Anilin
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Kitchen chemistry
Hi,
I am new to this forum. I would like to start this thread with the hope that its non obvious chemical aspect will interest most of you. I have not
read all the previous thread of the forum and hope that this topic has not been already discussed. As it is somehow "unobvious", I guess
that not.
Now the topic.
The basic idea is to be able to get any kind of chemicals one needs, but only from all the things which are available in an ordinary house/appartment.
For instance, try to make/get ammoniac gas at home. So you could build a kind of electrolytic system from batteries, salts and solutions to produce
your gas.
A house/appartment is on the first look not a place to get/make chemicals. But if we think "mc gyver" like, we surely find something to do
with all things in the kitchen, pharmacy, and any related material. For instance, everybody has a good amount of platine Pt at home (about a gramm -
the sufficient amount for electrolysis), but where??? hehe, so let's start the discussion.
Let's first find some chemicals or chemical tools to make/build, and then let's discuss how to make them.
I don't want to provide with this topic a new terro-rist cookbook like, but rather an intelligent way of thinking about unusual and useful
utilisation & application of every day objects on the way of funny chemistry.
The whole applied to chemistry, perhaps a little physic too.
Thanks for your replies.
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DeusExMachina
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I think this should be in the Miscellaneous or the Reagents and Apparatus Aquistion forum.
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Marvin
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If we all act like McGuyver than all out problems will be solved by the moons gravity.
I think what you are suggesting is about half this whole forum, but it depends how far you want to go. Ultimatly the most impressive or useful
chemistry/physics you can do will be limited by what you can buy. Additionally many industrial and lab methods arnt suitable to home use and many
home chemists have been killed by toxic fumes from attempted reactions.
For everything Ive made at home, Ive given up doing it when IVe found somewhere that would sell me it directly. Finding people that will sell
chemicals is much more feasable than the total grass roots DIY.
[Edited on 12-4-2003 by Marvin]
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Organikum
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I neither understand Anilin nor Marvin. Uuups. Gladly I understand DeusExMachina and agree that this belongs in "miscellaneous" if anywhere.
Anilin, if you would have read a little in this board you might have realized that half the threads cover exactly this: How to produce hard to get
chemicals needed for knowsthedevil whatever. That you haven´t bothered on reading a little on the board makes me think you are not realy interested
in what we are doing here. Maybe you are looking for somebody doing some work for you.....
It is at least unpolite to act this way and if you think you are the one who was awaited here - not exactly, sorry on this.
Marvin, I agree on "kitchen"-chemistry not being optimal, but where did most start? In the kitchen until we got thrown out.
And was it not the try to produce these substances which gave the most valuable knowledge also we gladly get the shit nowadays ready prepared from
unnamed sources? Wouldn´t we miss something if we hadn´t done this? Not to speak of the feeling to know that you can make it by yourself f you want
to.
The "nonadaptability of industrial processes" statement annoyes me as getting not more true by repetition. I cannot see any sense in it.
Having a closer look and deciding then if it is doable or not is the preferable way to go. Amateur experimentalism and prejudices don´t mix well.
And Anilin, your platinum is in the catalytic converter of the car. Have fun to get it outa there in your kitchen. For what you waste on chemicals I
buy 3 gram platinum wire without any problems.
Breaking a hole in the wall is stupid if there is a door wide open, Mr. Mc Gyver.
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Anilin
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I neither understand Anilin nor Marvin. Uuups. Gladly I understand DeusExMachina and agree that this belongs in "miscellaneous" if anywhere.
>>well, I have not read carefully this huge forum because my time is short. Nethertheless, I first posted this message here because I thought
that it could be developped and go into (mostly) organic chemistry details. For example, the beloved synthesis of nitric acid with isolations and
purifications steps discussed.
Anilin, if you would have read a little in this board you might have realized that half the threads cover exactly this: How to produce hard to get
chemicals needed for knowsthedevil whatever.
>>That's the reason why I thought it would be right to post. And as I have written, some topics may already have been discussed, but not
all or at least not as far/global as I thought.
That you haven´t bothered on reading a little on the board makes me think you are not realy interested in what we are doing here.
>Not at all the case, but I understand taht you say this.
Maybe you are looking for somebody doing some work for you.....
>No thanx, I don't want to depend from somebody
It is at least unpolite to act this way and if you think you are the one who was awaited here - not exactly, sorry on this.
>>well the first step in a ring is not always obvious. But I am not an unpolite wanting to get "fast money". I justed hope to start
this thread with persons having interesting ideas. The problem in chemistry for a forum like this, is that one synthesis step can be as well as
organic, inorganic or miscellanous chemistry.
