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Organikum
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Sandmeyer
| Quote: | Originally posted by Sauron
There is now a true human aphrodisiac, one that directly stimulates the libido and it is effective on both men and women. |
True, it's called GHB... |
Funny I told him that before but Sauron is a strong believer in tanning
agents......
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Sauron
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You are confusing an intoxicant with an aphrodisiac.
PT-141 (Bremelanotide) has no intoxicant effects.
And GHB has no effect on erectile dysfunction, female sexual dysfunction, or the libido.
GHB GHBA etc tweak the GABA system and increase electrical activity in the brain.
If it were not for Hillary and her feminazi friends getting all hyped up about the phony date rape issue, GHB would still be OTC in health food
stores.
By their arguments beer ought to be Schedule 1 DEA because I am quite sure a lot more dates have been "raped" under its influence than by GHB and
Rohypnol combined. Alcohol is the archetypal date rape drug. By which of course what I mean is the whole thing is a CROCK.
Bremelanotide is another matter entirely.
Similar inaccurate claims were made regarding MDA/MMDA, even methaqualone. These are not aphrodisiacal in any true sense. Bremelanotide is.
Don't confuse the marketing ploys of drug dealers with science.
Or substitute wishful thinking and imprecision for cold facts.
[Edited on 13-1-2007 by Sauron]
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Sauron
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Tell it to the FDA and Palatine Technologies, @Organikum.
The latter will become very very wealthy very soon.
All anyone gets for GHB is hard time in the slams, it's Schedule 1. Rightly or wrongly it's Schedule 1. Alongside heroin and cocaine.
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Nicodem
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Sauron
You are confusing an intoxicant with an aphrodisiac. |
Nonsense. An aphrodisiac is any compound that increases libido. For me cannabis is an aphrodisiac and the side effect of being 'stoned' does not
bother me at all when having sex.
| Quote: | | PT-141 (Bremelanotide) has no intoxicant effects. |
Sounds like an extremely boring drug.
| Quote: | | And GHB has no effect on erectile dysfunction, female sexual dysfunction, or the libido. |
GHB just like alcohol releases the cultural inhibitions and thus makes people horny among other things. Note that sexual dysfunctions are generaly
symptoms of neurosis and are only rarely physiological in origin.
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Sauron
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@Nicodem, I agree entirely with your assessment of GHB viz ethanol. Spot on.
I think you vastly understate the occurance of both male and female nonpsychosomatic sexual dysfunction. There is a huge market, Pfizer has amply
demonstrated that for male ED. Viagra is not an aphrodisiac, but for people with ED it is a godsend. You are suggesting that since per your statement
ED is a neurotic symptom most of the time, it would follow that a placebo diamond shaped blue pill would work just as well. That is not the reality.
And your assertion that cannabis or anything that makes you horny is a true aphrodisiac in the clinical sense, is simply untrue.
I think cannabis functions as a simple intoxicant much like alcohol and as you agreed GHB, lowering inhibitions. Lowering inhibitions does not promote
sexual desire in males and females without any external stimulation, and most certainly not in those with sexual dysfunction.
Sildenafil only works to promote erections in men with ED and with external stimulation. No external stimulation no erection. Zero libido enhancement.
Sildenafil also has no erectile enhancing effect on males without ED with or without external stimilation. If you don't require it it will not work.
If you don't require it and take a placebo and have external stimulation you will get an erection anyway.
QED Sildenafil is not an aphrodisiac.
Yet Pfizer have gotten fat off the ED market.
Bremelanotide has same market plus female market. Not being an intoxicant, it is not at all like Rohypnol, is nonhypnotic, nonsedative, and does not
induce memory loss. It is not at all like GHB.
I do not believe it would be succesful if administered surreptitiously to a woman (or man) not otherwise inclined to have sex with the person giving
it. They will get horny and then go seek a partner they desire, if the person sitting next to them is not a candidate. We are not talking about a
substance that produces indiscriminate satyrs and nymphomaniacs. Watch out for the wishful thinking again. Enhanced libido is not loss of free will.
I think Bremelanotide has great potential to be socially and politically controversial. The religious right will hate it. The moralizers will condemn
it. The feminazis will denounce it and if Hillary gets in it's all over at least in USA. But, that may not come to pass.
I think Palatine will get stinko rich and I think @Polverone got it right. So will the knockoff manufacturers. Indian and Chinese Big Pharm. Spam.
Internet sales. No place in there for the likes of little me, for me it's just another personal project.
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Sandmeyer
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The post has been edited due to a irrational pertsonal insult...
/Sandmeyer
[Edited on 13-1-2007 by Sandmeyer]
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Sauron
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Thanks to the Moderator(s) for swift attention.
