Sciencemadness Discussion Board

DIY Water Ionizer Food safe electrodes? Power requirements for water ionization?

I.Am.Diene - 4-2-2020 at 19:35

Hi,
As of lately, I have been beginning to make a water ionizer much like that of Kangen or Tynet. Although this may bring about feelings of disgust and rage
in some people when thinking about sleazy salesmen and pyramid schemes it interests me a lot and I would like to see how small of a machine I can realistically make. The concept is essentially the same for all of them there is an acidic side and a basic side separated by a ion selective membrane. Drink your anti cancer juice on one end and do god knows what with the other end.

Existing machines use ~150 watts of power from what I've researched I would like to see if thats entirely necessary.

As far as my electrodes go I'm considering using aluminum foil for the first few b/c it's cheap.

So now i find myself here trying to see if anyone has any input as to:

What is most important when building the electrodes on a device like this surface area or material?

Is it possible use <100 watts to power a system like this?

If anyone has experience with ion selective membranes what are they usually made of? have you made your own? I want mine to be food safe obviously.

Thank you:D

SWIM - 4-2-2020 at 21:10

These ionized water machines do not bring about disgust and rage because of sleazy salesmen or pyramid schemes.

They bring about disgust and rage because they are a scam to rip people off and have no medical value whatsoever.

However this is actually an advantage if you want to make your own because ANY wattage, ANY electrode material or configuration will be every bit as useless as the finest commercial water ionizer.

I would suggest using a single AAA battery as a power source (Or even just finding a stray cat and petting it vigorously. Rubbing a balloon on your head may work too!) and use the foil wrappers from 2 sticks of Wrigley's doublemint gum as electrodes.

I absolutely guarantee this configuration will cure cancer every bit as well as the finest water ionizer on the market.





Fulmen - 5-2-2020 at 13:20

Life lesson: There are no miracle cures. Sadly that doesn't prevent assholes from preying on the desperate and the gullible ones.

I think this is the only time I find my lack of faith disturbing. For surely there must be a very special place in hell where these assholes burn?

Twospoons - 5-2-2020 at 13:37

How about some sensible suggestions so he doesn't accidentally poison himself with toxic metals?
The whole thing is snake oil - but its better if its harmless snake oil.

[Edited on 5-2-2020 by Twospoons]

I.Am.Diene - 5-2-2020 at 14:28

I appreciate your enthusiasm haha. that is about the level of disgust i figured i would receive here.

Okay so what your saying is this is really easy to do then? ;-)

I would be slow to say there is definitely NO use for these devices since its well established that you are able to control the pH of your stomach by what you ingest. If you agree that this is true, then I have every reason to think that it might be helpful to those with heartburn or indigestion problems. Sure, tums exist so do rantidine and omeprazole but if I could neutralize my acidic stomach with my tap water...thats what interests me. So if I can make pH 8-8.5 water using electrolysis on a small scale then I'm winning here.

Any non-asshole comments are welcome <3 even sensible suggestions like for example:

Just for for fun, how can I calculate the power requirements for this cell? Im assuming that the change in pH follows as a result of changes in concentration of dissolved species like H+ ca2+ na+ mg2+ po4^2- cl- OH- you know, the shit that makes hard water. can someone explain HOW i would calculate the requirements for something like this.

thanks

SWIM - 5-2-2020 at 14:32

Okay, do this:
https://www.brighthubengineering.com/diy-electronics-devices...

But be aware that makers of water ionizers say making your own is a waste of time, it will be dangerous to use, and won't help you:
https://airwaterlife.com/diy-water-ionizer/

Not really too much of a shock since they're in business to make you buy their water ionizers so they can get your money; not to help you build your own.

EDIT In RE above: non- asshole comments? Then I certainly won't say that water ionization has any medical value because that's a real asshole comment.

And I won;'t try to justify making the stuff because I'm ignorant enough to think it cures cancer by pretending I'm doing it for some other reason once it's pointed out that it doesn't cure cancer..
That's also an asshole comment.