Marvin, I agree on "kitchen"-chemistry not being optimal, but where did most start?
>>why not trying to optimize it? that was another point of my aim. And here, you will face mostly strong organic chemistry knowledge. Another
reason for my decision to post in this directory.
In the kitchen until we got thrown out.
And was it not the try to produce these substances which gave the most valuable knowledge also we gladly get the shit nowadays ready prepared from
unnamed sources?
>>The other point is that if you depend from a company to provide you the chemicals you need, then if you are middle in nowhere without the
possibility to order to a company, you are lost. That was resumed as "mc gyver" even if I find it a bad reference. That was another argument
to think on this subject for knowledge reasons
Wouldn´t we miss something if we hadn´t done this? Not to speak of the feeling to know that you can make it by yourself f you want to.
The "nonadaptability of industrial processes" statement annoyes me as getting not more true by repetition. I cannot see any sense in it.
Having a closer look and deciding then if it is doable or not is the preferable way to go. Amateur experimentalism and prejudices don´t mix well.
>>In deed. I woud not say better.
And Anilin, your platinum is in the catalytic converter of the car. Have fun to get it outa there in your kitchen.
>>I wish you the same because it is your idea. I would rather use the metal area recovering my electric razor. They are all of Pt because of
(non-)allergical reasons. And 2/ my kitchen would not turn in a big mess!
For what you waste on chemicals I buy 3 gram platinum wire without any problems.
>>of course. But I repeat, how do you go forth, if you cannot oredr what you need. And I do not want to (as I already said) prepare terrorists.
We can think about things which are not at all harmful, but still elaborated and funny for the only purpose of knowledge.
Breaking a hole in the wall is stupid if there is a door wide open, Mr. Mc Gyver.
>>I agree with you, except that my nick is anilin. And to close this topic as I see that nobody seems to be interested in, I have learnt
recently that you can get your own battery with a pencil, salt water (sea water) and an aluminium can. So now let's phantasm that you are on a
desert island after a crash. You have now an easy way to make some electricity with water, hood and the can you've just saved.
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Marvin
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Organikum, I'm sorry but if you are interpreting 'many industrial and lab procedures are unsuitable' as 'industrial methods cannot
be done at home' then it is your prejudices affecting your judgement, not mine.
I dislike 'kitchen chemistry', aside from the fact food is prepared in the kitchen, people are normally edjucated how to do a reaction
several years before they learn how to do it safely. Usually after this they realise that people are quite willing to sell them the aparatus to do it
properly, and that people will sell them most of the chemicals theyve spent months trying to make at home from household items.
I think most people should aspire to having a home lab, rather than to do 'real' chemistry in the kitchen.
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Ramiel
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Jesus, what are we? some kind of chemical KGB... I think not. Besides, it's his bloody kitchen, he can do what he wants in it.
Agenda: Item one. "We will now decide whether this new person is worthy of posting here"
; P
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people will sell them most of the chemicals theyve spent months trying to make at home from household items
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that's sometimes half the fun of it!
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food is prepared in the kitchen
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my brother is a chef, and I would heartily disagree with your assertion.
Caveat Orator
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Organikum
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Anilin, what brand of razor do you use? No joke, I realy want to know!
Madscientist, if it´s your kitchen and you use it as lab, it´s your lab not your kitchen. Just a question of definition. For me living alone I
prefer to say "workspace". Includes everything except the sleeping room. Office and living room im traditional sense got expatriated to a
virtual existance on the net. Makes cleaning up and getting rid of unpleasant guests much easier!
Marvin, if I got you wrong on the industrial processes so sorry. I am quite thin on nervs on this and probably tend to overreaction. Kind of
"industrial process and microwave disorder" - I am working on it, ok?
Anilins first post had no content making it belong in this forum. Miscellenous would still be the right place.
So I don´t want to argue for nothing, I am outa this thread - wasting my time somewhere with fun. 
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madscientist
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| Quote: | | Madscientist, if it´s your kitchen and you use it as lab... |
Huh? I hadn't posted in this thread until now. 
Experimenting with toxic chemicals where meals are cooked is asking for trouble. But if the kitchen became the lab and some other room became the
kitchen, fine.
It is great to have a room designated as a lab (which I do).
[Edited on 14-4-2003 by madscientist]
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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PHILOU Zrealone
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I would define kitchen chemistry as all the chemical aspects that enter the cooking and the meal making!
