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j_sum1
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Death unlikely unless someone inhaled it.
Facial burns and blindness were a possibility though.
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HgDinis25
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@DrMario
I never called you insane. I asked if you were insane in a rhetorical manner. There's a big difference. And I only used such expression because you
described the behaviour of the teacher as scandalous. IMHO, his behaviour is far from being scandalous. What were you thinking of reporting anyway?
With that cleared out, let's continue.
5M Hydrochloric Acid isn't very corrosive. It only causes damage to the skin if the exposure is prolonged. Thus, the use of gloves isn't necessary.
Like I said, it is recomended by many labs not to use gloves when handling chemicals less or as corrosive and dangerous as HCl.
Now on the lab coat. It does indeed prevent you from getting HCl in your clothes. However, it's not strictly necessary. If you get some on your
clothes you can easily remove them before any real harm occurs. Of course, it's more pratical to remove a lab coat than your clothes, if splashes do
happen. However, it may be considered more pratical to work without a lab coat, when the danger is minimal. This depends on the opinion of the
chemist. So, my conclusion: lab coat, in this situation, is not mandatory.
It is important that children learn chemistry in a passionate way. They must learn that not everything that has acid in it melts your skin, for
instance. And that there's a difference between real corrosive acids and middly corrosive acids. And many more interesting things. There's a reason
why you use an helmet when riding a bike but don't use it when crossing the street. When crossing the street, there may be a chance that you get run
over, and the use of an helmet could save your life. Still you don't use one... The odds of something like that happening do not compensate the
trouble.
Now that we're done with the actual chemistry, allow me to pass to the next part. The personal side of all of this. Why on earth would you say that I
have strong opinions? Opinions that prevent me from having a "reasonable scientific conversation"? If you want to tell that to someone, please
advocate your own pleading and give some arguments.
If I insulted you when I asked if you were insane, I apologize. Now, If you want to debate the matter further, focus on the chemistry.
EDIT: I believe there's a substantial part of this thread missing, where DrMario said some ridiculous things about violenting someone. What happend to
my post about it?
[Edited on 27-12-2014 by HgDinis25]
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Bert
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Mood: " I think we are all going to die. I think that love is an illusion. We are flawed, my darling".
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Hello everyone!
Sorry to not have looked into this thread for several pages- I will look in more frequently now.
Please, everyone: Reserve your rancour for the people posting questionable YouRube videos (not a typo there... )
Discourse courteously among yourselves, gentlemen mad scientists.
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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DrMario
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Quote: Originally posted by HgDinis25  | @DrMario
I never called you insane. I asked if you were insane in a rhetorical manner. There's a big difference. And I only used such expression because you
described the behaviour of the teacher as scandalous. IMHO, his behaviour is far from being scandalous. What were you thinking of reporting anyway?
With that cleared out, let's continue.
5M Hydrochloric Acid isn't very corrosive. It only causes damage to the skin if the exposure is prolonged. Thus, the use of gloves isn't necessary.
Like I said, it is recomended by many labs not to use gloves when handling chemicals less or as corrosive and dangerous as HCl.
Now on the lab coat. It does indeed prevent you from getting HCl in your clothes. However, it's not strictly necessary. If you get some on your
clothes you can easily remove them before any real harm occurs. Of course, it's more pratical to remove a lab coat than your clothes, if splashes do
happen. However, it may be considered more pratical to work without a lab coat, when the danger is minimal. This depends on the opinion of the
chemist. So, my conclusion: lab coat, in this situation, is not mandatory.
It is important that children learn chemistry in a passionate way. They must learn that not everything that has acid in it melts your skin, for
instance. And that there's a difference between real corrosive acids and middly corrosive acids. And many more interesting things. There's a reason
why you use an helmet when riding a bike but don't use it when crossing the street. When crossing the street, there may be a chance that you get run
over, and the use of an helmet could save your life. Still you don't use one... The odds of something like that happening do not compensate the
trouble.
Now that we're done with the actual chemistry, allow me to pass to the next part. The personal side of all of this. Why on earth would you say that I
have strong opinions? Opinions that prevent me from having a "reasonable scientific conversation"? If you want to tell that to someone, please
advocate your own pleading and give some arguments.
If I insulted you when I asked if you were insane, I apologize. Now, If you want to debate the matter further, focus on the chemistry.
