procedures for making them OTC(albeit tedious). However the prices I have seen quoted anywhere, well anywhere in the USA, for diethyl ether or chloroform have so far never justified buying them vs. grabbing a few pales of bleach, or cans of starter fluid, or even setting up EtOH-EtOH via H2SO4 reaction.

Next often in demand are the specialty solvents(sometimes reagents or both). These are absurdly unaffordable if even obtainable:
THF
Acetonitrile
DMSO
Dicloroethane
dimethylformamide
(basically everything that every lab has, but consumers could never afford unless they were making money using them, - thus no longer consumers)


Reagents/catalysts/etc:
I'll voice another vote for sodium borohydride
I see you already offer most of the reducing agents that the druggies took from us. White Phosphorous! Pretty sure I'd run away screaming if I saw that label(kidding)

There are various oxidizers and other reducers that someone else should speak of, not quite my specialty.

Personally, I also wish that supports, in the proper mesh, were cheaper and more available. Like chromatography grade silica, alumina, ion exchange resins, specialty clays like K-10.
Even TLC plates are so expensive.

Thanks for doing this!

njl - 12-5-2021 at 15:12

What reducing agents would those be?

Texium - 12-5-2021 at 15:17

Quote: Originally posted by njl  
Glacial acetic acid too. I think it's one of the most versatile simple reagents, and right now it's a bit of a pain to get for me.
https://www.dudadiesel.com/search.php?query=acetic

Mateo_swe - 13-5-2021 at 01:31

Hmm, i think this depends very much upon where you are located.
Im in north Europe and good sulfuric and Nitric acid is hard to get here.
Also many things that are commonly used are getting restricted for environmental reasons, like some solvents and Lead metal.
But most things are available if one search hard enough, but prices are expensive.
Much higher than i see in US.

earpain - 13-5-2021 at 03:22

Quote: Originally posted by njl  
What reducing agents would those be?


I had a playful tone when I said "druggies took these reagents away from us".
It's the authorities that did it, not the druggies.

red phosphorous and the mysteriously terrifying white phosphorous. Actually I don't think drug cooks ever had any interest in P4:
Quote:

White phosphorus munitions are weapons which use one of the common allotropes of the chemical element phosphorus. White phosphorus is used in smoke, illumination and incendiary munitions, and is commonly the burning element of tracer ammunition.[1] Other common names include WP and the slang term "Willie Pete" or "Willie Peter" derived from William Peter, the World War II phonetic alphabet for "WP", which is still sometimes used in military jargon.[2] White phosphorus is pyrophoric (self-ignites on contact with air), burns fiercely, and can ignite cloth, fuel, ammunition, and other combustibles.

In addition to its offensive capabilities, white phosphorus is a highly efficient smoke-producing agent, reacting with air to produce an immediate blanket of phosphorus pentoxide vapor.

...
Quote:

White phosphorus munitions were used extensively in Korea, Vietnam and later by Russian forces in the First Chechen War and Second Chechen War. White phosphorus grenades were used in Vietnam for destroying Viet Cong tunnel complexes as they would burn up all oxygen and suffocate the enemy soldiers sheltering inside.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allotropes_of_phosphorus
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_phosphorus_munitions


Fyndium - 13-5-2021 at 12:28

A steady and cheap supply of all kinds of solvents would be a life-saver. Last time I performed a synthesis, almost half of the total time went to sourcing, extracting and purifying required solvents.

I've been actually a bit surprised how well many common solvents and reagents can be sourced either OTC or by ordering them from some company that supplies them for some common use. Meanwhile, when they aren't, it can be easier to just figure out another way to reach your goal.

Restrictions regarding malicious use or environmental reasons are the biggest culprits sourcing OTC reagents. Sulfuric acid for example in EU has to be obtained through a company or by finding a friendly supplier.

earpain - 14-5-2021 at 12:42

Quote: Originally posted by Fyndium  
A steady and cheap supply of all kinds of solvents would be a life-saver. Last time I performed a synthesis, almost half of the total time went to sourcing, extracting and purifying required solvents.

I've been actually a bit surprised how well many common solvents and reagents can be sourced either OTC or by ordering them from some company that supplies them for some common use. Meanwhile, when they aren't, it can be easier to just figure out another way to reach your goal.

Restrictions regarding malicious use or environmental reasons are the biggest culprits sourcing OTC reagents. Sulfuric acid for example in EU has to be obtained through a company or by finding a friendly supplier.


