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sciencefreak666
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sometimes internet can be funny.
i was just fooling around and found this method to prepare cyanide
HCOOH + NH3 → HCOONH4
HCOONH4 →(heat) HCONH2 + H2O
then
HCONH2 + KOH → KCN + 2H2O (heat till water evaporates)
now, there is no way in world that preparation of potassium cyanide can be this easy. there got to be some complifications right?
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UnintentionalChaos
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Quote: Originally posted by sciencefreak666  | sometimes internet can be funny.
i was just fooling around and found this method to prepare cyanide
HCOOH + NH3 → HCOONH4
HCOONH4 →(heat) HCONH2 + H2O
then
HCONH2 + KOH → KCN + 2H2O (heat till water evaporates)
now, there is no way in world that preparation of potassium cyanide can be this easy. there got to be some complifications right?
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HCONH2 + OH- => NH3 + HCOO-
Also, I think you're in the wrong thread.
Department of Redundancy Department - Now with paperwork!
'In organic synthesis, we call decomposition products "crap", however this is not a IUPAC approved nomenclature.' -Nicodem
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sciencefreak666
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about that cyanide stuff, wikipedia says so. frankly i have no idea.
about thread, yup, i know, actually the base nicotine there is my only. i just came across this so i posted here.
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zoombafu
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Go look up solubility properties of nicotine, and this should probably be moved to organic chemistry
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Nicodem
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Threads Merged
6-2-2012 at 14:08 |
sciencefreak666
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request to mods - please move to organic chemistry.
did some study on solubility. and yes, nicotine will be extracted from tobacco water to ether.
now there is one question in my mind.
with nicotine what else will get disolved into ether?
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bfesser
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What won't!? Seriously, do some research of your own. Try a real library, not just half-assed Google searches. And, as stated by Organikum, there
are already other threads on this topic--I suggest you read them. Hint: click "Search" up near the top left corner of the page and enter the term
"nicotine".
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zoombafu
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| Quote: Originally posted by sciencefreak666 | request to mods - please move to organic chemistry.
did some study on solubility. and yes, nicotine will be extracted from tobacco water to ether.
now there is one question in my mind.
with nicotine what else will get disolved into ether?
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It depends on what else you are dissolving. If you are extracting from dried tobacco you will need to take in to account all of the other chemicals
that are present, and do research on solubility of those chemicals. If you are doing patches you need to see if there are any binding agents or
additional chemicals present in the patches that would be dissolved.
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sciencefreak666
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"It depends on what else you are dissolving. If you are extracting from dried tobacco you will need to take in to account all of the other chemicals
that are present, and do research on solubility of those chemicals. If you are doing patches you need to see if there are any binding agents or
additional chemicals present in the patches that would be dissolved. "
i am doing from dried tobacco. and yes, there will be lot many chemicals in it.
i tried to google, but i am not able to find any post with exact tobacco contains.
i have already searched this forum, no related posts for what i am upto
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/search.php?token=&srchtxt=nicotine&srchfield=body&srchuname=&f[]=2&srchfrom=0&filter_distin
ct=yes&searchsubmit=Search
anyways, i read couple of posts on yahoo search and found some interesting ideas.
so far i found that tobacco has nicotine, amines and some heavy metal. - thats the best google and yahoo could offer.
i consulted one of by friend/mentor told me that there are some resins and poly phenols.
so if anyone knows the contents of tobacco, please please share.
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Ephoton
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I would probably extract with alcohol looking at nicotines structure.
then evap alcohol and take up in dilute acid.
then wash acid with none polar a few times to defat it and rebase the nicotine with sodium hydroxide.
collect nicotine from solution with none polar of choice.
dry none polar with nicotine in it and then gas with hydrogen chloride to make
crystaline hydrochloride nicotine / anabasine / piperidide mixture.
to purify any further I think your looking at chromatography.
I strongly doubt you will be able to do this or you would already know it.
I have the same thoughts as I did at the start of the thread though now they are confirmed by
the fact your looking into making cyanide with no chemical reason to have it.
(your not making amine with the cyanide or you would know how to extract them)
most alkaloid plant extracts are the same as far as procedure.
there acid base properties are normaly used for purification.
e3500 console login: root
bash-2.05#
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sciencefreak666
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no no, i am not making cyanide..
lol, seriously. i just posted that reaction coz i found it so simple to look at. and thanks.
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Ephoton
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well if your not hurting anyone good luck 
make sure you wear gloves for this and dont boil the freebase in water down.
be aware that some alcohols have water in them.
