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peach
Bon Vivant
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Someone bought the acid.
I was very close to buying it (having found a cheap shipping option), but then I figured there wasn't really an easy enough way to get it back to 36%
and clean; even distilling it, it wouldn't come back to the full concentration.
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jon
Hazard to Others
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speaking of e-snitch i tried to do some large transactions cash and carry off ebay and they wanted to pay auction fees and go through thier system
which always piques my suspicions.
even offered more money as it was'nt the object nope nope they reply.
i just deal with trusted chemical houses.
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peach
Bon Vivant
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It's not that suspicious.
I offer to pay in cash all the time so people don't have the transaction charges to deal with. Or transfer directly to their bank account.
A lot of people don't want random people from the internet turning up at their homes, particularly if it's to do with chemicals or laboratory gear.
Others don't want the hassle of checking their bank accounts.
And others are using the checkout system for their record keeping, particularly the ones that are actual shops in real life and that need the invoices
as proof of sale for the tax returns.
PayPal is an utter joke. I've spoken to a lot of people who've forgotten they have telephone / online banking. Something is telling me, a transfer
directly between the banks is going to be more secure than the super secure service PayPal witter on about.
It's free. And if you pay the cash in, in person, to the teller, they'll give you a signed receipt from the bank. There will be no arguing over the
validity of THAT in court.
eBay used to not accept PayPal for paying my seller fees, because of the ridiculous transaction charges. Now they own it, they not only accept it,
they force me to offer it on every single auction and, for some of them, nothing else. Some of the categories they apply that to are equally
ridiculous, I don't usually sell designer clothing, let alone knocked off designer clothing.
Forcing people to solely use the system they own, and charge for, is skirting the monopoly laws regarding free trade. Legal, but also not really in
the spirit of the law.
They also went through a period of not letting the seller back charge for the transaction fees. Then modified that to say, well, if you include the
PayPal logo in the auction, it's okay.
They're also planning to ditch all the auctions (which require staff to moderate) and switch to just being a shop. Great, so a decades worth of people
making the site famous by auctions will now become a shop. An auction site, that is a fixed price shop. That is one long term advertising plan.
They're doing it all the time. I'm on there literally everyday having a look around, and have been since I was about 14. They're constantly playing
with every fine detail to get the absolute maximum out of people by pushing it in ways most of the users don't realize, constantly tweaking the
agreements, the bid histories, the fraud protection and so on.
There is one universal constant, they will always tell you they're doing it for your security and to make things easier for you. Like the
anti-ter-roar on the radio all the time.
I have come very close to taking eBay to court, over £12 they withdrew from my bank account after I presented them with all the postage receipts,
codes and told them I was in the process of making a claim in the first place.
Even still, when I'm talking with their legal department, they'll try to fob you off with utter bullshit that is just entirely invalid in a court. The
judge will tell them to drop it.
They make it look legal and it'll work for pretty much all of the users. But, if you have some experience with trade laws and courts, it certainly is
not. Their terms are not what the law says you're entitled to, and neither they (nor anyone else, including yourself) can overrule the law with your
own terms and conditions.
e.g. "Works fine, but no returns" <---- Legally unsound.
[Edited on 19-10-2010 by peach]
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bremac
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you guys are going to worry yourselves to an early grave. I am one of the ebay vendors that you discuss, I have/had Prochemika, I had listed over time
borohydride, lithium aluminum hydride, sodium hydride, acetyl bromide, diethylamine, propiophenone, benzylic acid, DCM, MEK, toluene, acetic acid,
permanganate, dichromate, benzyl chloride, diphenylacetic acid, diphenylacetonitrile, acetonitrile, quinone, isopropyl nitrite, activated manganese
dioxide, hydrobromic acid, sodium cyanate, cyclohexanone, mercuric chloride, tert butanol, palladium chloride, palladium on carbon and so on...
ebay was not my only business, we were a legit registered business and all stock was properly cleared through customs one item at a time and they were
given to us under the understanding that they were for resale. No matter what you think, if a chemical is not specifically specified as an illegal
chemical, there are only like two illegal chemicals that aren't drugs, GBL and P2P. All others are listed either threshold or not, listed means
regulated if over threshold, there are many excemptions, for example, I could sell you benzaldehyde under threshold so long as it is put up for
packaging for end user and my company sells more than just chemicals. If its over threshold or I only sell chemicals then its regulated and i need a
permit and must keep records of the sale but I don't need to report. ONly blatantly suspicious orders are supposed to be reported.
