| Pages:
1
2 |
solo
International Hazard
Posts: 3975
Registered: 9-12-2002
Location: Estados Unidos de La Republica Mexicana
Member Is Offline
Mood: ....getting old and drowning in a sea of knowledge
|
|
Lightning .... Charcoal and Ground
I had a strange dream where a ground rod was connected to a plastic chamber full of charcoal and at the bottompart of the ground rod went into the
chamber on top another rod exited from the chamber never touching each other with a good 20 inches between them full of carbon ........
IN the area where ai live there are many thunder storms and I'm hoping to catch one .....my theory is that since charcoal can conduct electricity
...nothing will happen , also maybe with the conduction of so much electricity it will squeeze the atoms so closethat it will crystalize ....into a
crystal carbon .....diamonds?............what a dreamer!
Any thoughts of what might happen?........solo
It's better to die on your feet, than live on your knees....Emiliano Zapata.
|
|
|
The_Davster
A pnictogen
Posts: 2861
Registered: 18-11-2003
Member Is Offline
Mood: .
|
|
Firstly, I absolutly LOVE this idea. Anything involving lightning is madscience
I remember reading that buckyballs are formed when arcs are formed between graphite rods, similar may occur here due to the arc formed. If diamond
does not form, or as an impurity. In reality I imagine all sorts of things would form, the ends of your metal rods would melt contaminating the
carbon reaction mixture, potentially forming some weird metal-carbon compounds.
I would say, if you can build a tower big enough to attract lightning, and can leave it up for a long time waiting for lightning, do it.
|
|
|
garage chemist
chemical wizard
Posts: 1803
Registered: 16-8-2004
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Launch a model rocket that carries a long thin wire upwards into the clouds. The wire is connected to whatever you want to vaporize.
Thats how scientists produce lightning strikes on demand during thunderstorms- I once saw it on TV.
|
|
|
The_Davster
A pnictogen
Posts: 2861
Registered: 18-11-2003
Member Is Offline
Mood: .
|
|
Cool so a thin wire would work, I suppose all the lightning needs is any conductor at all to get started, then it just follows the path.
There is a 'severe thunderstorm warning' here tonight.
I wish there was enough open space around here to try this...I am in suburbia.
(doubt I have the balls to do this unfortunatly )
[Edited on 12-6-2007 by The_Davster]
|
|
|
12AX7
Post Harlot
Posts: 4803
Registered: 8-3-2005
Location: oscillating
Member Is Offline
Mood: informative
|
|
Nickel and iron!
(I'd laugh at myself, but that reaction is more of a mystery than a joke!)
Tim
|
|
|
DrP
National Hazard
Posts: 625
Registered: 28-9-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: exothermic
|
|
Let us know how it goes if you give it a try - sounds like an excellent experiment that will be a great laugh to do. A bit dangerous though, but I'm
sure you know what your doing. Good luck!!! Alot of the scientific greats had their best ideas in their sleep and woke up to write them all down.
|
|
|
Nerro
National Hazard
Posts: 596
Registered: 29-9-2004
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Whatever...
|
|
Build some sort of timed delay for the rocket. Otherwise you die 
Why would C become denser as it heats? I would expect it to vaporize and form nanotubes and buckyballs...
#261501 +(11351)- [X]
the \"bishop\" came to our church today
he was a fucken impostor
never once moved diagonally
courtesy of bash
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5126
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
It looks like you need a plastic bucket rated for a couple of Pa.
http://www.me.berkeley.edu/diamond/submissions/diam_intro/cp...
Good luck.
|
|
|
Jdurg
Hazard to Others
Posts: 220
Registered: 10-6-2006
Location: Connecticut, USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
For diamonds you would still need a lot of pressure. Diamond is not the most energetically stable form of carbon. Over an unfathomable amount of
time, diamond will revert back into graphite. If this experiment were to work, you would probably wind up with a great deal of fullerines and
graphite.
