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Safe storage of DCM

thors.lab - 27-1-2021 at 13:18

Hi,

I just worked with DCM for the first time and realized, quite to my surprise, that DCM has no smell to me. This is rather concerning. Giving it's high vapor pressure I'm concerned I won't be able to smell it if it's leaking from its container into my house. I *could* store it in a shed outside, but this shed is not very well insulated and it gets rather hot where I live. It's also not insulated from rain or rodents.

I had a similar problem with my diethyl ether. That little rascal refused to stay in any container no matter what I did. Eventually I evaporated it all away because I couldn't find a safe way to store it that didn't produce gnarly fumes constantly.

Any thoughts on safe storage of this solvent?

greenlight - 27-1-2021 at 23:33

Interesting, dichloromethane smells sweet to me.

It does have a tendency to just get up and fuck off from whatever container it's put into indeed haha. I stored 5 litres in a HDPE chemical container once and I ended up with 1.5 litres.

At the moment I have it in a schott duran blue top glass reagent container and it seems to be holding fine so that might be the go.

Fery - 27-1-2021 at 23:42

You can weigh your bottle to know whether the content is escaping at significant rate. It should not escape significantly from original bottle. For low boiling / hygroscopic / oxygen sensitive solvents/liquids I cover the small gap between the cap and the bottle with few turns of PTFE tape (cca 1 EUR per 10 m of the tape in shops for plumbers).
Smell is very variable sense among people, few hundreds of genes involved and few hundreds of various smell receptors.

FrenchChemist - 27-1-2021 at 23:46

Only borosilica glass with crew cap from PBT

High leak tightness through use of PTFE coated silicone seal. More chemically resistant than PP screw cap.

Chemical chart of HDPE says is not suitable for the storage of DCM, ether and others.

FrenchChemist - 28-1-2021 at 00:42

Ohh i want to add something else because I forgot.
Out of curiosity, I checked the resistance of PP to dichloromethane and it seems completely satisfactory:

https://www.calpaclab.com/polypropylene-chemical-compatibili...

I also came across glass bottles with PP stoppers but I didn't have them for too long to observe a "loss" in the product. But if manufacturers ship in such packaging, they should be fine.

but as I mentioned the post above for a longer storage period I always had better quality bottles - for over a year and no loss

TriiodideFrog - 28-1-2021 at 05:24

I always thought my DCM smelled something sweet or ether-like.

I keep my DCM in an amber bottle with a tight lid in a cool and dry cabinet.

Dr.Bob - 28-1-2021 at 07:25

I can smell DCM and CHCl3 readily, and quite distinctively.

I find the 100 ml Qorpak narrow mouth bottles work well for ether, DCM, and simialr solvents, as well as acids, if you use the green PTFE lined caps. I have been storing solvents in these for years and the have been fine for a year or more of storage. I still have a few of these from a group buy for people in the US, I have 60, 100 (really 120 ml), and 250 ml bottles with these caps, some are clear, some amber, and a few 100 with plastic coating, for $2-4 each.

mackolol - 28-1-2021 at 08:30

Quote: Originally posted by greenlight

At the moment I have it in a schott duran blue top glass reagent container and it seems to be holding fine so that might be the go.

Yeah, the blue cap bottles do great job here. They're not expensive, but I'm storing my DCM for few years in such a bottle now and all I can tell is, that not even 1ml has escaped from it. Even in summer...
I believe that for ether it's the same.

SuperOxide - 3-2-2021 at 13:10

Damn this blasted thread. :mad:

Since DCM is rather expensive (I paid $41.51 for 1L), and chlorinated solvents are my favorite, I consider my DCM to be rather precious (I recycle/distill/dry every bit I can after use). I read this thread last night right before crashing, then I was thinking "holy shit... I haven't used it in like over a year... what if it's all evaporated and escaped the bottle..." all damn night.

Whew... It's all there!

I'll probably weigh or mark the bottle now that yall have got me paranoid about the damn thing, lol.

