Abromination
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Phosphoric Acid from CocaCola
Just for fun, I am attempting to extract the phosphoric acid from a can of Coke. Here are the ingredients:
CARBONATED WATER, HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP, CARAMEL COLOR, PHOSPHORIC ACID, NATURAL FLAVORS, CAFFEINE.
For every hundred mL of Coke, there 17 mg of H3PO4 meaning that there are about 60 mg in one one ounce can (ew ounces).
The most obvious thing to do would to precipitate a phosphate salt out of a can of vacuum decarbonated Coke and turn it back into phosphoric acid with
a bit of sulfuric acid.
Im planning on adding sodium carbonate to the coke to neutralize the phosphoric acid and then adding something to drop the phosphate out of solution.
What would I use?
I will use this to add copper phosphate to my copper collection.
If you guys have a better way to do it I would love to hear>
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Sulaiman
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As copper phosphate is insoluble I would try just putting copper (or its oxide) directly into the coke.
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Abromination
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I certainly could do that, but that takes all of the fun out of it. I would like to have the phosphoric acid as well, but I probably will just
precipitate the copper phosphate out of the Coke.
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DraconicAcid
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Copper won't react with phosphoric acid directly, and the copper oxide would probably get coated with the phosphate and not fully react. Add a soluble
copper salt such as copper(II) acetate. You may need to adjust the pH up to increase the concentration of phosphate ion.
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
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Abromination
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Quote: Originally posted by DraconicAcid  | | Copper won't react with phosphoric acid directly, and the copper oxide would probably get coated with the phosphate and not fully react. Add a soluble
copper salt such as copper(II) acetate. You may need to adjust the pH up to increase the concentration of phosphate ion. |
Well I wouldn't add copper or copper oxide, I would add copper carbonate or add NaOH to form trisodium phosphate and then react that wuth CuSO4. Also
ignore the copper phosphate part, I'm not as interested in that as actually extracting the phosphoric acid.
List of materials made by ScienceMadness.org users:
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DraconicAcid
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You don't want or need a high concentration of phosphate to precipitate the copper salt. If it's too basic, you'll also get copper(II) hydroxide
precipitating.
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
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Ubya
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| Quote: Originally posted by j_sum2 | Coca Cola is dangerous. According to some people it is almost as dangerous as gasoline. The effects of drinking are the same. You will notice various
mushrooms growing on your whole digestive path, from mouth and nose to rectum. Some believe it is because phosphoric acid is eating and burning our
meat, some consider sugar is guilty here, some consider some other ingredients.
I've been drinking cola for last 10 years non-stop. And I noticed my throat is becoming more and more red. Then some white spots, and dark red spots,
and some holes like bullets pass through, then some meat started separating into threads, and so disgusting. According to normal and alternative
doctors it is pharyngitis, tonsillitis, laryngitis, sore throat, various infections, symptom of allergy, and 1000 diagnosis.
But I am telling you it is because of coke. And other juices, drinks, teas, coffees, even water if excess or too cold. I feel pain in morning but it
lasts only up to 1 hour after waking up. Probably because I breathe through mouth during sleep.
LOL, I learned in various books and sports that proper breathing or at least inhaling should be through nose, but my nose is clogged, not only with
mucous or pus or watery substance, but with same mushroom like throat. When these mushrooms grow on ass people call them "hemmorhoids". But that is
actually same shit, just different place. Just stop food, but you wont be able to stop it if you are not happy enough.
That's why God says in Qur'an something like: "happy people will go to heaven or succeed"
He also mentions one more people who will go to heaven and they are "first".
Only 1st people and happy people. What that means idk fully.
But makes some sense at least. You can not succeed through unhappiness or lack of hapiness.
Back to your topic: there are many ways to extract P from coke, but even that is better than drinking coke, or except same as my throat.  |
you could harvest those mushrooms and sell them to make a stew
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Abromination
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Im thinking that I can extract the phosphoric acid by adding calcium carbonate to the Coke and precipitating out calcium phosphate. Most phosphate
salts are insoluble except for group one metals and some other stuff. With the filtered and washed calcium phosphate, I could react it with sulfuric
acid and get phosphoric acid and calcium sulfate which wouldnt dissolve under the heat of the reaction. I could heat it as well to precipitate out any
excess calcium sulfate and there I have a dilute aqueous solution of phosphoric acid.
List of materials made by ScienceMadness.org users:
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--------------------------------
Elements Collected: H, Li, B, C, N, O, Mg, Al, Si, P, S, Fe, Ni, Cu, Zn, Ag, I, Au, Pb, Bi, Am
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Ubya
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| Quote: Originally posted by Abromination | | Im thinking that I can extract the phosphoric acid by adding calcium carbonate to the Coke and precipitating out calcium phosphate. Most phosphate
salts are insoluble except for group one metals and some other stuff. With the filtered and washed calcium phosphate, I could react it with sulfuric
acid and get phosphoric acid and calcium sulfate which wouldnt dissolve under the heat of the reaction. I could heat it as well to precipitate out any
excess calcium sulfate and there I have a dilute aqueous solution of phosphoric acid. |
100ml of Coke have 17mg of phosphoric acid
dicalcium phosphate has a solubility of 20mg/100ml in water
even calculating the mass of dicalcium phospate formed from the 17mg of acid i can speculate by eye that not much would precipitate if any
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Abromination
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| Quote: Originally posted by Ubya | | Quote: Originally posted by Abromination | | Im thinking that I can extract the phosphoric acid by adding calcium carbonate to the Coke and precipitating out calcium phosphate. Most phosphate
salts are insoluble except for group one metals and some other stuff. With the filtered and washed calcium phosphate, I could react it with sulfuric
acid and get phosphoric acid and calcium sulfate which wouldnt dissolve under the heat of the reaction. I could heat it as well to precipitate out any
excess calcium sulfate and there I have a dilute aqueous solution of phosphoric acid. |
100ml of Coke have 17mg of phosphoric acid
dicalcium phosphate has a solubility of 20mg/100ml in water
even calculating the mass of dicalcium phospate formed from the 17mg of acid i can speculate by eye that not much would precipitate if any
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Thats a fair point. I will probably be working with more than one can of Coke and can boil them down to increase the concentration of the H3PO4 and
then add calcium carbonate to precipitate just enough dicalcium phosphate to react it with sulfuric acid. I will get q lowe yeild but it would still
be something.
