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evil_lurker
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Another home lab gets busted...
This one hits pretty close to home:
http://www.jacksonsun.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=20088111...
A lawyer says a Union University student who drug police said had a "clandestine lab" in his off-campus apartment was actually using the lab for
research on antibiotics and cancer treatments.
Joe Byrd, who is representing 22-year-old David Cook, said Union professors and staff knew about the lab and helped provide Cook with chemicals for
his research. Glassware from the school was also part of the setup, he said.
"In my opinion, it was an independent academic study on his own," Byrd said Monday.
But he added, "A whole lot of people knew what he was doing there.
"He (Cook) had multiple roommates. ... At least one member of the faculty, and I think two, in chemistry and biology knew what he was doing," Byrd
said.
So far, Cook has only been charged with possession of marijuana and drug paraphernalia after police searched his apartment last week. He pleaded not
guilty to the charges on Friday and is out on bond.
Byrd on Monday said he is speaking for Cook and his family regarding the charges.
Byrd said Cook admits having possession of marijuana. He said Cook's not guilty plea is tentative and that he will likely seek drug counseling through
a diversion agreement with prosecutors.
Drug officers have said they are waiting for test results on chemicals seized from the apartment before filing additional charges.
Union spokesman Tim Ellsworth on Monday said he could only confirm Cook is a student at the school. He said school officials had no comment on the
police investigation or on Byrd's statement that Union faculty and staff knew about the lab and provided materials for it.
Byrd said Cook is an upperclassman studying biology and chemistry. He said Cook hopes to continue his studies at Union after dealing with the drug
charge.
Last week, police said in a news release they received a tip about a "clandestine drug lab" at Cherry Grove Apartments, near the Union campus.
Cook cooperated with a police request to search his apartment, where police found his lab, said Capt. Barry Michael, commander of the Jackson-Madison
County Metro Narcotics Unit.
Police have said they found several substances in the lab that are regulated under the federal Controlled Substances Act. There is evidence that Cook
was trying to use tree bark containing sassafras to produce safrole, a substance used in the production of the psychedelic drug Ecstasy, according to
the release.
Police confiscated the apparatus in Cook's apartment and contracted a company to clean up and dispose of any hazardous chemicals found there,
according to the release.
Michael said it could be several weeks before officials have the test results on the substances found in the apartment.
"Obviously we don't arrest people for doing antibiotics research," Michael said Monday. "There was some evidence that we found in the apartment that
indicates he was doing stuff other than any kind of antibiotic research. ... Until we get stuff back from the lab, I really can't elaborate."
Byrd, however, criticized police for releasing a statement that he said implies Cook was running a secret drug lab.
Even if police determine an illegal substance was produced at the lab, Cook had no criminal intent, Byrd said.
He said some of Cook's family members have had cancer and noted that some chemicals in certain types of tree bark could be used to treat the
condition.
Byrd said he is not sure why Cook set up the lab in the apartment, but said he thinks it is because the experiment was time-consuming work.
"You don't really need to have a lab in your apartment. Everybody can agree on that," Byrd said. "... (But) it was his hobby. It's like a really smart
kid with an Erector set, except his was a lab."
Byrd also said police misidentified some substances found in the lab in their news release. Michael said police made a list of what substances were
found in the apartment according to how they were labeled.
"The chemicals he had in this small apartment were very volatile, and if he made a mistake or whatever, he could have killed everybody in that
apartment," Michael said.
Michael said evidence including notes and formulas found at the apartment suggests that the lab was being used to manufacture illicit substances.
Michael said he does not think police were wrong to say the lab was being used to produce illegal drugs, even though test results are still pending.
"He (Cook) had the ability and the knowledge to produce illegal substances," Michael said. "We feel like he was."
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- Nicholas Beadle,
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Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in
beer.
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Duke
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It's great to know that you still can't get out of a problem like this with a backing from a university. I wonder if they'll start raiding university
labs soon...
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evil_lurker
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Well the guy fucked up to begin with...
Fuck up #1, letting the cops in without a search warrant.
Fuck up #2, thinking he can bullshit the cops.
Fuck up #3, keeping drugs and drug paraphenalia on premisis.
Fuck up #4, keeping "non-politically correct" things such as sasafras bark and notes on how to manufacture drugs on site.
Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in
beer.
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Sauron
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It is utterly irresponsible to have a lab in an apartment building.
Want to bet one of his neighbors ratted him out?
Having pot there was a foolish move.