I had 3,4methylenedioxyhydromethylcinnamaldehyde on there for a while, it isn't even watched, you can't be arrested for having an unlisted chemical,
come on you guys, you are being paranoid. With respect to the comment about how it doesn't matter what you have you can be arrested for conspiracy or
whatever, YES you are right, but in that case EVERYTHING is illegal, coffee filters, pop bottles you use to store stuff, distilled water. An
unregulated chemical can be purchased and sold like costume jewellery and there is nothing police can do about it.
Case in point. I was raided by transport canada agents about four months ago. I foolishly tried to save a cheap bastard a few bucks cuz he would n't
pay for tdg shipping but had already bought the product and refused to reverse the sale, so i expressed it to him and I got nailed.
when transport came all they cared about was whether or not the chemicals were allowed for transport in passenger carriers. They said all the
chemicals were cleared by customs and you can do as you please with them but you have to ship them right. Even though i was very friendly they got
nervous after seeing my files from my military backgroumd as a scout sniper and training in your ODA program so they called in an rcmp car. He had a
look around and saw a bottle of gaba (in a nutritional supplements company with ingredient lists and products all over containing the product) so he
decided he found a ghb lab, one with no equipment at all. He didn't care about the 25 bottles of methylamine, diethylamine, quinone,
phenylacetonitrile, red phos, phenylacetic acid, sodium azide, iodine...nothing, they didn't show up as regulated under the context he was
investigating so he arrested me for ghb production and i went to jail for the night. by morning they were my best friends and apologizing as they
found no evidence. they were curious if i was able to make a living on the chems and if i felt like i may be supplying any drug labs. I said no and
i only sell maximum of 250g containers so a lab can't do much with that. so he said ok well you'll get all your stuff back when we close the case and
we aren't charging you with the twenty five mdma tablets or fifty bottles of trenbolone acetate or the fifty thousand clenbuterol tabs and other
homone drugs. He said they just want to be sure not to release anything under excemption because i have a record and can't get a permit and i hadn't
designated a person in charge. They took only the phenylacetic acid because it was in the reagent bottle, not one with a product name for end use.
Transport wanted to veiw my records and i refused, they said i could go to jail but i still refused, they called ebay
and...............................EBAY TOLD THEM TO FUCK OFF!!!! you guys are jumping to conclusions and listening to drug folklore, take it from me,
i've lived the ebay nightmare, they are not in the business of getting you in trouble. Its those bastard busy body cunts who get off looking for guys
selling something that is three times removed as a useful chem and reporting it to the dea and they have a duty to follow up.
I was paid by the rcmp to do a seminar as they knew my background, i'd been popped for production before, addressing the safety factors they face
going into a lab. You would not believe the ignorance, they know nothing, for them looking at my list or my friends in vancouver with the phosphorous
acid etc.. is like looking at the list of a ceramics supplier, its meaningless, if its not exactly on the list they have no idea, its in german to
them. I flooded them with false information and misdirection but did tell them what they needed to be safe going in. I didn't go back into business
but one did pull me over one time to ask if i managed to get business back on track and just what i was up to.
The list that started this thread is not a problem, not one problem on there. If you think the man has time to come and arrest you and put you on
trial and pay a hundred thousand dollars per year to keep you in prison because you bought 3,4 dimethoxy benzaldehyde that isn't even a drug chemical
then you are feeling a little self important.
here it is right from the mouths of LE, "we can only pay attention to the biggest cases, usually tips from informants and agents, we couldn't care
less about people buying small bottles of research reagents, we don't have the resources. If its in our face, yes we will proceed but we don't comb
ebay and forums looking for people buying or selling bits of this or that"
one time they called and said hey b, we see that you imported two kg of borohydride, it sat at customs with a ripped label and they got suspicious it
may be a bomb or something so they got us over to take a sample. Just want to check its in your posession now and safe. Can we have your word this
isnt going to any drug production, we know it can be used for that but you just have to act ethically for yourself, we can't make you stop, its not
illegal.
