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gutter_ca
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Cops decide to burn down bombmaker's house
This has been going on for a couple of weeks near me:
http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/escondido/article_f2896617...
Amazing!
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Sedit
International Hazard
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LMAO I love the comment from the neighbors on how to clean it up basicly stating this fellow never blew himself up make him come and clean it up.
Knowledge is useless to useless people...
"I see a lot of patterns in our behavior as a nation that parallel a lot of other historical processes. The fall of Rome, the fall of Germany — the
fall of the ruling country, the people who think they can do whatever they want without anybody else's consent. I've seen this story
before."~Maynard James Keenan
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Ozone
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A reasonable question:
"How did Jakubec not blow himself up?" she asked. "Why not have him come clean it up?"*
I suppose they will 1) evacuate the area and 2) catch what happens next on film (whew), 3) crucify whoever came up with this ridiculous idea and then
4) remain in litigation for the next 20 years, or so.
Oh, and they will blame Jakubec for any catastrophic result that occurs while they *burn his house down*.
Reckless stupidity (on the part of both Jakubec and the local authorities),
O3
*rats, Sedit beat me to it 
[Edited on 2-12-2010 by Ozone]
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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gutter_ca
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Issues offhand:
*Neighbors' foundations
*Gas/Water/Electric lines
*Not knowing what is involved
Sheer lunacy on the part of these "experts"
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Sedit
International Hazard
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I hope they do it, I haven't seen a new episode of Destroyed in 60 seconds in a while .
Its Ok folks sheessh they said there going to preheat the house to make sure it burns fast, Muhhwahhahahahaha...
Knowledge is useless to useless people...
"I see a lot of patterns in our behavior as a nation that parallel a lot of other historical processes. The fall of Rome, the fall of Germany — the
fall of the ruling country, the people who think they can do whatever they want without anybody else's consent. I've seen this story
before."~Maynard James Keenan
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Ozone
International Hazard
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"preheat the house..."*
Oh, yea.
*facepalm*
O3
*How would you do that, anyway?
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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madscientist
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Why don't they just call in an airstrike? Then they could miss by 200ft and inflict even more collateral damage.
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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gutter_ca
Hazard to Others
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Were I a neighbor, I think I would be in court right now seeking an injunction.
/Really, WTF is up with "heating the house so it will burn fast"?
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madscientist
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The faster it burns, the bigger the fireball?
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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Ozone
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I say we soak the house with KClO3 solution, perhaps with a helicopter, before heating it to dryness. That will make it burn faster, I bet.
I wonder if it would be seen from space?
Maybe liquid O2 would be more economical then heating?
 ,
O3
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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bbartlog
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Most LEOs are very risk averse these days, even (or especially) in situations where you would think they should be the ones we specifically hired to
take the risks in question. SWAT teams that back away when armed resistance is encountered, bomb squads that won't enter houses when actual explosives
are determined to be present. The Columbine shootings (and the length of time it took before any police dared to venture in to the school) are a good
example. Cultural problem really, no one gets in trouble for being too cautious; there's a perception that there's no such thing as being too careful.
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gutter_ca
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Might have to take a day off of work to be reasonably nearby when thisgoes down...
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Ozone
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Good point.
I remember cops waiting to give tickets to people parking on the wrong side of the street *in front of their homes*. This would happen two blocks from
where I saw someone riding my neighbor's stolen bicycle.
Pfft,
O3
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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crazedguy
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this is pretty much hysterical
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MagicJigPipe
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12 pounds of explosives? Jesus Christ call the National Guard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Here's what the police want you to think will happen:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5_9Gi7w19Y&feature=relat...
Here's what would probably happen:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUPVL4fepsw
Not as cool I must say... Pity...
"There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any
question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. ... We know that the only way to avoid error is to detect it and
that the only way to detect it is to be free to inquire. And we know that as long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they think,
free to think what they will, freedom can never be lost, and science can never regress." -J. Robert Oppenheimer
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psychokinetic
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Preheat neighbourhood to 180 degrees C, place bomb factory in middle rack and bake for 140 mins or until no longer bleeding when staked.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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Ozone
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Probably so, but how often is such amusement gratis? While the ignorance is laughable, it is also scary...and, predictable.
How do we expect this to effect us? No doubt that some A-Hole (probably incumbent) legislator will attempt to make a name for his-herself by drafting
a bill to "protect us" from this sort of thing. If the cops blow it up, preferably with collateral damage and accidental death/dismemberment, (to the
legislator's point-of-view) all the better.
Nothing like a crisis to exploit. For our safety, of course...