[Edited on 3-2-2021 by SuperOxide]

monolithic - 4-2-2021 at 05:23

I store my DCM indoors, never had any issue with it evaporating or leaking. My storage solution for solvents (or liquids in general) is ordinary amber glass bottles from Amazon and PTFE lined caps from here: https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23577&...

Best to check the manufacturer specifications but in general:
1 oz is 20/400 cap
4 oz is 22/400 cap
8 oz is 24/400 cap
16 or 32 oz is 28/400 cap
1 gallon is 38/400

The PTFE liner on the caps is soft and compressible (foam backed) so it tends to form a very good seal on its own, but you can always add a layer or two of PTFE plumbing tape around the threads of the bottle for an even better seal.

[Edited on 2-4-2021 by monolithic]

SuperOxide - 4-2-2021 at 07:16

Quote: Originally posted by monolithic

I store my DCM indoors, never had any issue with it evaporating or leaking. My storage solution for solvents (or liquids in general) is ordinary amber glass bottles from Amazon and PTFE lined caps from here: https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23577&...

Best to check the manufacturer specifications but in general:
1 oz is 20/400 cap
4 oz is 33/400 cap
8 oz is 24/400 cap
16 or 32 oz is 28/400 cap
1 gallon is 38/400

The PTFE liner on the caps is soft and compressible (foam backed) so it tends to form a very good seal on its own, but you can always add a layer or two of PTFE plumbing tape around the threads of the bottle for an even better seal.

Great link! I actually have some glass amber bottles that I got from amazon, and I did have a problem with some solvents leaking from them... then I noticed that unlike the similar amber glass bottles that I actually get solvents shipped in, the caps were plastic and cracked very easily. So I may end up buying some of those caps.

NaK - 6-2-2021 at 02:44

Some sellers - limac for example - ship DCM in HDPE because they ship everything in HDPE. That doesn't mean you should store it in HDPE but you need to transfer it to a glass bottle. I made the mistake of just letting it in the plastic bottle and after a year half of it was gone. Never again

SuperOxide - 6-2-2021 at 08:09

Quote: Originally posted by NaK

Some sellers - limac for example - ship DCM in HDPE because they ship everything in HDPE. That doesn't mean you should store it in HDPE but you need to transfer it to a glass bottle. I made the mistake of just letting it in the plastic bottle and after a year half of it was gone. Never again

Oh wow. That sucks...

When I first got into amateur chemistry, I found out there was a chemical supplier that's only like 6 miles from my house that sells to hobbyists (DCM, ether, chloroform, all the usual acids, etc, great stuff!). I purchased some ether from him, but didn't end up opening it for a while. Then as I read the MSDS online and found that it needs to be stored in amber bottles because the light can cause it to form peroxides. But he gave it to me in a clear glass bottle O_O
Luckily when I tested it for peroxides it was a null result, perhaps he had some stabilizers in it. But still, now I make sure the container it's given to me in is what the MSDS recommends, at least.

Chemorg42 - 6-2-2021 at 10:32

I get my solvents from hardware stores, so they come in those rectangular metal cans, so far, nothing seems to be evaporating from them (though I have only used acetone so far.)
Should I be concerned?

SuperOxide - 6-2-2021 at 10:46

Quote: Originally posted by Chemorg42

I get my solvents from hardware stores, so they come in those rectangular metal cans, so far, nothing seems to be evaporating from them (though I have only used acetone so far.)
Should I be concerned?

I haven't had any problems with it. However, if you store them in one area, you will eventually start to smell the solvents, which to me indicates that it's getting out of the cap somehow. I usually use teflon tape on the seals just to ensure it's at least somewhat sealed.

zed - 7-2-2021 at 01:11

DCM used to be sold in Gallon cans. Same as DCM paint stripper. Used it a lot.

Very volatile, nasty chemical smell, burns your fingers. Tweaks your liver. Makes you feel nauseous. Bad stuff.

alive&kickin - 16-2-2021 at 15:31

I know that DCM is getting harder to find in the USA. SuperOxide, $41 for a liter!!! If anyone is interested there's a company in Canada that sells it for $36 for 4 liter. I think shipping to Florida was $20, if I remember right. http://plasticworld.ca/product/methylene-chloride-dichlorome... Hope this helps someone.

mr_bovinejony - 16-2-2021 at 16:45

Here's a us company that sells it 60 for a gallon with free shipping

https://www.stellarchemicalcorp.com/product-page/methylene-c...