\"A real fart is beefy, has a density greater than or equal to the air surrounding it, consists of the unmistakable scent of broccoli, and usually
requires wiping afterwards.\"
http://maddox.xmission.com. |
|
|
solo
International Hazard
Posts: 3975
Registered: 9-12-2002
Location: Estados Unidos de La Republica Mexicana
Member Is Offline
Mood: ....getting old and drowning in a sea of knowledge
|
|
I acquired a one meter glass tube of 3inch diameter borosilicate glass in which I will fill with charcoal and activated charcoal and housed in a 3"
PVC pipe,......with wooden doughnuts holding the rods exiting on both ends one to a ground pipe and the other up in sky.....the plastic housing which
will hold the tube inside will be erected and held up with plastic ropes with tension knucle nuts place tension ....this will be erected on top of a
three story house made of concrete and brick so it will be a good ground. I will keep the rods about 16" apart and the area in between filled with
charcoal used for heating mined in the US and the rest of the void filled with powder activated charcoal..........solo
It's better to die on your feet, than live on your knees....Emiliano Zapata.
|
|
|
Pyridinium
Hazard to Others
Posts: 258
Registered: 18-5-2005
Location: USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: cupric
|
|
I'm really interested to see how this experiment worked. There are so many fascinating possibilities once lightning enters the picture. All kinds of
high energy chemical reactions. Not just high voltage... you get insanely high current too!!!!!
|
|
|
YT2095
International Hazard
Posts: 1091
Registered: 31-5-2003
Location: Just left of Europe and down a bit.
Member Is Offline
Mood: within Nominal Parameters
|
|
the rocket launchers are usually triggered remotely with a blow-pipe and pressure switch.
it might be an idea to build a small charge sensor too, a Microamp moving coil meter a pair of germanium diodes and an antenna with a tip made of a
sharp needles (4 in X patern is enough).
if you want an even cruder method you can just use the Antenna, an Earth and a little Mains Neon bulb.
when you get peaks, Then launch your rocket.
it doesn`t Always fire, but you stand a better chance if you can wait your time and launch then, rather than waste loads of engines on guess work.
edit: and I don`t know about the Diamond thing, and somehow doubt it would work, but if you use Sand and make Fulgerites instead, they sell for quite
a bit!
make enough selling them on eBay and you can Buy a Diamond 
[Edited on 20-6-2007 by YT2095]
\"In a world full of wonders mankind has managed to invent boredom\" - Death
Twinkies don\'t have a shelf life. They have a half-life! -Caine (a friend of mine)
|
|
|
olmpiad
Harmless
Posts: 29
Registered: 2-6-2006
Location: this thing known as earth
Member Is Offline
Mood: Dandy
|
|
Slow down there YT. Natural fulgurites are hard enough to find on the market as it is without your mass-marketing suggestions (trust me, as an avid
collector of minerals, I'd know). 
That is a good suggestion for the charge sensor btw!
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5126
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I take it that you all looked at the phase diagram on the page I cited so you know I was joking about the pressure you need. If you did this
experiment with diamonds you would turn them into graphite very effectively.
Anyway if you do go connecting a glass tube full of anything to a thunderbolt let me know what happens. I'm not sure if you will get vapour or
shrapnel (I can't see you getting anything else).
|
|
|
I am a fish
undersea enforcer
Posts: 600
Registered: 16-1-2003
Location: Bath, United Kingdom
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ichthyoidal
|
|
Very unlikely. Diamond is thermodynamically unstable at atmospheric pressure. Consider the Gibbs energy:
G = U + pV - TS
Diamond formation requires both an increase in energy (U) and a decrease of entropy (S). Both of these will increase G, making the reaction
unfavourable. Increasing the temperature will only make things worse. The only term that works in diamond's favour is pV (due to diamond being
denser and thus decreasing in volume). For this to counteract the other terms, the pressure must be colossal (which is how both artificial and
natural diamonds are formed).
| Quote: | Originally posted by The_Davster
Cool so a thin wire would work, I suppose all the lightning needs is any conductor at all to get started, then it just follows the path.
|
A thin wire would work very well. In fact it may work better than a thicker wire, as it would vapourise and be heated to plasma. Superheated copper
plasma would conduct very nicely.
[Edited on 24-6-2007 by I am a fish]
1f `/0u (4|\\| |234d 7|-|15, `/0u |234||`/ |\\|33d 70 937 0u7 /\\/\\0|23.
|
|
|
Nicodem
Super Moderator
Posts: 4230
Registered: 28-12-2004
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
A 0.2-0.3 mm copper wire connected with a radioactive tip (from a lightning rod for capturing the lightning) brought to about 100 m above earth with
the help of a hydrogen balloon might be efficient. Connect the other end to your electrode and pray to the gods of heaven.