Yah, its a lynch mob. They aren't that bad gents, they are bad when you are a prick crying constitution and police brutality while they put you in
the car, treat as you wish to be treated and they will reciprocate.
Relax and just don't be stupid, you have rights as citizens of your country to do as you please so long as you don't breaki the law, don't let them
make you feel like they can make the laws as they go.
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mr.crow
National Hazard
Posts: 884
Registered: 9-9-2009
Location: Canada
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Thank you very much for your post bremac.
I saw your store on ebay and wondered why it disappeared. Did you get your reagents back? Are you still willing to sell them?
Double, double toil and trouble; Fire burn, and caldron bubble
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franklyn
International Hazard
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Registered: 30-5-2006
Location: Da Big Apple
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Okay, being that it will soon be Halloween
I 'm curious , so how do you frighten a chemical ?
Do you just unscrew the top off the jar and say Booo ?
Attachment: horrors.mid (29kB)
This file has been downloaded 776 times
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entropy51
Gone, but not forgotten
Posts: 1612
Registered: 30-5-2009
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| Quote: | Even though i was very friendly they got nervous after seeing my files from my military backgroumd as a scout sniper and training in your ODA program
so they called in an rcmp car.
by morning they were my best friends and apologizing as they found no evidence. I was paid by the rcmp to do a seminar as they knew my background, i'd
been popped for production before, addressing the safety factors they face going into a lab.
I flooded them with false information and misdirection but did tell them what they needed to be safe going in. I didn't go back into business but one
did pull me over one time to ask if i managed to get business back on track and just what i was up to. |
Sniffff. Is that the odor of troll?
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spirocycle
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| Quote: | | so he said ok well you'll get all your stuff back when we close the case and we aren't charging you with the twenty five mdma tablets or fifty bottles
of trenbolone acetate or the fifty thousand clenbuterol tabs and other homone drugs. |
wat?
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psychokinetic
National Hazard
Posts: 558
Registered: 30-8-2009
Location: Nouveau Sheepelande.
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"they called ebay and...............................EBAY TOLD THEM TO FUCK OFF!!!"
Heh, heh.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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food
Hazard to Self
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it's good to scare them periodically
helps keep them in their element
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Synthettek
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Quote: Originally posted by bremac  |
you guys are going to worry yourselves to an early grave. I am one of the ebay vendors that you discuss, I have/had Prochemika.
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Good to see you back again, brother. I sent you a U2U.
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jon
Hazard to Others
Posts: 459
Registered: 11-1-2006
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Mood: paranoid distrustful apprehensive
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i'm having an mdp2p blowout on ebay next week first come, first served.
really? i can set up shop like that?
cool thanks!!!!
[Edited on 22-10-2010 by jon]
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majortom
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Your words make sense, but I still don't trust up and coming judges and DA's as others have said.
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jon
Hazard to Others
Posts: 459
Registered: 11-1-2006
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Mood: paranoid distrustful apprehensive
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never underestimate the ambition of a fresh law school graduate.
and the very worst and the worst of the are those black robed priests who are convinced they are doing the work of the lord.
I have also read from statements of ebay represenatives that they will hand over information to LE upon request.
i find the sources and gladly cite them.
[Edited on 23-10-2010 by jon]
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madscientist
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| Quote: | | If you think the man has time to come and arrest you and put you on trial and pay a hundred thousand dollars per year to keep you in prison because
you bought 3,4 dimethoxy benzaldehyde that isn't even a drug chemical then you are feeling a little self important. |
I don't know Canadian law, but in a number of US states possession of 3,4-methylenedioxybenzaldehyde is a 10 year mandatory minimum felony. It's a
different story entirely down here.
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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Nicodem
Super Moderator
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| Quote: Originally posted by madscientist | | Quote: | | If you think the man has time to come and arrest you and put you on trial and pay a hundred thousand dollars per year to keep you in prison because
you bought 3,4 dimethoxy benzaldehyde that isn't even a drug chemical then you are feeling a little self important. |
I don't know Canadian law, but in a number of US states possession of 3,4-methylenedioxybenzaldehyde is a 10 year mandatory minimum felony. It's a
different story entirely down here. |
3,4-Dimethoxybenzaldehyde (aka veratraldehyde) is not a drug precursor and as far as I know its commerce is not regulated in any country whatsoever.