-Mayonnaise and emulsions
-Protein cooking
-caramelisation
-Interaction between proteins and suggars while cooking
-Acidic/basical cooking of coloured vegetables
-bread fermentation/maturation
-salt in water to increase cooking temperature
-....
All this is Kitchen chemistry!
What you are refering to is more like homemade chemistry from household chemicals!
   
PH Z (PHILOU Zrealone)
"Physic is all what never works; Chemistry is all what stinks and explodes!"-"Life that deadly disease, sexually transmitted."(W.Allen)
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Organikum
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Outch, sorry madscientist. Seems the raging industrial process disorder is going to create own levels of reality now....
whats next to come?
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Blind Angel
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Reset
I agree with Philou Kitchen chemistry is involved with cooking, why not continue on this way, anyone here has the perfect recipy to create the
greatest cake ever, i know someone already studied it if we could get a hand on his work
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Anilin
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Oh and btw, DeusExMachina can you say something else than "I think this should be in the Miscellaneous or the ... forum."??
And while you are discussing the weather on the word "kitchen", some others want to make PETol without knowing its chemistry, or keep
sulfuric acid in plastic bottles and wonder that they are wunded when the bottle dissolves...
hihi.
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Madog
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ive kept it in bottles that i bought alcahol in, also, i had some in a little plastic cup from a cough syrup bottle and it browned the sides after
some time
Most people outgrow their pyro tendencies, we are the ones who\'s tendencies outgrew us.
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Organikum
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Do you speak of concentrated H2SO4 or diluted one 38% 55% 70% ?
There is a slight but important difference...
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FloridaAlchemist
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HomeLab
A homelab is a good idea for a chemistry hobby ....Get a storage shed or garage but not a kitchen...too dangerous if you have kids...and a apartment
lab will cause too many complaints by your neighbors.
I started out with a section of my parents garage many years ago...Now that Iam a chemist I relize the value of this as a educational tool but todays
world is much different. If you have a homelab society thinks you are a bomb maker or drug maker.
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MissKitty
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Need Help
I need help!!! i need a kitchen chemist version of a non-toxic substance similar to chloroform. please help!!!
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vulture
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Someone like you shouldn't be experimenting with chems, IMHO, because you obviously have no clue of chemistry.
Read a book or search, we won't spoon feed you the answer, especially because it seems that you are up to some malicious act.
One shouldn't accept or resort to the mutilation of science to appease the mentally impaired.
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MissKitty
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screw you
First off, I happen to know a hell of alot about chemistry. Second, I don't use my knowledge of chemistry for anything malicious or harmful. I
have done my research and I have read books but I have yet to find anything remotely safe. If I was going to commit a malicious act, I wouldn't
want a non-toxic version of chloroform, now would I, smart one. Thanks for your help. Next time I need help from someone with their head up their ass,
I'll call you.
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Polverone
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Question's too vague
How does it need to be similar to chloroform? Do you mean an inhalation anaesthetic that isn't toxic to the liver? Or do you mean a solvent that
will behave much like chloroform but not be (as) toxic? Or do you just need a liquid of approximately the same density, regardless of its solvent
action? Try to give a little more background on the problem and it'll be easier to answer.
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AngelEyes
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"First off, I happen to know a hell of alot about chemistry" - a HELL OF ALOT? yeah, right.
it makes me laugh....
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vulture
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Firstly, everyone can claim he or she knows alot about chemistry. If so, you would have found something else yourself.
Secondly, FLAMING moderators, which I happen to be, is not a smart thing if you want to get help or stay here for long.
I wouldn't want a non-toxic version of chloroform, now would I, smart one.
Yes you would. A non-toxic version could still be used to incapacitate someone.
[Edited on 21-8-2003 by vulture]
One shouldn't accept or resort to the mutilation of science to appease the mentally impaired.
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chloric1
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Could not agree more
Madscientist---you are so correct about the food/ toxin trouble in the kitchen. Kitchens are FULL of porous surfaces. Many toxins commonly played
with are oils or other impossible to remove residues. Lets not forget the inadvertant heavy metal contamination. YUM YUM! I am very limited on
saftey equipment but I am quite prudent in my caution and in cleanliness. I work outdoors in a cross breeze. If a chemical will be damaged by
weather I make storage provisions indoors but I NEVER concoct in in living quarters unless it is of little consequence. So enjoy be safe and all
means LEARN!
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jimwig
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if memory serves there are about 0.028 grams of pgm's in the honeycomb type of catalytic converter.
on some applications using the comb as it emerges from the muffler might work IF it is not poisoned. And if it is poisoned it must heated to a temp
sufficient to remove the oxidation. 2000F ?
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