Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
Bamboozled
Welp, the time has come for me to dispose of my HMTD. It's just too dangerous for me to handle, nor do I have a proper way to store it. I need a way
to dispose of it chemically, and if push comes to detonation, then I'll just blow it up underground.
Now what I need from you guys is a simple (preferably) way to dispose of it chemically. Now: I know that cc. NaOH (solution) works for TATP, will it
work for HMTD?
ANY help is warmly welcomed.
Cheers!
~T
[Edited on 30-3-2016 by Tetra]
|
|
Bot0nist
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 1559
Registered: 15-2-2011
Location: Right behind you.
Member Is Offline
Mood: Streching my cotyledons.
|
|
Attachment: tmp_16940-2008 Destruction of Peroxide Explosives695709667.pdf (492kB) This file has been downloaded 584 times
The url.
http://energetics.chm.uri.edu/system/files/2008%2520Destruct...
May be best to dissolve in a solvent and safely burn. What quantity are you talking about?
[Edited on 30-3-2016 by Bot0nist]
U.T.F.S.E. and learn the joys of autodidacticism!
Don't judge each day only by the harvest you reap, but also by the seeds you sow.
|
|
hissingnoise
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3940
Registered: 26-12-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Pulverulescent!
|
|
Quote: | Welp, the time has come for me to dispose of my HMTD. |
HMTD hydrolyses slowly in cold water so its disposal is not that big a deal . . . ?
In boiling water the decomposition is rapid!
|
|
hissingnoise
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3940
Registered: 26-12-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Pulverulescent!
|
|
'Course, if you're in a real big hurry?
|
|
Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by hissingnoise ![](images/xpblue/lastpost.gif) | Quote: | Welp, the time has come for me to dispose of my HMTD. |
HMTD hydrolyses slowly in cold water so its disposal is not that big a deal . . . ?
In boiling water the decomposition is rapid!
|
It does??
I had no idea. I know that it is insoluble so I didn't think that it would work that way.
|
|
Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
Problem is, I don't have a lot of this stuff... THF... Helium gas... Copper Chloride... ETC and I am pressed for money as I am getting a job this
summer. Plus, I remember someone telling me about dissolving it in Toluene and burning the mixture, which I think I'll try. I just asked this question
because I believed the procedure to be different. Thanks anyways.
|
|
hissingnoise
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3940
Registered: 26-12-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Pulverulescent!
|
|
HMTD is sparingly soluble in water ─ I know of no solvent that will readily dissolve HMTD . . . ?
|
|
Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
"sparingly" doesn't give me that good of an idea. Do you have a g/ml or something?
|
|
hissingnoise
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3940
Registered: 26-12-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Pulverulescent!
|
|
I don't actually, but it's googleable, I'm sure . . .
If you've less than a kg, just deflagrate it in small batches!
|
|
Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
That's the problem! I've had some detonate when I was sure it'd deflagrate!
|
|
XeonTheMGPony
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 1638
Registered: 5-1-2016
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
dig a shallow pit, dump it in, set an electric match, then fire from a distance
|
|
Tsjerk
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3026
Registered: 20-4-2005
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mood
|
|
What is the problem with flushing it down the drain? It does not contain heavy metals so it doesn't form a problem for the environment. If it doesn't
explode in your sink it won't do it in the sewer. HMTD is degraded in aqueous environments.
|
|
hissingnoise
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 3940
Registered: 26-12-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Pulverulescent!
|
|
Quote: | I've had some detonate when I was sure it'd deflagrate! |
Clean HMTD shouldn't detonate in small quantities when it's initiated by flame!
But contact with strongly heated metal may cause detonation . . . ?
How much do you have?
|
|
Hennig Brand
International Hazard
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 1284
Registered: 7-6-2009
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Thought this might be of interest. Taken from the abstract of the paper, "Determination of peroxide-based explosives with copper(II)–neocuproine
assay combined with a molecular spectroscopic sensor":
"The two members of peroxide-based explosives, triacetone triperoxide (TATP) and hexamethylene triperoxide diamine (HMTD), can be manufactured from
readily accessible reagents, and are difficult to detect by conventional analytical methods. TATP and HMTD were securely synthesized, taken up with
acetone, hydrolyzed with 4 M HCl to hydrogen peroxide, the acidic solution containing H2O2 was neutralized,.........."
Personally, I would just use an electric match for ignition in a safe location. If it was spread out in a thin enough trail it would just deflagrate
or at least would be a much less intense/less powerful event than if it was ignited in one big pile. When it's gone it's gone and there is no doubt or
need for further worry. The idea of dissolving it in acetone, if a suitable solvent, and burning seems like a good one.
[Edited on 21-4-2016 by Hennig Brand]
"A risk-free world is a very dull world, one from which we are apt to learn little of consequence." -Geerat Vermeij
|
|
Rhodanide
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 348
Registered: 23-7-2015
Location: The 80s
Member Is Offline
Mood: That retro aesthetic
|
|
I ended up burying it a 2 feet under dense soil in a compostable container, and let time do its work. It's almost gone now.
|
|
kratomiter
Hazard to Others
![*](images/xpblue/star.gif) ![*](images/xpblue/star.gif)
Posts: 106
Registered: 30-9-2012
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I stored a little HDMT long time ago and even pure it decomposes slowly over time, so nature will do its job.
|
|