\
Boom, and shite,
O3
[Edited on 2-12-2010 by Ozone]
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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watson.fawkes
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From the article: | Quote: | | homemade explosives were found in and around the rental property |
Does anybody else find it wryly amusing
that this is a rental? I mean, just turn this around: Where would you like to rent?
Anonymously, of course.
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crazedguy
Hazard to Others
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i dont get what kind of scientist even a mad one would have H.E. just around the house i can understand in but who has a pile of hmtd or whatever just
outside for some gardener to step on
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Sedit
International Hazard
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I don't think this fellow was a scientist from the sounds of it considering he was wanted in connection with some bank robberys he had other motives
in mind. This fellow was nothing more then a cook from the sounds of it.
Knowledge is useless to useless people...
"I see a lot of patterns in our behavior as a nation that parallel a lot of other historical processes. The fall of Rome, the fall of Germany — the
fall of the ruling country, the people who think they can do whatever they want without anybody else's consent. I've seen this story
before."~Maynard James Keenan
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quicksilver
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The method of finding the materials was an accident where a worker "steps" on an explosive device?????? That sounds (if true) like something akin to a
practice booby-trap device or something similar. It MIGHT have been a container or a primary but doubtful: it was set to pop.
ETN is a relativity unknown and for it to be mentioned so prominently is another interesting feature of the article. - NO DOUBT that this guy was some
cook of a type as no one would be so caviler with energetic materials and to make something that would initiate (and injure someone in his backyard is
a oddity & a damn stupid one). There are many unanswered questions. I would not be surprised if this was a guy frequented the internet in general.
What certainly will be explored is the individual's politics and his background per se'.
The reason why I personally think they want to raze the home is two fold (they are afraid that the idiot stored materials where they cannot easily be
found (in the walls or whatever); storing primaries with secondaries. Additionally I think they cannot use a dog effectively because of all the
nitrate contamination within the home (plus the general simplification and money in doing so).
Ounces, let alone pounds of materials are a ridiculous thing to maintain: why this genius would do so is a question that is most likely primary in
their minds. This was a danger to the community to an extreme degree. Why he had something that exploded in his backyard is beyond imagination.
Superficially, It sounded like he was experimenting with an active "Anti-Personal mine" of some type or he had dropped a detonator of a ridiculously
poor design that exploded when stepped upon in soft earth. Whatever the reason; the guy was not interested in chemistry as a hobby. He was not
interested in safety, he was foolish enough to store active, completed materials. Admittedly 12 lbs is not heavy war-head level but it's a hell of a
lot. That was not microscope slides of sub milligram amounts: that was storage.
Something is missing from this story; perhaps a great deal of information is not published. He was in a populous area of CALIFORNIA! That is NOT a
place where such things are easily obtainable, easily unnoticed, & he had rented the property. He had no investment in the home - this guy is
obviously very bad news. There is much more to this than meets the eye.
I certainly wouldn't want that guy for a neighbor!
[Edited on 3-12-2010 by quicksilver]
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The WiZard is In
International Hazard
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Et tu Quicksilver.
1 07-06-86 04:32 pcd
Suspect had experience with explosives
GODFREY, Ill. (UPI) _ Authorities said a man from Madison County
who was arrested after police found hundreds of pounds of explosives in
his house has had experience with explosives.
The man's home in Godfrey was destroyed nearly 10 years ago in an
blast officials determined was caused by explosives stored in the house.
Randal L. Brown, 35, and his wife, Susan P. Brown, 33, of Godfrey
were charged Thursday with possession of explosives or incendiary
devices and unlawful possession of explosives.
Authorities made the arrests as part of their investigation into a
bombing that blew the porch off a house in Wood River early Wednesday. A
man, a woman and two children in the house at the time of the blast were
uninjured.
David E. Wyatt, 22, of Godfrey, has been charged with aggravated
arson in the incident.
Police arrested the Browns after obtaining a search warrant for
their home.
More than 100 "explosive devices" were confiscated by police,
said Randy G. Massey, assistant state's attorney. Reports put the amount
of explosives at about 500 pounds.
Massey said it was a "possibility" that the material for the bomb
came from the cache in the Browns' home.
Police in East Alton still were investigating the discovery
Wednesday of about 300 explosive devices in the trunk of a parked car.
Massey said he could not comment about whether police believe the
two caches of explosives were related.
The investigation into the bombing was conducted by the Wood River
police, the Madison County Sheriff's Office and the U.S. Bureau of
Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms.
An explosion in January 1977 left nothing but the foundation of a
home where Randal Brown then lived, Lt. Tom Acker of the Godfrey Fire
Protection District said Saturday.
The state fire marshal's office and the federal firearms agency
determined the blast was caused by explosives stored in the house but no
charges were filed, Acker said.