List of materials made by ScienceMadness.org users:
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Texium
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Your best bet would be to use larger bottles of cola rather than cans as they are cheaper by volume and more efficient. Even so, your maximum yield
from a 3 liter bottle would only be 0.51 grams. If you were hoping to use this phosphoric acid for anything, you might want to reconsider. As I've
said it before in another similar thread: due to the inpracticality and wastefulness of the endeavor, I don't think this extraction even has much
academic value, much less any practical value. I'd recommend putting your energy towards something more useful and equally or more enlightening. There
are many possibilities out there.
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Abromination
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| Quote: Originally posted by Texium (zts16) | | Your best bet would be to use larger bottles of cola rather than cans as they are cheaper by volume and more efficient. Even so, your maximum yield
from a 3 liter bottle would only be 0.51 grams. If you were hoping to use this phosphoric acid for anything, you might want to reconsider. As I've
said it before in another similar thread: due to the inpracticality and wastefulness of the endeavor, I don't think this extraction even has much
academic value, much less any practical value. I'd recommend putting your energy towards something more useful and equally or more enlightening. There
are many possibilities out there. |
You have a very valid point, but I simply like the ideo of extracting chemicals from every day goods. I am simply doing this for fun and do not expect
to use it.
Anyways, I will use a bottle instead of a can.
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happyfooddance
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Make sure to boil all the CO2 out, otherwise you will have a lot of unnecessary carbonate mixed in with your phosphate. It would be better to use CaO
or filtered limewater (best choice in my opinion) to neutralize.
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Abromination
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| Quote: Originally posted by happyfooddance | | Make sure to boil all the CO2 out, otherwise you will have a lot of unnecessary carbonate mixed in with your phosphate. It would be better to use CaO
or filtered limewater (best choice in my opinion) to neutralize. |
I will put it in my vacuum chamber for a few minutes.
I also will use limewater instead of CaCO3.
[Edited on 24-7-2018 by Abromination]
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symboom
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What about calcium chloride you could also get some hydrochloric acid from the mix
H3PO4 + 2CaCl2 = 2CaPO4 + 4HCl
I think copper sulfate might work too leaving copper phosphate insouble and H2SO4
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Sulaiman
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Maybe before you start refining/extracting the phosphoric acid it would be good to do a titration first ?
examples found but not personally tried:
http://www.titrations.info/acid-base-titration-phosphoric-ac...
or probably more accurately using a pH probe
Attachment: CWV-35-COMP-phosphoric_acid.pdf (494kB)
This file has been downloaded 663 times
[Edited on 24-7-2018 by Sulaiman]
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CobaltChloride
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That would work if H3PO4 was the only acid in coke. Besides H3PO4 there's also citric acid in coca cola.
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Abromination
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Actually, there is no citric acid in CocaCola, but there is carbonic acid from excess CO2 in solution.
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Elements Collected: H, Li, B, C, N, O, Mg, Al, Si, P, S, Fe, Ni, Cu, Zn, Ag, I, Au, Pb, Bi, Am
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clearly_not_atara
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use fecl3
iron (iii) does not form a carbonate, and fepo4 is very insoluble.
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symboom
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So phosphoric acid by adding iron sulfate forming iron phosphate and sulfuric acid is that really possible
Sound like the sulfuric acid made from oxalic acid and magnesium sulfate weak acid forming a strong acid. Sulfuric acid??
Iron chloride and phosphoric acid would for hydrochloric acid which is. Volitile.
[Edited on 26-7-2018 by symboom]
[Edited on 26-7-2018 by symboom]
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Abromination
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What would the solubility of copper phosphate be? I imagine that it would be almost entirely insoluble, as phosphate salts (particularly with
transition metals) are insoluble except for a few exceptions like alkali metal salts.
Also, could I use magnesium hydroxide instead of calcium hydroxide to precipitate out magnesium phosphate? I don't see a reason I couldn't but have
learned the hard way that exceptions exist.
List of materials made by ScienceMadness.org users:
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Elements Collected: H, Li, B, C, N, O, Mg, Al, Si, P, S, Fe, Ni, Cu, Zn, Ag, I, Au, Pb, Bi, Am
Last Acquired: B
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Abromination
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I would just like to add that this failed completely, the iron phosphate that precipitated was too fine to be caught by any filter I had.
[Edited on 16-11-18 by Abromination]
[Edited on 16-11-18 by Abromination]
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Elements Collected: H, Li, B, C, N, O, Mg, Al, Si, P, S, Fe, Ni, Cu, Zn, Ag, I, Au, Pb, Bi, Am
Last Acquired: B
Next: Na
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Tsjerk
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Did you try precipitation with calcium?
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GrayGhost-
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Grosso modo is 0,02% of acid, you lost you time and effort in so few yield.
If I wrong someone say me please.
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