It is a moderately common chemical and also quite cheap. 3,4-Methylenedioxybenzaldehyde (aka piperonal) is a different chemical and the commerce of
this one is indeed regulated in some countries, though I never heard that there are actually countries where its possession would be illegal (though
it does not surprise me if this is due to some obscure US state law).
…there is a human touch of the cultist “believer” in every theorist that he must struggle against as being
unworthy of the scientist. Some of the greatest men of science have publicly repudiated a theory which earlier they hotly defended. In this lies their
scientific temper, not in the scientific defense of the theory. - Weston La Barre (Ghost Dance, 1972)
Read the The ScienceMadness Guidelines!
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madscientist
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Thought he might've been thinking of piperonal, since he was mentioning a lot of precursors in his post.
Either way, maybe you can get away with what he had in Canada, but in the US he would've gone to jail for a long time. I don't want anyone having any
misconceptions on this, as the consequences are far too severe for mistakes.
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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jon
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in some states possesion of 5 grams phenyl acetic acid = automatic intent charges/
along with other things like red p and iodine without permit.
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anotheronebitesthedust
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From the US federal sentencing guidelines.
http://www.ussc.gov/2010guid/20100121_Reader_Friendly_Propos...
| Quote: | List I Chemicals Level 12
Less than 2.7 KG of Anthranilic Acid;
Less than 3.6 G of Benzaldehyde;
Less than 80 G of Benzyl Cyanide;
Less than 800 MG of Ergonovine;
Less than 1.6 G of Ergotamine;
Less than 80 G of Ethylamine;
Less than 8.8 G of Hydriodic Acid;
Less than 5 G of Iodine;
Less than 1.44 KG of Isosafrole;
Less than 800 MG of Methylamine;
Less than 3.6 KG of N-Acetylanthranilic Acid;
Less than 2.25 KG of N-Methylephedrine;
Less than 2.25 KG of N-Methylpseudoephedrine;
Less than 2.5 G of Nitroethane;
Less than 40 G of Norpseudoephedrine;
Less than 80 G of Phenylacetic Acid;
Less than 40 G of Piperidine;
Less than 1.44 KG of Piperonal;
Less than 7.2 G of Propionic Anhydride;
Less than 1.44 KG of Safrole;
Less than 1.8 KG of 3, 4-Methylenedioxyphenyl-2-propanone;
Less than 4.5 L of Gamma-butyrolactone;
Less than 3 G of Red Phosphorus, White Phosphorus, or Hypophosphorous Acid;
List II Chemicals
Less than 66 G of Acetic Anhydride;
Less than 7.05 KG of Acetone;
Less than 120 G of Benzyl Chloride;
Less than 6.45 KG of Ethyl Ether;
Less than 7.2 KG of Methyl Ethyl Ketone;
Less than 60 G of Potassium Permanganate;
Less than 7.8 KG of Toluene. |
Of course they still need to prove intent.
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redfox87
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Theres a lot of uranium on ebay, I always thought that was a bit odd.
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smaerd
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I don't get that list at all? So you can get prosecuted for having less than 7.05kg of acetone or you can't be? If it is less than that's ridiculous.
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psychokinetic
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Admittedly that's a lot of acetone, but you'd be screwed if you just wanted to stock up so you could always have clean fingernails.
“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found
the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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madscientist
National Hazard
Posts: 962
Registered: 19-5-2002
Location: American Midwest
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| Quote: | | Of course they still need to prove intent. |
They need to prove intent for "intent to manufacture" charges. They do not need to prove intent for lesser, though still very serious, "possession of
a precursor" charges.
I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride.
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mr.crow
National Hazard
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Oh no the Canadian eBay seller in question no longer has anything for sale
Someone in Quebec is spamming a lot of Iodine crystals. Some real iodine would be nice to get ahold of, not the home made stuff.
Double, double toil and trouble; Fire burn, and caldron bubble
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Rogeryermaw
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what's the difference? i have made it from potassium iodide and sublime it twice for cleaning. it produces some very pretty blueish silvery crystals
almost an inch and a half long like little sword tips. quite nice looking and rather pure.
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