The Browns were released Friday from the county jail in
Edwardsville after each posted a $20,000 bond.
Wyatt remained in jail in lieu of $50,000 bond. He also was charged
Thursday with another count of aggravated arson in a fire police said
had been set in June in East Alton.
The explosives confiscated from the two caches were blown up by
federal firearms agents at the East Alton police firing range.
The bombs found by police had been made up as fireworks,
[a cleaver disguise] East Alton Fire Chief
Bill Shewmaker said. He said they ranged in size from one to
10 inches and were in red and blue cardboard cylinders.
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The WiZard is In
International Hazard
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"I certainly wouldn't want that guy for a neighbor!" Too - two
ILLEGAL MANUFACTURE AND USE OF PYROTECHNICS
Seventh International Pyrotechnics Seminar
Vail Colorado 14-18 July 1980
Arthur L. Cunn
Explosives Enforcement Officer
Explosives Technology Branch
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms
Washington, DC 20226
ABSTRACT [Edited /djh/]
This is a brief of federal regulation and laws relating to the manufacture,
storage, transportation, and sale of fireworks. [Deleted] A case history is presented by
use of slides to show illegal manufacture in various geographical locations in
the United States and the slovenly way in which the manufacturing process
takes place. Also presented is a case of an accidental explosion of a
residence, where illegal fireworks were made. An eyewitness account of the
fire and explosion were filmed by a neighbor who had a camera in hand. This
one incident involved over 4 million dollars in damage, one death, and
numerous injuries. Another case history depicts the manufacturing process
and storage of illegal fireworks, including the crude manufacturing process
and almost non-existent safety precautions.
INTRODUCTION
..... In 1978, several hundred
persons were injured with one illegal manufacture's production of M-80
fireworks with a defective fuse. The fuse when lit had no delay and caused
the fireworks to explode instantly before the person using it could release it
from his hand. One of the illegal manufacturing plants of these devices was
found to be a two story frame house with part time employees, having
absolutely no training or pyrotechnic knowledge, constructing fireworks in the
kitchen and living room areas. Over twenty-two (22) 55 gallon drums of flash
powder were stored in the garage. An electric hot plate was used to heat
coffee for the workers and a small kitchen exhaust fan was utilized to remove
the explosive dust from the area. The floors and walls of the entire first floor
were covered with powder and they never had an accident in the time they
were in operation. None of the machinery used had explosion proof motors
and ordinary concrete mixers were utilized in mixing black powder.
This is almost typical of the type of operation that is used by the illegal
manufacturer. There exists absolutely no quality control and no safety
requirements involved in manufacture, storage or transportation are used.
I will now show some slides depicting some of the things I have talked about.
SLIDE 1 THROUGH 22 - SMOKE COMING FROM RESIDENCE.
On St. Patrick's Day 1978, a wood frame structure valued at $100,000 dollars
located in an upper middle income community in the State of Illinois was
destroyed by a fire and explosion within two minutes. Very few neighbors
expected a fireworks factory to be situated in their own backyards.
The set of slides you are viewing were taken by a neighbor who was
photographing his own residence when he spotted smoke coming from a
house across the street. This entire sequence was captured on film in three
minutes. The photographers wife called the fire department and being only a
few blocks away they responded almost immediately.
Shortly after the arrival of the fire department to what first appeared to be a
small smoking fire, a loud explosion occurred and the house started to
breakup. Almost immediately a second explosion occurred leveling the
house. At this time a burning person was seen running from the explosion.
He was assisted by the firemen and removed to a hospital where he later
died of burns.
The fire and explosions caused $4 million dollars worth of damage to the area
including the loss of two fire trucks and one police car.
A follow-up investigation disclosed that the victim, the owner of the house
was manufacturing illegal fireworks in the basement and over 600 pounds of
explosives consisting of perchlorate explosive powders and black powder
was on the premises before the fire. The cause of the accident was
determined to be a spark from a fuse cutting machine.
CASE STUDY OF ACCIDENTAL EXPLOSION OF
RESIDENCE WHERE FIREWORKS WERE MANUFACTURED
1. Smoke observed emanating from house.
2. Fire starting to progress.
3. Firemen arrive for what appears to be small confined fire.
4. First explosion occurred.
5. This explosion injures firemen, damages fire truck and police
vehicles.
6. Second explosion follows.
7. House starts to explode and fall apart.
8. Fire and police personnel flee immediate area.
9. Smoke now obscuring house.
10. House completely devasted.
11. New flare up of chemicals causes smoke.
12. Fire personnel return to site to fight fire.
13. Person seen leaving ruins and smoldering.
14. Victim is observed by fire chief.
15. Victim is aided by firemen and flames on clothing are
smothered.