The sassafras does not help any, either. Making root beer was he?
If this was university faculty sanctioned, and supported, why didn't they give him a little bench space or a hood on campus?
It really does appear to be spin-doctoring by the defense attorney. Wait for the forensics results.
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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12AX7
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Considering the circumstances, the article seems to be relatively calm and rational, compared to the scare stories we're heard. A shame that he's
lost all his shit though. You just know they've sealed up every bit of glassware, oh for testing, testing forever...
Tim
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hissingnoise
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It's still scary, 12AX7.
This latest bust comes a bit too hot-on-the-heels of the Deebs incident for comfort.
the next bust could be only days away; brrr, from nowhwere, I feel a cold wind blowing.
Goosebumps, now!
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Sauron
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There's no coordination and no connection. This is all local Barney Fyfe bullshit.
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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JohnWW
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| Quote: | Originally posted by evil_lurker
Well the guy fucked up to begin with...
Fuck up #1, letting the cops in without a search warrant. (cut) |
In my country, a warrantless search of land and a building, without there being any corroborated evidence of the presence of drugs beforehand, would
result in any evidence of guilt thereby obtained being rejected by the court as being inadmissible.
As for "bullshitting the Pigs", all he should have said to them was that he denied any and all alleged offenses and that he denied any and all
criminal liability; and demanded to see a lawyer.
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Sauron
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Mr.Cook (how ironic) would have been within his rights to demand a warrant. Has he done so, an officer would have remained with him so that he would
have had no opportunity to destroy evidence while the other officers went to obtain a warrant from the court. The search would have then proceeded and
the result would have been the same. In the event he allowed the police into his apartment and so there was no police misconduct. Any US court would
hold that the police had probable cause.
As it happens, Mr.Cook is not in your country, John, so your remarks as usual are immaterial.
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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hissingnoise
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My remarks, Sauron, since I'm not in the US, were intended as more banter than Fyferbole.
IIRC, you're not in your country, either, so why should you care.
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Sauron
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My remarks, hissingnoise, were directed at JohnWW. Not at you.
[Edited on 13-11-2008 by Sauron]
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hissingnoise
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I kinda guessed that, Sauron; the other guess was that you were just having a bad day.
Anyway, I think the lab-busts thing is a bit overblown. It happened in the old days, too, but it just wasn't so widely reported.
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Sauron
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My day went just fine, thanks for your concern.
Overblown? I guess. It doesn't sound as if this guy had much of a lab, as such, or what I would call a lab. A few pieces of glassware? Big frigging
deal. Guilty or not, it's much ado about nothing.
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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Ozone
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The kid made many mistakes, but the bottom line is this:
"He...had the ability and the knowledge to produce illegal substances," Michael said. "We feel like he was."
This is what we should really be concerned about. There is not a single one of us who does not fit this description, home-lab or not.
Perhaps someone should point this thread out to tom-servo:
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=11466
Or...not.
Cheers,
O3
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
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Sauron
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Yeah, these days ability and knowledge = method and opportunity. No question about that.
Shall we all submit to prefrontal lobotomy?
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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The_Davster
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Ozone
The kid made many mistakes, but the bottom line is this:
"He...had the ability and the knowledge to produce illegal substances," Michael said. "We feel like he was."
|
WTF..."we feel" since when are feelings legally binding?
And if he has the knowledge to identify the necessary ability and knowledge, he has the ability and knowledge to carry it out himself..so in an ironic
twist Mr. Michael is hoisted by his own orwellian petard.
I was more annoyed by
"
"You don't really need to have a lab in your apartment. Everybody can agree on that," Byrd said
"
I don't even need to comment on this one I don't think.
[Edited on 13-11-08 by The_Davster]
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smuv
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I see this one the other way around; it looks to me like Mr. Cook, took advantage of those who trusted him and used them to supply him with chemicals
for his drug lab. I don't see why sassafras root bark would be needed for the synthesis of antibiotics.
"Titanium tetrachloride…You sly temptress." --Walter Bishop
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Sauron
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Why prejudge the forensics? Wait and see.
Having a "lab" (more like a chemistry kit) in an apartment, if he had flammable solvents, is irresponsible. It's a shared dwelling. Not a single
family home. What would be a minor accident in a proper lab could turn into a conflgration in such an inappropriate setting. I bet Mr.Cook did not
even have a fire extinguisher.
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hissingnoise
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Betting he hadn't an extinguisher sounds, itself, kinda prejudiced, Sauron.
The odds there can't better than 50/50.