A thinner wire would likely tear while a thicker one would be too heavy and a larger balloon would be needed.
Do not use helium balloons or you would miss the extra special effects from the burning hydrogen which would add an additional note of scientific
madness to the process.
|
|
|
solo
International Hazard
Posts: 3975
Registered: 9-12-2002
Location: Estados Unidos de La Republica Mexicana
Member Is Offline
Mood: ....getting old and drowning in a sea of knowledge
|
|
Experiment on track......
I put it together like this with mined coal and filled with activated charcoal....
Shot with FinePix2650 at 2007-07-26
Put it on top of a three story building , waiting for some wire and ...I got the ballon and the thread there's been plenty of electrical storms
.....none have hit it yet.......solo
Shot with FinePix2650 at 2007-07-26
It's better to die on your feet, than live on your knees....Emiliano Zapata.
|
|
|
Ozone
International Hazard
Posts: 1269
Registered: 28-7-2005
Location: Good Olde USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Integrated
|
|
Cool! *drools* You are off to the races. Is the thing grounded? A little positive streamer action from the ground might help considerably (potential
vs...ground).
I like the "firecracker" look. Oh, and coat the balloon with thermite dope (ala. myth busters--only thin enough (coat) to get it off of the ground).
I'd think you might prefer to use graphite as your carbon source.
It's Alive,
O3
Oh yes! Great picture with the rainbow. Nice shot.
[Edited on 27-7-2007 by Ozone]
-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
|
|
|
DeAdFX
Hazard to Others
Posts: 339
Registered: 1-7-2005
Location: Brothel
Member Is Offline
Mood: @%&$ing hardcore baby
|
|
Hmmm... Does your regular(non activated) charcoal contain a significant portion of organic material? I am wondering if it is possible to form
"exotic" hydrocarbons like Admantane from the reaction? Admantane is structured similarly like hexamine however admantane has no nitrogen in it.
|
|
|
YT2095
International Hazard
Posts: 1091
Registered: 31-5-2003
Location: Just left of Europe and down a bit.
Member Is Offline
Mood: within Nominal Parameters
|
|
although it Looks great, I cant help but see a few problems likely to occur, the coal contains plenty flammable hydrocarbons that when gasified are
quite explosive.
so even if you DID make diamonds, they would be spread out several 10`s of metres in every direction and be lost.
Personally I`de dig a pit and put it in there, you`re also closer to and will get a better Ground as well, and you will have the area confined so that
post Strike fragments will be easier to find and examine later.
and even if you Don`t get diamonds, you should have a few Fulgerites
(to sell to olmpiad)
\"In a world full of wonders mankind has managed to invent boredom\" - Death
Twinkies don\'t have a shelf life. They have a half-life! -Caine (a friend of mine)
|
|
|
Elawr
Hazard to Others
Posts: 174
Registered: 4-6-2006
Location: Alabama
Member Is Offline
Mood: vitriolic
|
|
It is also possible to draw lightning by using a powerful laser to create a plasma channel between your target and the thundercloud. CO2 lasers
emitting IR wavelength energy have been used for this.
1
|
|
|
hashashan
Hazard to Others
Posts: 255
Registered: 10-10-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
And then the lighning will travel on your beam right?
mmmmm isnt this laser quite expensive to be used once? It will be destroyed after the lightning hits it .
|
|
|
rocket
Harmless
Posts: 3
Registered: 24-8-2006
Location: Australia
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I don't think it would be destroyed if you bounce the laser off a mirror, though i have never heard of lasers being use to get lightning strikes.
[Edited on 28/7/07 by rocket]
|
|
|
Nerro
National Hazard
Posts: 596
Registered: 29-9-2004
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Whatever...
|
|
A high powered laser in the infrared part of the spectrum (3500 m<sup>-1</sup> IR) would heat up moisture in the air, would that work to
form plasma?
[Edited on 29-7-2007 by Nerro]
#261501 +(11351)- [X]
the \"bishop\" came to our church today
he was a fucken impostor
never once moved diagonally
courtesy of bash
|
|
|
unionised
International Hazard
Posts: 5126
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
A laser beam that's absorbed by air strongly eough to form a plasma will not travel through air far enough to trigger a strike. The problem's quite
difficult. At any rate, a balloon on a wire is cheaper than the laser.
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2 |
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
