Sciencemadness Discussion Board

2-Butyne-1,4-diol

Connon_Fodder - 6-8-2010 at 08:21

I looked up this idea on wiki (i know genius right?) but aparently the solvent 1-4 butanediol is produced from the following procesing. 2-Butyne-1,4-diol the cas is 110-65-6 and is not expensive at all.

So is I going to be burned at the stake? - chased by pitchfork wielding villagers? - or just yelled at to utfse! Or will someone with any sort of sanity attempt to discuss and guide me through the knowledge and experience?

MagicJigPipe - 6-8-2010 at 09:17

Hydrogenation.

Just look up information on alkynediols. I think you will find it extremely difficult to find anything pertaining to exactly what you want to do with this.

It is unfortunate but true. Open up an organic chemistry textbook if you really want to nail this one.

[Edited on 8-6-2010 by MagicJigPipe]

bbartlog - 6-8-2010 at 12:44

You haven't really indicated what you're trying to do. Are you trying to specifically synthesize 1,4-butanediol from the butyne you mention, for reasons of curiosity? Are you trying to obtain 1,4-butanediol by whatever means is most expedient? Hydrogenation of the butyne may be industrially trivial and yet not especially easy for an amateur who is new to organic chemistry.

Quote:
So is I going to be burned at the stake?


Well, your target is an immediate precursor to psychoactive compounds. While we discuss all kinds of chemistry here, people who show up and ask for guidance in synthesizing such stuff (in their very first post) are often viewed with suspicion.

Sandmeyer - 9-8-2010 at 07:55

Quote: Originally posted by bbartlog  

Well, your target is an immediate precursor to psychoactive compounds. While we discuss all kinds of chemistry here, people who show up and ask for guidance in synthesizing such stuff (in their very first post) are often viewed with suspicion.


OK, next time someone wants to make chloroform I take it that you will give the same reply as the one I just quoted. If reading names of certain chemicals cause high blood pressure in some members maybe a good idea is to avoid places like chemistry forums.

[Edited on 9-8-2010 by Sandmeyer]

Nicodem - 9-8-2010 at 14:40

There is nice process research article regarding this hydrogenation (Org. Process Res. Dev., 10, 278–284). It can be done also with Pd-C, but there are several side products formed when using this catalyst (see Applied Catalysis, 29, 141-159). Needless to say that there are dozens of patents about it also, using all kind of hydrogenation catalysts. These patents can be easily found by UTFSE at Espacenet.

bbartlog - 9-8-2010 at 16:56

Quote:
OK, next time someone wants to make chloroform I take it that you will give the same reply as the one I just quoted.


He specifically asked about how people were likely to treat him. You I guess treated these as rhetorical questions, which they may have been, but I chose to take them literally.


Sandmeyer - 14-8-2010 at 08:25

Quote: Originally posted by bbartlog  
Quote:
OK, next time someone wants to make chloroform I take it that you will give the same reply as the one I just quoted.


He specifically asked about how people were likely to treat him. You I guess treated these as rhetorical questions, which they may have been, but I chose to take them literally.




OK, I understand. ;)

I did a quick search for the conversion the thread-started asks about and it seems it is best to use RaNi for this. A paper I can't reach details the prepation of both butyne diol as well as its hydrogenation with RaNi -- yield is 98% and it is run at room temp and 1 atm pressure:

Synthesis of 2-butyne-1,4-diol from acetylene and formaldehyde at atmospheric pressure.

Karimov, A. U.; Makhkamov, Kh. M.; Yusupov, D. Tashk. Gos. Tekh. Univ., Tashkent, Uzbekistan. O'zbekiston Kimyo Jurnali (2003), (3), 22-26

[Edited on 14-8-2010 by Sandmeyer]

Globey - 18-8-2010 at 16:51

I am most intrigued by a method which uses almost any old carbohydrate as feedstock, and ferments to 1,4 using a genetically modified E. Coli. All one would really need is somehow to obtain a tiny swab of this bacteria, but therein lies the real fly in the ointment. A non bio-synthetic pathway I also find intriguing involves using MSG as the main feedstock. It is a variation on the GABA precursor reaction. Of course, I haven't answered your question. But instead of trying to synthesize your 1,4 from this nasty, your energies would be better spent just outright buying your 1,4 from DuPont or BASF. You really need to put intelligent thought into it, and have a workable plan before you even begin the process of procurement. Your going to set up an account, have a company, know your use, and be deftly cognizant in the legitimate processes and find points, as well as the lingo. And your not going to be ordering a-5 or even 55 gallons of your 1,4. You'll be ordering perhaps 12 55 gallon drums. Keep in mind, each gallon will cost you maybe $20 USD? It'll help having maybe 10 grand at your disposal. Then you'll have more 1,4 than you know what to do with. Or you could be like some very cool dude in Alabama, and sell it by the gallon.