Sciencemadness Discussion Board

BaCl2 to Ba(NO3)2 for pyrotechnic purpose?

fusso - 24-2-2019 at 14:09

I have BaCl2 and want to convert it to Ba(NO3)2 for pyrotechnic purposes, how to do this?

markx - 24-2-2019 at 15:08

Would be easier to start from barium carbonate. It should be available from pottery related businesses. At least it once was. You can also convert the Ba chloride to Ba carbonate easily by metathesis via a water soluble carbonate salt. Ba carboante is basically insoluble in water, so it is easy to extract. Just mind the flame coloration contamination that may carry over if something like sodium carbonate is used.
Reacting barium carbonate with ammonium nitrate solution yields barium nitrate e.g. And by reacting I mean boiling the brew for long hours under a fume hood until the cabonate is gone and then further to dryness to yield the product. That is one way I've done it from materials I had at hand at the time. Very laborious though :)
Or you could react the carbonate with nitric acid for a quicker approach.
Or you could play with solubility differences to compose a system where Ba nitrate is the least soluble component at a certain set of conditions or the most soluble one. Whatever works better with the substances you have access to. The yield might not be too great though, but this approach may be the least laborious one....

CharlieA - 24-2-2019 at 17:14

React ammonium nitrate (e.g. from hand warmers) with BaCl2. There is a procedure in one of the supplements to the International Guide to Home Chemistry Experiments, by Robert Bruce Thompson.

nezza - 26-2-2019 at 08:16

For pyrotechnics Barium chlorate gives a much more pronounced green colour, the colour being due to the volatility of Barium halides. The nitrate decomposes to oxide and gives a poor colour without the presence of halide/halate/perhalate ions.

greenlight - 26-2-2019 at 09:53

Barium chlorate does give a deeper green for sure, the only problem is the incompatibilities of chlorate with sulfur/sulfides and mixtures with barium chlorate are more sensitive than using nitrate.

I have got some pretty decent greens with barium nitrate though when trialling different mixtures for use in shells. I have the top two written down for future use.

When I couldn't buy barium nitrate I used to make it from barium carbonate and 70% nitric acid, but nitric acid is not always easily accessible for people.

Ammonium nitrate and barium carbonate is a good idea like mentioned above.
Other nitrate salts and barium chloride would work too considering the low solubility of barium nitrate in water.

2NaNO3 + BaCl2 = Ba(No3)2 + 2NaCl (careful of sodium contamination)
2KNO3 + BaCl2 = Ba(NO3)2 + 2KCl

fusso - 26-2-2019 at 16:11

Thx for all the input.
The BaCl2 I have is lab grade, not pottery grade, so I don't think I should bother buying some additional BaCO3.
Does BaCl2+2NH3+CO2+H2O=BaCO3(s)+2NH4Cl work?
For ammonium impurities, will it affect the flame colour significantly?
For sodium impurities, what's the minimum Na concentration in a pyro mixture to have significant effect in a flame of another colour? (asked for general cases, not just this case)

markx - 26-2-2019 at 23:33

Quote: Originally posted by fusso  
Thx for all the input.
The BaCl2 I have is lab grade, not pottery grade, so I don't think I should bother buying some additional BaCO3.
Does BaCl2+2NH3+CO2+H2O=BaCO3(s)+2NH4Cl work?
For ammonium impurities, will it affect the flame colour significantly?
For sodium impurities, what's the minimum Na concentration in a pyro mixture to have significant effect in a flame of another colour? (asked for general cases, not just this case)


Ammonium ion does not affect the flame colour to any noticeable degree, so it might be one of the least interfering options as to what regards color purity. You could use baking salt if you can find the variety that is based on ammonium carbonate. You could also try with potassium carbonate, that also tends to be less intense with regards to color contamination. Sodium is a nuisance....the yellow sodium d line is very intense and easily excited. Trace amounts can affect the flame coloration significantly.

As an example....if I test for sodium chlorate presence in cell liquid by absorbing a small amount into tissue paper and then heating the area with a butane torch to see if small intense bursts of flames are present to indicate a consiberable presence of oxydizer, the the small puff of smoke that comes from the paper is enough to contaminate the whole air in the room with sodium. If I run the torch through the air I can clearly detect the sodium yellow in the butane flame and even see how it has distributed itself in the air. At ground level there is very little if any and higher up the sodium presence is much stronger. Just as an anecdotal reference as to how little is enough for affecting flame coloration.

Very decent deep green can be obtained with Ba nitrate based formulation that uses Al as the main fuel, a chlorine donor and a small amount of sulfur. The sulfur content really deepened the color.

[Edited on 27-2-2019 by markx]