I am not sure if nicotine will steam distill or not though it should not azeotrope with alcohol.
I have no data to back that up though so boiling down the alcohol from the freebase extract is were
I would be very very carefull ( I would not do it in a confined space and even better in a distillation
setup)
how to extract ephedrine or any other alkaloid should be a good starting point as lots of people
have done that.
It should be possible to make a chromatography column with a clear tube but with out some kind
of analysis to inspect fractions that are collected your realy in the dark and waisting your time
trying to seperate the amines from the tobacco.
there is information here on how to make an IR spectrometer but you will have to make a cuvet and light
source to go with it.
I dont think nicotine brakes down with heat (or we could not smoke it) so it should be an easy extract.
I dont think that cyanide reaction is worth looking at as I have never been able to make it from
formamide but then I never tried that hard.
Cyanides are not nice to work with and I strongly sugest you stay away from them till you have
a lot more chemistry experiance.
e3500 console login: root
bash-2.05#
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sciencefreak666
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"make sure you wear gloves for this and dont boil the freebase in water down." - yes, my friend told me that nicotine will steamdistill. so i wont do
it at all
"be aware that some alcohols have water in them." - i am using diethyl ether.
"I am not sure if nicotine will steam distill or not though it should not azeotrope with alcohol. " - at low temp, i dont think it will.
"I have no data to back that up though so boiling down the alcohol from the freebase extract is were
I would be very very carefull ( I would not do it in a confined space and even better in a distillation
setup)" - true, i am gonna do this part outdoor.
"Cyanides are not nice to work with and I strongly sugest you stay away from them till you have
a lot more chemistry experiance. " - well cyanide = suicide . and thats not on my
mind. not atleast now.
i do have one querry though which i am really really not able to find any answer. half life period of nicotine as freebase is 2 hours.
now when i will extract nicotine into ether, as far as my knowlegde, it will be free base coz i am not adding any acid to collect crystallised
nicotine. so from which point should i start considering the half life period?
coz i am sure its not from water extraction through tobacco, coz black leaf 40 = that water. and it has nicotine.
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sciencefreak666
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guys, i got a pretty serious problem here.
1) i soaked tobacco in water for 5 days.
2) i filtered water from tobacco goo with the help of cloth, throughed the goo away.
3) washed the water from tobacco with Di-etheyl ether.
now i know that there is supposed to be only 2 layers, 1) ether at top which is there. 2) water at bottom which is also ther.
now my problem is there is a third later. between water and ether. i think that layer is ether only. but it is dark in color.
dark brown layer of water at bottom, light brown layer in middle and faint brown layer of ether at top.
now i know nicotine is completely soluble in ether.
so what should i do of second layer, collect it with ether or throw away with water?
please reply asap
[Edited on 11-2-2012 by sciencefreak666]
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slyder
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very good detailed Nicotine extraction is described in this book/website :
http://www.lambdasyn.org/synfiles/nikotin.htm
you need just google translator to translate it from german to english language.
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Nicodem
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Throw away the water? So, you did not even bother checking the logP of nicotine and you don't have a clue about the basic properties of amines or
isolation techniques in general. Additionally, instead of using one of the numerous verified and published procedures, you desperately want to
reinvent the wheel, even though you know not what you are doing and don't bother checking the literature. Meanwhile, despite your total incompetence,
you plan to extract a deadly poison instead of first learning the required skills and gather some basic knowledge. And what is worse, you are
soliciting others into assisting you in your self-destructive behavior.
| Quote: Originally posted by sciencefreak666 | i tried to google, but i am not able to find any post with exact tobacco contains.
i have already searched this forum, no related posts for what i am upto
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/search.php?token=&srchtxt=nicotine&srchfield=body&srchuname=&f[]=2&srchfrom=0&filter_distin
ct=yes&searchsubmit=Search |
How about investing some more effort?
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=3404
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bfesser
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sciencefreak666, please put some effort into your spelling, capitalization, and use of symbols. In chemistry, a single incorrect character can mean
an entirely different thing from what you intend. <em>It's important.</em>
"Di-etheyl ether" should be written as diethyl ether.
Hints:
- Don't arbitrarily capitalize the first letter of compound or element names.
- Dashes are not used after prefixes such as mono, di, tri, tetra, etc.
- Be careful when naming/typing alkane functionalities.
On a related note, you're not making the best first impression on this forum. Take Nicodem's advice, and invest some serious effort into your
research. One decade of bench work can be avoided by one minute of literature research. Don't waste our time, or your own. Hell, we've done half
the work for you, by providing you with the literature. Now <strong>read it</strong>.
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