[Edited on 13-1-2007 by Sauron]
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Sandmeyer
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Sorry for that, I don't know why I posted something as stupid as that, wasn't thinking before posting...
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Organikum
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Sauron
Tell it to the FDA and Palatine Technologies, @Organikum.
The latter will become very very wealthy very soon.
All anyone gets for GHB is hard time in the slams, it's Schedule 1. Rightly or wrongly it's Schedule 1. Alongside heroin and cocaine.
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Actually we use GBL here whats perfectly legal where I live and I dont give a bloody fuck about the DEA and
US laws.
From the many drugs I tried only two can be considerd as aphrodisiacs IMHO. Thats LSD and GHB/GBL. Whereby LSD is pretty harsh on erections and is
prone to distraction whilst GHB/GBL worked for about 80% of all people I know who tried it. Males and females. It enhances erections, intensifies
orgasm and tactile sensation not to talk that about everybody seems to get sexually attractive.
Dosage is critical though and calls for some experimenting to get to the personal optimum.
Not to forget that GHB costs me about 0,2€/gram or less 
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Sauron
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Removed by Sauron for sake of decorum and preservation of the pax Polveronus.
[Edited on 13-1-2007 by Sauron]
[Edited on 14-1-2007 by Sauron]
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Misanthropy
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Sauron: I'd like to know, in 2 words or fewer please,  just what you think
constitues a 'clinically' accepted aphrodisiac. You are a rather vague fellow, all previous points being considered.
GHB for (me/us/them/fuggit, several of us) meets ALL the criteria. When taken orally, (not so much IV strangely, at this point, I think due to the
abrupt/crude onset perhaps?) I ease into a decidedly more sensual frame of mind. Thinking, speaking & behaving in a softer, sweeter, filthier
& most definitely more sexually energetic way. My wife & our friends seem to enjoy this.
Even when alone. Even without an erection. The engagement of tactile stimulation, body wide, is highly appealing but granted, it usually leads to a
raging, noticeably enhanced hardon. Especially when we bring in another person or two. 
This is not just a function of hibition removal of course. The aphrodisial qualities of that alone however can be said to be relative. Not to be so
offhandedly denied as 'not aphrodisiac' in nature. Who are you to say? Or anybody for that matter?
Sexual desire is in fact amplified. Physical contact is made more pleasurable. The frame of mind is most assuredly set into a profoundly pro sexual,
sensual groove. The effects of this last even a few days after use, to a lesser degree, in all areas discussed. Not to mention the general, lingering
feeling of well being that continues after use for that time as well.
We all fuck a lot thereafter as well, mind you. 
Deeply moving, intense lovemaking tends to occur a LOT more frequently as well. The inherent difference between this and the freaky sex is assumed to
be understood. 
Growth hormone secretagogues may all promote that general, all over good feeling, especially when coupled with sex, so far as I know. Considering it
helps us lose significant weight, promoting more & better fucking/lovemaking in the future.
The soft & filthy oral discourse alone has removed hibitions of a couple otherwise reserved/shy girls we've known. GHB not being used by them at
all to get them warmed up! Freeflowing sensuality & ambition does some wonderful things! 
It seems to go especially well among women; they seem to generally be more fluent in their sensual awareness than men & this magnifies that side
of their nature a bit more. It's good to marry a hardcore bi-sexual woman in any case!
All this being said, I like it now with a bit of speed & a penis pump.
Oh yeah, aphrodisiacs... right... you were defining them as?
A lot of people seem to feel the same way. Results of this are evident in the field. Just look. Wikipedia isn't always the definitive answer you know
& is at times misleading or at the least, lacking.
GHB: Makes me superhuman. I know this because when she's on it, my wife could fuck you dead!
Good night.
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Sauron
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I have been strongly advised to drop this topic and all related discussions of human libido enhancement due to its contentious and inflammatory
nature.
I have accepted that advice from the powers that be.
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Misanthropy
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Ah, too bad. Ok. 
How is it that people become so upset over things which are so natural & nice?
Anyway, I never noticed much effect from sildenafil @ ~75mg. 20 mg of Tadalafil however, was great! I didn't need either of them, but the tadalafil
promoted much more blood flow into my penis than was usual. It seems to have opened things up somehow and doesn't really give as much effect as it did
at first. The very first time I tried it, I got unintentional & uninstigated hard ons just from sitting on my chair! All the blood just sort of
squished up into there. ?!?
There is an interesting sildenafil/tadalafil liquid mix (50mg&20mg/ml) for cheap at a site specializing in, innovative, physical development
research compounds. I believe it may be found through the IBE forums...
[Edited on 14-1-2007 by Misanthropy]
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Sauron
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Agreed but apparently this one has previously erupted into flames and the gods of the forum want to avoid such pyrophoric topics. Our is not to reason
why, I guess.