EDIT: I believe there's a substantial part of this thread missing, where DrMario said some ridiculous things about violenting someone. What happend to
my post about it?
[Edited on 27-12-2014 by HgDinis25] |
- I fail to see the difference between saying I am insane, and asking if I am insane in a rhetorical matter. A rhetorical question is one that asks no
answer but is actual direct statement. "A rhetorical question is a figure of speech in the form of a question that is asked in order to make a point,
rather than to elicit an answer."
- If you get HCl on your clothes, changing them may not be trivial. I don't know about you, but I prefer to have my pants on when going home in
winter.
- Maybe some of the labs you visited recommend not wearing gloves when handling HCl. Here in Northern Europe the practice is different to say the
least.
- I most definitely said nothing about "violenting" - I don't even know what that word means, if it's even a word.
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CuReUS
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this video is apt for this thread
all talk,no reaction and a horrible waste of chemicals
they gave a clever title to the video to cover up their failure though
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLUyeCC-2Ko
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DrMario
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Oh, I agree wholeheartedly - that video is super-annoying! It also features the most annoying (in MY personal opinion) YouTube chemist - the periodic
table of videos Professor. I want to pull all my hair out when I watch him flail his hands in front of the camera. Funny fact: no matter how much the
camera zooms into his face, he'll find a way to get his hands there  And the
things he says aren't insightful enough to mitigate his presentation style. But as I said, this is just my very own opinion.
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DrMario
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BTW, thank you CuReUS for posting that video - I would have posted many more Periodic Table of Videos videos because I find most of them atrocious,
but I thought I'd get criticized for doing that, since they are (probably) quite popular around these parts. I can't stand them but I may very well be
in the minority.
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The Volatile Chemist
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| Quote: Originally posted by DrMario |
Oh, I agree wholeheartedly - that video is super-annoying! It also features the most annoying (in MY personal opinion) YouTube chemist - the periodic
table of videos Professor. I want to pull all my hair out when I watch him flail his hands in front of the camera. Funny fact: no matter how much the
camera zooms into his face, he'll find a way to get his hands there And the
things he says aren't insightful enough to mitigate his presentation style. But as I said, this is just my very own opinion. |
Although the videos are informative, they are ridiculously wasting. That one particularly hurt me, as I don't have any KMnO4.... 
I'm more curious as to what his area of research is, as at one time they mention the usage of aluminum tubing and heating coils.
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HgDinis25
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@ DrMario
| Quote: |
- If you get HCl on your clothes, changing them may not be trivial. I don't know about you, but I prefer to have my pants on when going home in
winter. |
Exactly, finally you understand. It depends on the opinion of the chemist, when handling low corrosive substances, if he wishes to wear a lab coat or
not. If he chooses not to and he has to remove his clothes, that's on him. But it's an option ergo it's not mandatory!
| Quote: |
- Maybe some of the labs you visited recommend not wearing gloves when handling HCl. Here in Northern Europe the practice is different to say the
least. |
Again, it's an option, not a definite rule! Let me just highlight that we're talking about 5M HCl...
| Quote: |
- I most definitely said nothing about "violenting" - I don't even know what that word means, if it's even a word. |
Please open the link and learn something new (a thing everyone should do, at every minute of every day):
http://www.verbix.com/webverbix/English/violent.html
And visit this link if you wish to re-read (now is this even a word?) the comment you made:
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=55190
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j_sum1
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I am not sure why the angst for prof Polyakof. Yes, some of the vids are a bit long and lack a whole lot of depth. But by any reckoning this project
has lifted the profile of chemistry and done a lot to educate and captur the imagination of a large number of people.
That said, the unintended reaction posted is not one of the better ones. I wouldn't call it wasteful though. These things happen. And the reagents in
this case are hardly exotic.
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j_sum1
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Resurrecting this thread.
I don't know if this vid is really bad or a really effective warning.
Sulfur trioxide chicken
[Edited on 6-6-2015 by j_sum1]
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Deathunter88
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Here is a video about "making" acetic acid from vinegar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lLrWFw_t_A
What is funny about it is that the video maker doesn't realise vinegar IS acetic acid. The comments are pretty funny too.
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blargish
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Love the myriad of PhD chemists in the comments hahahaha
BLaRgISH
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blogfast25
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That's strictly speaking not true. 'Distilled' (white) vinegar is a(n impure) solution of acetic acid ('ethanoic acid') in water, about 5 %.