And I'm sure many here will admit to some carelessness where flammables are concerned.
For all anyone knows, this unfortunate might have been uber-safety-conscious.
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Sauron
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If he'd had a lick of sense he would have finagled some bench space at his chem dept. I had my own room w/bench and hood when I was an undergrad.
Prejudice is relative. I'll stick to my estimate on the off of his having no extinguisher being better than even money. And I'd still say I'm a lot
LESS "prejudiced" than the member who already decided the guy was likely making drugs. I do not go as far as that, and that's the real issue.
Besides, even if he was "uber" careful, IMO it was still reckless and irresponsible in an apartment setting. Think about it from the POV of one of his
neighbors. Were there small children in the building? Maybe married students with baby or babies? I still think it was a neighbor who ratted on him -
if not one of his own roommates.
Sic gorgeamus a los subjectatus nunc.
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zed
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He was a college student. In my student days, the chemistry professors allowed me to design my own "Independent Study" projects, which I executed on
campus.
Some of these projects were "edgy", but none of them crossed the line.
My instructors were quite pleased to have a student that was actually interested in chemistry. Accordingly, they awarded me a high degree of
freedom.
Good school, nice environment, first-class equipment, free reagents. Sweet!
If tuition was a problem, the remedy was quite simple. I proposed my intended project as a 1 credit course (economical!).
Then, I spent endless hours experimenting....striving to achieve my stated goal.... Occasionally grumbling, "Boy, this is a lot more work than I
thought it would be."
I assume such opportunities are still available.
Had the young man in question, made such an arrangement, he could have avoided legal problems. Financial problems too. He needs a good lawyer, and
that ain't cheap.
Odds are, this is going to be an expensive lesson.
Avoid the appearance of impropriety.
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evil_lurker
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One thing that is really really nice is an old school chain lock. You can crack the door open and still have a conversation but not let the cops in.
Worse comes to worse you run to the bathroom and start flushing.
Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in
beer.
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hissingnoise
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| Quote: | Originally posted by evil_lurker
Worse comes to worse you run to the bathroom and start flushing. |
And deepen the do-do?
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zed
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I'm not suggesting using a University Lab for illegal projects.
I'm suggesting you can avoid legal, health, and financial problems by experimenting in a University Lab.
If you cross the line into outright illegality, you'll lose all immunity.
Whereas, if you confine yourself to supervised experiments that stop short of criminal behavior, and you don't take any reagents or products home with
you, you will be fine.
Experimenting means experimenting. It doesn't mean manufacturing and selling dope.
This is an example of an experiment. You notice that 2-Methyl Indole, could possibly, under certain acidic, (or enzymatic) conditions, be
hydrolyzed. And then, the resultant O-amino-phenyl-2-propanone acid salt (or derivative) could possibly be diazotized and reacted with Methanol, to
produce O-methoxy-phenyl-2-propanone.
Since 2-methyl Indole is easily synthesized via the phenylhydrazone of acetone, this route to O-methoxy-P2P, could actually prove better than the
classic Heinzelmann proceedure.
Now, I'd re-check before attempting this synthesis, but it used to be that O-methoxy-P2P was not an illicit material. It is precurser to the formerly
OTC decongestant Orthodrine, and it was specifically excluded from anti-drug legislation.
The experimental goal might be impossible to achieve. Or, it might have been done already. If it hasn't been done.....And, it doesn't aim to produce
a blatantly illegal product...It qualifies as a real experiment.
At some institutions, there are no blatantly illegal products. They have the required permits. You need approval and supervision, but once you have
it, the sky is the limit.
You write up a proposal, get approval, attempt your synthesis, obtain your results, and produce a paper. You submit your products (if any) to your
instructor. You get a grade. This is easy, and you don't get arrested.
Thereafter, what you do with the knowledge you have obtained, is your business....
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JohnWW
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| Quote: | Originally posted by zed(cut) This is an example of an experiment. You notice that 2-Methyl Indole, could possibly, under certain acidic,
(or enzymatic) conditions, be hydrolyzed. And then, the resultant O-amino-phenyl-2-propanone acid salt (or derivative) could possibly be diazotized
and reacted with Methanol, to produce O-methoxy-phenyl-2-propanone.
Since 2-methyl Indole is easily synthesized via the phenylhydrazone of acetone, this route to O-methoxy-P2P, could actually prove better than the
classic Heinzelmann proceedure. (cut) |
The ghastly SMELL of that stuff would give the game away!
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