EU vs. USA, Big-Brothering us via two unique styles(eastasia vs. euarsia?)*
I heard methanol and HNO3 and H2O2 are a headache in EU.

Probably the OP should mention that his online shop ships from Connecticut, USA, in the title or right under. Even if he does do international.

Also, kind of more so in eastern europe, where I was born, having a chemistry hobby has always had far less stigma, especially during soviet times. Science, science, and no god or politics we don't like. Keep at it with the sciencing boys and girls!

So I have some older friends who mention growing up in such a place, everyone equally so poor, that sources of entertainment included, making a 2L salt water capacitor, plugging it into the mains, and zapping each other as children. The adults would nod approvingly. I think we can expect eastern europe to soon rival China as a source for fun things like chemicals.

</end rant>
*George Orwell reference, only makes sense if you recognize it

Fyndium - 14-5-2021 at 22:35

Methanol is haram to commercial sales, but it can be sold as fuel or special solvent. H2O2 over 12%, HNO3 over few % and H2SO4 over 15% are also haram. Also one does not simply buy nitromethane, chlorates, ammonium nitrate and similar stuff.

Eastern Dysropa is already quite a trove for chemicals. I get my specialty ones all from there. One must be considerate at ordering anything in mind, because many western customs think that any shipments coming from eastern countries will contain drugs, counterfeit items, illegal immigrants or weapons contraband so they easily go through extra screening.

And I know my Orwell's too.

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 08:53

Quote: Originally posted by njl  
Definitely clean and undiluted H2SO4, HNO3, anhydrous alcohols, I'm always looking for NaBH4 - best verified deal I've seen was ~200 USD for 500 grams. Glacial acetic acid too. I think it's one of the most versatile simple reagents, and right now it's a bit of a pain to get for me.

[Edited on 5-12-2021 by njl]


We have the best H2so4 an HNO3 around - our H2so4 is titrated 98.1% out of fresh barrels (towards the end, it goes down a little bit just from atmospheric moisture but it’s pretty much guaranteed to be right in the 98% range, uninhibited). Typically crystal clear and very slightly amber. We also sell Oleum (20%)
and pure Sulfur Trioxide (stabilized and unstabilized as well) - Those are fairly expensive right now as (just for example) the oleum cost us nearly $1000 for 2 1/2 L after the cost of hazmat freight shipping, etc. However the price will be coming down soon.

HNO3 is 69-70% ACS grade - super strong and crystal clear. And we usually have at least 20 L on hand at any time. We also have red and white fuming nitric acid as well however the price issues with those are the same as the oleum.

And as for the Sodium Borohydride, we actually just ordered some on a trial basis and are going to be selling at 29.99 per 25g, 100g for 89.99, and 250g for 159.99 for ACS grade from our American supplier, free shipping! We could probably get it down to 199 for 500 grams but it would be coming from our overseas Supplier and would definitely be a lower quality. Still a high quality technical grade but unless there’s a drastic price difference, we would always rather buy higher quality from our domestic suppliers and make a little less profit than buy the absolute cheapest thing we could find from overseas.

Sodium Borohydride should be in Tuesday or Wednesday

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 09:50

@earpain
You're so welcome! For either and chloroform, we’re already by far the cheapest - our ether is BHT stabilized for a 3 year shelf life, AND comes in a PVC safety coated amber glass bottle with a phenolic Teflon-lined cap. No expense spared. The chloroform just got dropped to 42.99 for 500ml too - both are ACS grade.

As for the rest, we already have DMSO ACS Grade fairly inexpensive, and as for the rest, if there is interest in us stocking them in quantity (IE, at least 3+ people want to buy 500ml initially, and there’s expectations of regular orders), we can do the following prices for acs 99%+:

THF - 500ml for 39.99, 1L for 69.99
Acetonitrile - same as THF
Dicloroethane - 500ml 34.99, 1L 59.99
dimethylformamide - same as dichloromethane

Ill check about the TLC stuff

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 09:53

Quote: Originally posted by Texium  
Quote: Originally posted by njl  
Glacial acetic acid too. I think it's one of the most versatile simple reagents, and right now it's a bit of a pain to get for me.
https://www.dudadiesel.com/search.php?query=acetic


We definitely carry GAA - USP/ACS grade and can order tech grade cheap for you but I definitely second duda as a solid supplier if you just need something quick and dirty.