And I won't tell people that I believe the charlatans when they tell me their machine is a miracle medical cure but don't believe them when they warn me the machines are too complicated for me to make my own.

No, because asserting that sort of selective fantasy is a tremendous asshole comment.

I also won't start calling people assholes because they've pointed out the utter inaccuracy of my pseudoscientific beliefs because any such comments would be real asshole comments.





[Edited on 6-2-2020 by SWIM]

[Edited on 6-2-2020 by SWIM]

Fantasma4500 - 22-2-2020 at 02:09

i would not advice using aluminium as electrode because of aluminium being toxic
and theres a whole scientific community waiting to disagree with me on this, i remember long ago that aluminium was classified as a heavy metal, and i remember clearly asking my chemistry teacher how that could be since aluminium has a low density

anyhow the easiest way to make water basic is using baking soda, or maybe calcium hydroxide, calcium hydroxide would be quite simple for you even, just make a saturated solution and dilute it down accordingly to whatever pH you fancy, ingesting baking soda has seen some hormonal increases also so i dont think this basic pH thing is completely crooked shot, overrated? likely.

Sulaiman - 22-2-2020 at 04:07

It seems to me that the human body frequently responds to changes in environment by adjusting internal processes to move the system back towards a 'nominal' equilibrium,
no doubt related to Chatelier's principle.
So if you consume alkaline water, your body will produce more acid ... etc.

wg48temp9 - 22-2-2020 at 10:43

Quote: Originally posted by Antiswat  
i would not advice using aluminium as electrode because of aluminium being toxic
and theres a whole scientific community waiting to disagree with me on this, i remember long ago that aluminium was classified as a heavy metal, and i remember clearly asking my chemistry teacher how that could be since aluminium has a low density


Aluminium hydroxide has been used for years in antacid tablets and in cooking utensils, though I don't recommend ingesting anything made from electrolizing random pieces of aluminium or any other metal.

mysteriusbhoice - 9-6-2020 at 01:19

if you really want some nice magic woo woo water without toxic metal salts as flavoring then go buy platinum clad electrodes they are 23 dollars per piece 2*3 inches in ebay and if you wanna electrolyze tap water you need high voltage DC but dont kill yoself.

HOWEVER:
if you wanna make an actual water purifier that uses electricity this process is known as electrodialysis and its essentially nafion membranes on both sides and the middle compartment is your feed and the side compartments will contain your nasty anions and cations while the middle is pure DE-IONIZED water.
Flow rate will depend on your conditions like inputted voltage and water resistance.
and you dont need to use platinum either since all those nasty salts will be gone from the middle.
you can go read up on electrodialysis to learn more.

Sulaiman - 9-6-2020 at 03:48

Carbon electrodes can be slowly corroded by electrolysis,
but they do not themselves produce any toxic byproducts.
just be careful what you use as an electrolyte.

Iron is also safe but will corrode very quickly.

stainless steel contains chromium which is not good to consume,
I would not want to consume any aluminium salt or hydroxide.

I doubt the value of electrolised water, but I have no proof of harm.
For a while I tried ionic/colloidal silver but found no benefit.

I do however have great confidence in epsom salt and olive oil for gallstones,
saved me from having my gall bladder removed.

I also believe in the benefit of negatively ionised air.

unionised - 9-6-2020 at 04:02

Quote: Originally posted by Sulaiman  



Iron is also safe but will corrode very quickly.

Iron is a lot more toxic than most people think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_poisoning

stoichiometric_steve - 10-6-2020 at 11:44

Can we close this? Is this guy a troll?

Mateo_swe - 14-6-2020 at 07:57

Quote: Originally posted by Fulmen  
Life lesson: There are no miracle cures.


There certainly are.
How about the invention of penicillin, antibiotics and a whole lot of other medicines.
These are real miracle cures and their effect can be measured and replicated.
The scams never can.