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Misanthropy
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It seems PT-141 is being produced in China ATM & is available.
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Sauron
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I did say that China and India are the ussual suspects in the knockoff of such things (cf Viagra).
Having purchased chemicals from China several times, I can tell you that prices are cheap, quality is highly variable and packaging is usually awful.
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Misanthropy
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Well, at $1.2K/Gram, I think I'll wait!
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Sauron
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Assuming they are selling the correct peptide that is 40 doses for $30 US each. About 3C the price of a 100 mg (multi-dose) Viagra.
Doubtless the price will come down later when they retail it and also sell in bulk as they do with sild.
This price is for the earlybirds who don't want to wait, I guess.
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Sandmeyer
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Organikum
Actually we use GBL here whats perfectly legal where I live and I dont give a bloody fuck about the DEA and US laws.
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Actually, I find the effects of GBL a bit "hammering", butandiole even more so, not as clean, cozy as GHB. It seems that GBL and BDO are active in
their own right and not soely as a result of metabolizm into GHB. I was schocked too see that even on tolerance 2 ml GHB produced strong and longer
lasting effect after 300 mg pure caffeine taken 2 hours previously to GHB. Thought I haven't repeated this combo since.
Few things can mach a saturday evening with a cute girl, candle lights and of course a 3 ml GHB dose with small boosters now and then throughout the
night of intensive love-making. Only downside (or maybe not) is that orgazm is quite a body-workout to reach. Too bad GHB is illegal nowdays, so one
has too rely on the legal alternatives.
I have heard from several lucky souls that grass is a good aphrodisiak, but in me it produces too overwhelming paranoia and an impression that I've
gone "mad". Only time I enjoyed it was when watching Simpsons and Futurama stoned with a pot-head friend, hell of a fun.
[Edited on 16-1-2007 by Sandmeyer]
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Misanthropy
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An associate has now sequenced melanotan 2 & PT-141 (acid & amide, so I'm told.)
M2 is said to still be more active upon the libido than PT-141. Activity of PT-141 was reported as negligible at best in this person.
I've recieved samples of both & hope to compare notes in the very near future.
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gregxy
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Another drug which improves libido in older (40+) males is anastazole (arimidex). Arimidex was developed to treat breast cancer in women and binds to
the aromatase enzyme blocking the conversion of testosterone to estrogen. In males, low doses of about 1mg/week increase the ratio of testosterone to
estrogen which helps with both libido and body composition. Too high a dose will completely block estrogen production which is unhealthy and
completely kills the libido. Some theories suggest that testosterone must convert to estrogen in the brain to be effective.
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Sauron
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There's a lot of bullshit on the net about Melanotan II
Melanotan II has no libido enhancing activity.
PT-141 now known as bremelanotide, has that.
And it is not an amide form.
It is Ac-Nle-cyclo(Asp-His-D-Phe-Arg-Trp-Lys)-OH
Melanotan II is not cyclized.
[Edited on 24-2-2007 by Sauron]
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Misanthropy
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I think he meant M2 by that. Regardless, here they sit with some analysis info sheets.
Bioassay will ensue shortly.
[Edited on 2-23-2007 by Misanthropy]
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Sauron
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My understanding is that the tanning agent development is licensed to an entirely different company, while the bremelanotide etc. is licensed to
Palatine Technologies.
The libido enhancing properties were engineered out of the Melanotan II while the same were optimized in PT-141.
The grey market knockoff artists on the Net don't want you to know that, so they can scam you with ersatz melanotan II while insinuating it will do
more than give you a tan. It will not.
And PT-141 won't give you a tan.
They are not spending all those millions on FDA trials for a product that does not work.
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Misanthropy
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This was not purchased. It was made. Directly, by a friend who does this for a living. This is what makes me give his opinion of the results more than
internet based credit.
He didn't claim that PT-141 doesn't work. Just that it didn't work on him, whereas the M2 did. Noticeably.
Apologies for the low res pics; all I've got is a 1.3Mp camera phone, ATM. My camera died. If I can get better scans of this I will. One of these got
torn up by the post office as the vial inside the envelope must've jammed up a handling machine...
Here's the M2
http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/6789/m2bl0.jpg
M2 peaks
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/4475/m2peakswd7.jpg
PT-141
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5543/pt141zy4.jpg
PT-141 peaks
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/9056/pt141peaksct9.jpg
PT-141 data 1
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/9501/pt141tablenh6.jpg
PT-141 data 2
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6126/pt141table2cu8.jpg
PT-141 data 3
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/5738/pt141stuff1ox8.jpg
PT-141 data 4
http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/2153/pt141stuff2wd0.jpg
Random IGF-1 & Phosphate Buffered Saline (just because)
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8459/igf1pbsfr1.jpg
[Edited on 2-24-2007 by Misanthropy]
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