Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Testing Pdcl2

Runningbear - 30-9-2009 at 17:24

I'm thinking of having a go at making Pdcl2 but I'm looking for a simple test to confirm if I have suceeded. Can anyone offer any suggestions?

thanks in advance,

Runningbear

crazyboy - 30-9-2009 at 18:41

From wikipedia:

"Even when dry, palladium(II) chloride is able to rapidly stain stainless steel."

Sounds like a good place to start, besides if you start out with palladium and chlorine there isn't a whole lot of things you can make. Certainly very few things that rapidly stain stainless steel.

mr.crow - 30-9-2009 at 19:10

I was also thinking of making PdCl2. This is what I gather from searching the Internet:

Once you (gently) boil away all the HCl you should get a red/brown hygroscopic powder. Boiling with HCl also gets rid of any PdCl4 species and nitrates.

Maybe to test it you can dissolve a little in water and add ammonia to precipitate the ammonia complex.

Heres a question: will HCL and H2O2 work as an oxidant?

Runningbear - 30-9-2009 at 20:51

Well I guess you can't get much easier than staining stainless steel.:D

I was planning to use the Aqua Regia route as opposed to the chlorinated gas method, so I'm sure I could manage to make something other than Pdcl2 without much effort.

Of course the stainless testing method will not give me a level of reactivity. Or is it a case of stainless steel staining means I have been 100% successful.

Runningbear



UnintentionalChaos - 30-9-2009 at 21:15

A lot of metal chlorides happily attack stainless steel.

Do you have palladium metal? If so, just dissolve in aqua regia, and boil dry more or less. It should redissolve with ease in conc. HCl. There's not really anything else you could have made in that case.

halogenstruck - 2-10-2009 at 08:07

just weigh 1gr Pd 5CC 35%HCl & 1cc HNO3 60% leave it for 1 day,all Pd will dissolve or may a little bit remain.then evaporate in air till dryness.then strongly heat at 300`c for 10 min.if ur raw materials are pure,then result is 99.8%.
more infos,go to brauer inorganic synthesis.
if it is dry,i don`t believe it tarnish stainless steel.

Sandmeyer - 21-10-2009 at 11:33

Quote: Originally posted by Runningbear  
I'm thinking of having a go at making Pdcl2 but I'm looking for a simple test to confirm if I have suceeded. Can anyone offer any suggestions?

thanks in advance,

Runningbear


Metallic Pd is formed (along with acetaldehyde) when ethylene is passed into an aqueous soln. of PdCl2. This remarkable reaction was first discovered by english chemist Phillips* thereby paving the way for the famous Wacker process (catalytic amount of PdCl2), however the original Phillips protocol (stochiometric) can be used for quantitative analysis of Pd(II)**

*: F. C. Philips, Am. Chem. J., 16, 255 (1894).
**: S. C. Ogburn and W. C. Brastow, J. Am. Chem. Soc., 55, 1307 (1933).

[abitofftopic]
There is an article about Wacker on wikipedia as well as a seminar from the Stoltz group containing some references: http://stoltz.caltech.edu/litmtg/mechclub/2008/PMT-Litt-2008... [/abitofftopic]

Vogelzang - 28-10-2009 at 16:23

US 3153083 Process for the production of carbonyl groups in organic compounds
Pd dissolved in aqua regia, Wacker-like rxn

http://www.pat2pdf.org

mr.crow - 28-10-2009 at 18:45

hmm 1958, that must be the non-catalytic wacker type process. It uses 100g of palladium, lol

Its getting cold outside and I don't know where to leave the aqua regia to sit around and dissolve slowly.

Vogelzang - 31-10-2009 at 12:49

Quote: Originally posted by crazyboy  
From wikipedia:

"Even when dry, palladium(II) chloride is able to rapidly stain stainless steel."

Sounds like a good place to start, besides if you start out with palladium and chlorine there isn't a whole lot of things you can make. Certainly very few things that rapidly stain stainless steel.



Check out the stainless steel bike here:
http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=19...
also shown here, but you need to log in to see the pictures.
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=474949

halogenstruck - 1-11-2009 at 21:51

when it has water may be tarnish stainless steel.no idea
when dry,does not tarnish stainless steel.when u prepare the solution,it has H2PdCl4/HCl==>rapidly tarnish stainless still.i did it before