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 10:02

Quote: Originally posted by Mateo_swe  
Hmm, i think this depends very much upon where you are located.
Im in north Europe and good sulfuric and Nitric acid is hard to get here.
Also many things that are commonly used are getting restricted for environmental reasons, like some solvents and Lead metal.
But most things are available if one search hard enough, but prices are expensive.
Much higher than i see in US.


Good point - we're willing to ship anywhere and our customs forms are all defaulted to "Science Supplies" however we DO say that it's up to the end customer to make sure they are allowed to order everything in their jurisdiction. We don't offer free shipping on international orders unfortunately, but we only charge the exact shipping cost for any method you choose and we DO offer an $8 discount to anyone paying for shipping (that is our average built in margin for shipping costs and if we don't have to pay for shipping, we dont feel it's right to double dip, so to speak).

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 10:06

Quote: Originally posted by Fyndium  
A steady and cheap supply of all kinds of solvents would be a life-saver. Last time I performed a synthesis, almost half of the total time went to sourcing, extracting and purifying required solvents.

I've been actually a bit surprised how well many common solvents and reagents can be sourced either OTC or by ordering them from some company that supplies them for some common use. Meanwhile, when they aren't, it can be easier to just figure out another way to reach your goal.

Restrictions regarding malicious use or environmental reasons are the biggest culprits sourcing OTC reagents. Sulfuric acid for example in EU has to be obtained through a company or by finding a friendly supplier.


Like earpain mentioned under your post, we do ship from CT USA, but we ARE willing to ship internationally - check my post above this

LabDIRECT - 16-5-2021 at 10:19

Quote: Originally posted by earpain  

Also, kind of more so in eastern europe, where I was born, having a chemistry hobby has always had far less stigma, especially during soviet times. Science, science, and no god or politics we don't like. Keep at it with the sciencing boys and girls!

So I have some older friends who mention growing up in such a place, everyone equally so poor, that sources of entertainment included, making a 2L salt water capacitor, plugging it into the mains, and zapping each other as children. The adults would nod approvingly. I think we can expect eastern europe to soon rival China as a source for fun things like chemicals.


HA! I loved getting up to all sorts of science related mischief with my friends as a kid but that one never crossed our minds (thankfully or sadly I cant decide :)

The soviet system definitely had more than its fair share of flaws but that was definitely one area where it was always WAY ahead of the west and definitely had right - just for example, the USSR always had WAY more female doctors and scientists, encouraged intellectual and artistic pursuits in children from a young age, held the greats in the highest regard (think Science, Chess, Ballet, etc), while we in the west began a long, slow slide into anti-intellectualism.

Texium - 25-5-2021 at 15:56

Here's something that may be of help to you: I made a list a few years ago of what I consider to be the most essential reagents to "fully stock" an organic chemistry lab. I actually just got done updating it today! Added some more things to it that I forgot, or learned about since the original post, and removed a number of things that I decided were less essential than I initially thought.

https://texiumchem.com/2018/03/06/essential-chemicals-for-th...

If you're able to stock any of the "red" chemicals on that list, you'd become the only supplier of them that is accessible to amateurs as far as I know (and I'd be able to change them to "orange"). The "orange" chemicals on that list would also be good ones to look into stocking.

I'm also thinking of making a spreadsheet version of my list that will be a little easier to navigate. I'll post that soon.

LabDIRECT - 26-5-2021 at 01:47

Quote: Originally posted by Texium  
Here's something that may be of help to you: I made a list a few years ago of what I consider to be the most essential reagents to "fully stock" an organic chemistry lab. I actually just got done updating it today! Added some more things to it that I forgot, or learned about since the original post, and removed a number of things that I decided were less essential than I initially thought.

https://texiumchem.com/2018/03/06/essential-chemicals-for-th...

If you're able to stock any of the "red" chemicals on that list, you'd become the only supplier of them that is accessible to amateurs as far as I know (and I'd be able to change them to "orange"). The "orange" chemicals on that list would also be good ones to look into stocking.

I'm also thinking of making a spreadsheet version of my list that will be a little easier to navigate. I'll post that soon.


Thats a GREAT list Texium! Thanks. Definitely a lot there we don't have on hand but definitely a decent number of each color we do. We can definitely special order many of the red/orange ones, there are a few that none of our suppliers stock at the moment but we can try to widen the net a bit. If there are any you're specifically looking for above all others, let me know and I can put them towards the top of our acquisition list or special order them if you need/want them sooner.

Fantasma4500 - 15-6-2021 at 08:18

a gallon of Mn2O7 would be comfortable.