I keep it in the white jug they ship it in and it hasn't given me any problems.

SuperOxide - 16-2-2021 at 18:01

Quote: Originally posted by alive&kickin

I know that DCM is getting harder to find in the USA. SuperOxide, $41 for a liter!!!

Yeah, that's pretty crazy, right? So when I see videos of people just wasting their DCM (cough *Explosions&Fire* cough), I get a little jealous. I recycle every bit I can (then re-purify it via distillation, then dry it), and only use it for the synth's that absolutely require it.
Also though, I prefer working with chlorinated solvents. I think DCM and chloroform are just super easy to work with, don't have to worry about catching on fire, they evaporate easily and distill quickly.

Quote: Originally posted by mr_bovinejony

Here's a us company that sells it 60 for a gallon with free shipping

https://www.stellarchemicalcorp.com/product-page/methylene-c...

I keep it in the white jug they ship it in and it hasn't given me any problems.

That's a hell of a deal! I'll keep that in mind. Thank you for sharing.

Tellurium - 24-2-2021 at 17:46

Wow these are high prices, that you have in america, I pay about 60 bucks for 10L!
I guess the prices are that high, because of some enviromental fee/tax or something? At least I heard, that with Tetrachloroethylene this is the case, so maybe also with other chlorinated solvents due to high greenhouse effects compared to CO2? Even though the effects from DCM are way way lower, than for example CCl4 or N2O.

SuperOxide - 25-2-2021 at 09:18

Quote: Originally posted by Tellurium

Wow these are high prices, that you have in america, I pay about 60 bucks for 10L!
I guess the prices are that high, because of some enviromental fee/tax or something? [...]

Pretty much...

Quote:

The United States Environmental Protection Agency has moved to place a ban on methylene chloride (dichloromethane, DCM) citing associations to a higher risk of cancer and neurological and liver problems.

Its funny looking at videos of amateur chemists getting it so easily from paint stripper (then wasting it! lol), I wish I could get it that easy. I mean it's not "difficult" to get online, but it's not as easy as going to Ace Hardware or Walmart anymore.

Quote: Originally posted by Tellurium

[...] At least I heard, that with Tetrachloroethylene this is the case, so maybe also with other chlorinated solvents due to high greenhouse effects compared to CO2? Even though the effects from DCM are way way lower, than for example CCl4 or N2O.

Actually, I have some Tetrachloroethylene, that was very easy to get. It's just in brake cleaner, and it's used in dry cleaning I believe. That's very easy and cheap to get. (I have absolutely no idea what I plan to use it for, but I have some, lol).

Mateo_swe - 1-3-2021 at 13:46

DCM doesnt do well in HDPE?

Hmm, i got two 5L pails of DCM, i must go check on them so it doesnt escape the pails that most likely are HDPE.
If it does escape i must buy more of the blue cap storage bottles, they usually are good but little expensive.

SuperOxide - 1-3-2021 at 14:24

Quote: Originally posted by Mateo_swe

DCM doesnt do well in HDPE?

Hmm, i got two 5L pails of DCM, i must go check on them so it doesnt escape the pails that most likely are HDPE.
If it does escape i must buy more of the blue cap storage bottles, they usually are good but little expensive.

You mean the GL45 type storage bottles? Yeah I agree. I have one from Pyrex (orange cap) and one from some generic brand (blue cap). They work well for this (I keep my recycled DCM in them). The pour rings that come with them always seem to loosen up and fall off. I know they're supposed to be able to be removed for cleaning, but mine all just fall off when I pour now. Extremely annoying.

But you have two 5L pails? Holy crap, that's awesome. I would recommend something other than glass bottles for that, lol. Perhaps a metal container. Just an idea.

[Edited on 1-3-2021 by SuperOxide]