16. Remains keep exploding and emitting dense smoke.
17. Fire and smoke continues.
18. Fire will not remain out, keeps relighting.
19. More minor explosions occur.
20. Final smoldering ruins.
21. Aerial view of accident site.
22. Final cleanup as water turns to ice.
CASE STUDY OF ILLEGAL FIREWORKS
FACTORY MANUFACTURING M-80 TYPE FIREWORKS
I . Typical M-80's
2. Outer containers prior to filling.
3. M-80 is marked as smoke.
4. Typical illegal and dangerous storage.
5. Sample of typical packing.
6. Cardboard carton packaging of fireworks.
7. Sacks of M-80's.
8. Preparation trays for M-80's
9. Empty cases ready for filling.
10. Filled and sealed fireworks in storage trays.
11. Typical work area.
12. This scene depicts slovenly storage and work areas.
13. Mixing machinery.
14. Homemade mixing tub.
15. Non-explosion proof machinery (air compressor).
16. Fireworks ready for shipment.
17. STORAGE OF 55 GALLON DRUMS OF PERCHLORATE MIX.
18. Non-explosion proof hydraulic press.
19. Dirty/contaminated work area.
20. Cement mixer used to mix black powder.
21. Floor used as work area.
22. Numerous cartons filled with fireworks.
23. Outside view of building used for manufacturing site.
24. Picnic table used outside for assembling fireworks.
25. An almost neat and clean work area.
26. Flash powder covers entire inside of building.
27. Sealer for ends of fireworks drying.
28. Mislabeled sacks of filler material.
29. Thousands of M-80's in drying process.
30. Same as above (another view).
31. Powder all over interior of building.
32. Work bench covered with fireworks powder
33. Fuse cutting machine without benefit of explosion proof
motor.
34. Fifty-five gallon drums of fireworks mix
35. Work bench and storage area.
36. Finished fireworks prior to packaging and shipment.
37. Filler material of corn cob grits.
38. Contaminated work area.
39. Propane torch used to melt glue for casings
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And he went into the temple of pyrotechnics, and cast out all them that sold
and bought M-80's in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the bomb
makers, and the seats of them that sold ground bombs.
It is written, this house shall be called the house of pyrotechnics; but ye have
made it a den of bomb makers.
And the fireworks makers came to the temple of pyrotechnics and were
healed.
/djh/ With apologies to Matthew
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unionised
International Hazard
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" 'I know they've spent a lot of time thinking this though,' said Mike Harrison, who lives across the street "
Not quite long enough.
" 'We have a very high confidence level that these chemicals will be neutralized very quickly,' said Todd Newman, fire chief of the San Marcos Fire
Department"
Very quickly, though I can't be bothered to look up the VoD.
I guess the police will need to take samples before they destroy the evidence ( though some part of me hopes they forget because it would be a
marvellous farce in court.
Police " you stand accused of making explosives."
Defendant " What explosives?"
Police "Oh Bugger!")
seriously, this method (fill the place with packing crates and set fire to it) is used for destroying explosives in contaminated buildings on old
industrial sites where explosives were made. After the fire there are no explosives left.
The thing is that they didn't have neighbours living close by.
If I lived near this I would be faking receipts for expensive decorations and hi fi so that I could maximise my claim when the house fell down.
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quicksilver
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Many, many years back I remember when there were such fireworks mfg "sheds" - many on Reservations ( a big one outside of Las Vegas (as some folks
may remember). They would sell their fireworks via the "outlets stores" just off the Highway along with alcohol & tobacco (yes: I'm not making
this up...all three in one store (there was another store MANY people remember in Flagstaff AZ that was divided in half. One portion of the building
sold guns; standard gun store - the other sold booze and tobacco.... They had hats; they sold that had some quip about ATF.
Many of the people who had subscriptions to American Fireworks News and were member of the PGI & were for the most part responsible hobbyists or
professional technical or Special Effects workers would cringe that the "shed" facilities (many of which DID have tragic negligent issues). I pretty
much knew the hobby was gone well before the mid-1990's but discussions continued (often in the News-Groups) and in many write-up's in AFN monthlies.
Jerks like this guy are simply throwing more soil on a grave that could have been channeled into a major safety boost for the whole nation; had anyone
the money & time enough to commit themselves before all the tragedies, terror, stupidity, and exploitative "journalism" that was an easy sell.
Not that it even matters anymore. The art that was firework displays is vanishing. The science in energetic materials (which was the common way MANY
youngsters got a fascination with chemistry & physics) is SO restrictive that many journals are tough to FIND any longer.
.....Last one out, please turn off the lights.
[Edited on 3-12-2010 by quicksilver]
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