What you say is a bit like saying "patio cleaner is hydrogen chloride": 'close' but no cigar!
But I'll let you off...
[Edited on 6-6-2015 by blogfast25]
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Deathunter88
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| Quote: Originally posted by blogfast25 |
That's strictly speaking not true. 'Distilled' (white) vinegar is a(n impure) solution of acetic acid ('ethanoic acid') in water, about 5 %.
What you say is a bit like saying "patio cleaner is hydrogen chloride": 'close' but no cigar!
But I'll let you off...
[Edited on 6-6-2015 by blogfast25] |
Wait a second, if you call patio cleaner "hydrogen chloride" that would be like calling distilled white vinegar "glacial acetic acid" which I am not.
I still get your point though because vinegar also has some sugar in it. 
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blogfast25
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| Quote: Originally posted by Deathunter88 |
Wait a second, if you call patio cleaner "hydrogen chloride" that would be like calling distilled white vinegar "glacial acetic acid" which I am not.
I still get your point though because vinegar also has some sugar in it.
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I was 'exaggerating for effect', of course. Well spotted though. 
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Molecular Manipulations
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"Distilled" vinegar isn't even distilled either. The alcohol used to make it is, but after adding the enzymes and the reaction is done - they just
bottle it up. As previously stated, some brands contain added sugars for flavor.
-The manipulator
We are all here on earth to help others; what on earth the others are here for I don't know. -W. H. Auden
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j_sum1
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I think the deal with the vinegar is that it is not a terrible purification process if there is other stuff in with your vinegar. But the users
showed no understanding of what was happening or terminology and nor did most of the commenters. Of course the final product is going to be
ridiculously dilute.
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unionised
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The technique illustrated in that video is used in labs to obtain high purity reagents (ammonia is the classic example) for trace analysis.
What's the problem?
It starts with vinegar which is full of all sorts of junk left over from the fermentation process and ends up with a dilute solution of acetic acid
containing only the volatile constituents which is pretty close to pure aqueous acetic acid (with a little ethanol and perhaps a few odds and ends
like acetaldehyde and diacetyl.)
If you are prepared to keep replacing the vinegar with fresh supplies then you end up with a solution that has the same acid concentration as the
original- probably about 5% which is nearly 1 molar. Hardly a ridiculous concentration.
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j_sum1
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Fair comment unionised. I have used that same technique for a couple of things. I don't think that is the criticism.
I have some questions about the time frame -- I am not sure two weeks is long enough to get a particularly high concentration -- especially given the
liquid surface area exposed and the volume of the container.
The thing is that the people in the video seemed pretty unaware of what was happening.
I don't think it qualifies as the worst video in this thread.
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Adrian Mortensen
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This could have ended much worse, especially when handling the Hydrofluoric acid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uZwYg4W7JE
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blogfast25
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Going by the huge amounts of teh Utoobs by US ‘dudes’ with arrested development profiles straight off a moron production line and trying to blow
up, thermite, burn, shred, shoot or otherwise destroy all kind of objects, a run-of-the-mill Martian just having landed here would be tempted to
conclude the average age of Americans is about 10.
Best comment:
| Quote: | | I can feel the butthurt people who actually took a lesson in chemistry. IT FEELS SO GOOD. |
And never tells these ‘dudes’ they’re stooopid because they’ll only tell you to ‘take a chill pill’.
[Edited on 10-6-2015 by blogfast25]
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The Volatile Chemist
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Take a chill pill.
So many others argue over the safety of certain people and procedures arbitrarily. yech.
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pneumatician
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Zero Fusion and Atomic Alchemy with Archbishop Jim Humble
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLe0j3BlaPW308kecJSONLa...
bad or good?
[Edited on 11-6-2015 by pneumatician]
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blogfast25
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Answer that question by reading this quote:
| Quote: | How to Reduce Atomic Radiation
to zero and create Gold as part of the process and remove all atomic radiation from both fresh and salt water. |
Jimbob is stark raving bonkers. One really has to wonder what drives people to publish that hind of stuff on the teh internettings?
I'm not sure this is the same 'Jim Humble' but it sounds likely:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_Mineral_Supplement
And here:
http://owndoc.com/candida-albicans/miracle-mineral-solution-...
[Edited on 11-6-2015 by blogfast25]
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