MrFormula
Harmless
Posts: 20
Registered: 2-10-2023
Member Is Offline
Mood: True neutral
|
|
M8 war agent detection paper
I recently learned about the M8 chemical detection paper. It is used to detect type g and v nerve gas and type h blister gases. It uses three
different dyes for each of the gas types that turns a given color on exposure. The problem is that I cannot find what the dyes are. Any insight would
be greatly appreciated.
|
|
|
j_sum1
Administrator
Posts: 6335
Registered: 4-10-2014
Location: At home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Most of the ducks are in a row
|
|
I am curious. Why would you need or even want to know this?
|
|
|
MrFormula
Harmless
Posts: 20
Registered: 2-10-2023
Member Is Offline
Mood: True neutral
|
|
I do not need to know this I just find it
curious that there is no information that I can find on what makes it change color. I recently learned about cbrn (chemical biological radiological
and nuclear contamination) and came across the M8(C8) paper and just want to know how it work.
Edit: for context my brother and I are really interested in military history and like collecting old gear. This is just one of the things I found.
[Edited on 8-18-24 by MrFormula]
|
|
|
wg48temp9
National Hazard
Posts: 786
Registered: 30-12-2018
Location: not so United Kingdom
Member Is Offline
|
|
I am surprised by j_sum1 comment. Almost everything in the forum is motivated by curiosity even his own question.
I guess, one man's curiosity is another man's waste of time. Similar to the comments some people make about some art installation such a blank canvas
or a. steam locomotive modelled in bricks in a field.
My own curiosity dumbfounds my family and friends LOL It's usually put down to peculiar or craziness LOL They still ask me to fix things for them.
I am wg48 but not on my usual pc hence the temp handle.
Thank goodness for Fleming and the fungi.
Old codger' lives matters, wear a mask and help save them.
Be aware of demagoguery, keep your frontal lobes fully engaged.
I don't know who invented mRNA vaccines but they should get a fancy medal and I hope they made a shed load of money from it.
|
|
|
j_sum1
Administrator
Posts: 6335
Registered: 4-10-2014
Location: At home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Most of the ducks are in a row
|
|
Hats off to a healthy curiosity. My comment was not intended to be disparaging. Apologies if it came across this way.
It just struck me as something extremely niche with no practical applications for the amateur. Nerve agents are already waay out there. And a
(probably proprietary) qualitative test for such seemed to me to be beyond that.
Of course, if you are into military history, that contextualises it.
J.
|
|
|
MrFormula
Harmless
Posts: 20
Registered: 2-10-2023
Member Is Offline
Mood: True neutral
|
|
No worries. I realize that this is a bit odd but hey, I like to learn how things work.
|
|
|
bnull
Hazard to Others
Posts: 480
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: South of the border, wherever the border is.
Member Is Offline
Mood: "Ah, what the hell; it's Christmas!" - Carmine Lorenzo
|
|
It is good to find a fellow war buff around here.
Anyway. You may want to take a look at patent US8404490B1, "Detecting nerve agents and determining the types thereof". They wrote that "M8 paper uses simple acid-base principles for
discrimination that are prone to false positive reactions from environmental interferents." That is quite interesting because the nerve agents either
react with the dye and the color changes or they react with another reagent present in the paper (acid or basic hydrolysis, I guess) and then the
product reacts with the dye.
They also mentioned US army Supply Bulletin SB 3-6665-2, which I haven't found. If you manage to find it, please leave a link.
Attachment: US8404490.pdf (1.5MB)
This file has been downloaded 83 times
Quod scripsi, scripsi.
B. N. Ull
P.S.: Did you know that we have a Library?
|
|
|
EF2000
Hazard to Others
Posts: 153
Registered: 10-5-2023
Location: The Steppes
Member Is Offline
Mood: Taste testing the Tonka fuel
|
|
That supply bulletin can be:
1. On dtic.mil and the Internet Archive (knowing the AD number helps)
2. On bulletpicker.com
3. In the secret repository requiring seven passwords and DNA validation to access (if one password is wrong, you are injected with FOXDIE). Together
with the "SPIA/M2 Propellants Manual" and other invaluable documents that militarists are hiding from humanity. End of rant.
Wroom wroom
"The practice of pouring yourself alcohol from a rocket fuel tank is to be strongly condemned encouraged"
-R-1 User's Guide
|
|
|
bnull
Hazard to Others
Posts: 480
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: South of the border, wherever the border is.
Member Is Offline
Mood: "Ah, what the hell; it's Christmas!" - Carmine Lorenzo
|
|
The first place I had looked was the Army Publishing Directorate, which has 234 Supply Bulletins but not the SB 3-6665-2. The Defense Technical
Information Center gave the same result. bulletpicker.com has many Technical Bulletins and zero Supply Bulletins (I'll bookmark this site for later;
thanks).
FOXDIE has been superseded, by the way. Nowadays they're using Nabazov.
Quod scripsi, scripsi.
B. N. Ull
P.S.: Did you know that we have a Library?
|
|
|
MrFormula
Harmless
Posts: 20
Registered: 2-10-2023
Member Is Offline
Mood: True neutral
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by bnull  | You may want to take a look at patent US8404490B1, "Detecting nerve agents and determining the types thereof".
They also mentioned US army Supply Bulletin SB 3-6665-2, which I haven't found. If you manage to find it, please leave a link.
|
I found that patent and a few related ones in my search. I was not able to find SB 3-6665-2 but I will continue to look. I also posted on the us
militaria forum and was sent a link to the safety data sheet of the M8 paper. This might be out of date though. I can only find information on one of
the chemicals and none of the rest and I feel like that's how it is with a lot of old organic dyes. https://www.qckslvr.com/Images/quicksilveranalytics/sds/_I__...
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
