Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
Osmium ring is beautiful, but is it toxic ?
Hi guys, I always wanted to buy a ring made out of osmium (I love osmium colour more than that yellow metal's colour).
On the internet I have read many posts about it and stumbled across a few people claiming that it's toxic due to the formation of osmium tetroxide at
room temperature (found these posts on reddit and quora).
As far as I know, osmium metal only reacts with oxygen at very high temperatures forming osmium tetroxide but I want some clarity and confirmation
about it.
A a fellow chemistry YouTube channel called Thoisoi2 made a video about it and coverd it's properties, but didn't mention the amount of the material
that reacts with oxygen.
Please help me with debunking that, many people out there stopped buying osmium ring because of those posts, and I think this thread is of some
importance to the internet.
You may say buy a gold one or platinum one but there is no metal with a blue tint like osmium.
[Edited on 18-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
Here is a clip of one of the post made by a quora user who says it's toxic:
There are many posts like this on the internet.
[Edited on 18-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
DraconicAcid
International Hazard
Posts: 4419
Registered: 1-2-2013
Location: The tiniest college campus ever....
Member Is Online
Mood: Semi-victorious.
|
|
I still have nightmares about the stench of osmium compounds.
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@DaronicAcid I've neither experienced nor handled Osmium or its compounds, can you please describe your experience and the compound you've handled
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
Lionel Spanner
Hazard to Others
Posts: 179
Registered: 14-12-2021
Location: near Barnsley, UK
Member Is Offline
|
|
The powder reacts with oxygen at room temperature, but the bulk solid, which has much less surface area, requires heating to 400 °C for this to
happen. Given that it's one of the hardest metals in the world, the chance of forming powder from wearing it as a ring is minimal.
To my mind, the most horrific thing about it would be the price.
|
|
|
DraconicAcid
International Hazard
Posts: 4419
Registered: 1-2-2013
Location: The tiniest college campus ever....
Member Is Online
Mood: Semi-victorious.
|
|
I used to work with someone who made osmium carbonyl compounds in his research. Any time he made a batch of starting material, all the clamps and
other sundry equipment that he had used would reek for days, and if you accidentally picked up something that he had used, your hands would reek.
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
|
|
|
bnull
National Hazard
Posts: 624
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: Home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy Easter!
|
|
| Quote: | | As far as I know, osmium metal only reacts with oxygen at very high temperatures forming osmium tetroxide but I want some clarity and confirmation
about it. |
Not exactly. It forms tetroxide at room temperature, but the rate at which it happens depends on the surface area: basically, the powder stinks and
the bulk solid does not.
Bretherick's lists nothing on metallic osmium except the incompatibility with chlorine, fluorine, and phosphorus. The osmium entry in Sax's Dangerous
Properties says that osmium "gives off a pungent, poisonous fume of osmium tetroxide" when heated but the "metal itself is not highly toxic," which
for me is the equivalent of "having an Alsatian is safe, unless you piss it off." A review on the toxic properties of osmium tetroxide (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1035752/) says that the metal itself is innocuous.
Unless you're sweating halogens or phosphorus (I don't think so), the solid metal is innocuous. Don't heat the metal and don't perform experiments
wearing it. I wouldn't keep it in contact with my skin for prolonged periods but that's overcautious me.
|
|
|
DraconicAcid
International Hazard
Posts: 4419
Registered: 1-2-2013
Location: The tiniest college campus ever....
Member Is Online
Mood: Semi-victorious.
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by bnull  |
Unless you're sweating halogens or phosphorus (I don't think so), the solid metal is innocuous. Don't heat the metal and don't perform experiments
wearing it. I wouldn't keep it in contact with my skin for prolonged periods but that's overcautious me. |
Copper wire stays nice and shiny on the counter, but if you wrap it around your finger, it will leave a green stain. I wouldn't trust osmium on my
skin.
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@DraconicAcid I Totally agree that you want to emphasize the toxicity of osmium but comparing a noble metal with a fairly reactive is not a good
thing.
I agree that osmium tetroxide is formed when exposed to high temperatures, but still not getting why noble metals (finely divided) like Osmium would
react with Oxygen at room temperature it doesn't make sense. People find osmium(while mining) in Crystal state or granular state but they never
complained about dealing with chlorine like smell.
I know that osmium's concentration is too low in earths crust but there are places where you can find a lot of osmium crystals, places like meteorite
impact zones have been reported to contain a fairly high concentrations Os than ur typical soil.
[Edited on 18-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
clearly_not_atara
International Hazard
Posts: 2836
Registered: 3-11-2013
Member Is Offline
Mood: Big
|
|
The government doesn't let you buy fucking acetic acid these days, I am certain that if osmium rings were toxic they'd have been banned a long time
ago.
Ironically I think zinc has a pretty cool color as metals go, but it's far too boring and brittle and reactive to be a ring.
|
|
|
bnull
National Hazard
Posts: 624
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: Home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy Easter!
|
|
| Quote: Originally posted by Radiums Lab | | I agree that osmium tetroxide is formed when exposed to high temperatures, but still not getting why noble metals (finely divided) like Osmium would
react with Oxygen at room temperature it doesn't make sense. |
It makes perfect sense. You just need some basic facts to see why and how it does work (meaning thermodynamic calculations and a little
visualization). The process is similar to combustion, there's no new science here.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@bnull thank you for pointing out that Gibbs free energy value is negative (reaction is feasible at room temperature).
Oh, since is elegant indeed.
Here are some conclusions.
- Osmium does react with air to form OsO4, but it is too slow and happens in minimal quantity to pose any threat at all.
- Finer powder = faster reaction (larger surface area).
- No one is going to wear a ring made out of finely divided Os(try to wear one or make one if possible).
- After some digging, some researchers have told that even the powder take decades or centuries to react in noticable quantity.
- So, it is safe to say we can wear a ring made up of bulk osmium metal.
[Edited on 19-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@bnull I think you cannot compare oxygen reacting with Os as combustion. Combustion takes place at elevated temperatures with the help of a fuel.
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
bnull
National Hazard
Posts: 624
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: Home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy Easter!
|
|
| Quote: | | I think you cannot compare oxygen reacting with Os as combustion. Combustion takes place at elevated temperatures with the help of a fuel.
|
So, apart from temperature, what are the differences between the combustion of a fuel and the oxidation of osmium?
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@bnull, yeah good question.
Please don't take anything personally.
- Combustion mainly occurs with utilising high amounts of O2 and realising simpler substances like CO2 or H2O(I agree that there is no H or C to form
those compounds.)
- Combustion releases very high amounts of heat energy but Oxidation of Os doesn't do that(only small amounts of heat is released).
- Combustion is usually self sustaining but it's difficult in case of Os.
- Combustion usually takes place with an explosion or a fire but this doesn't do that.
- Combustion is a relatively quick process than Osmium's oxidation.
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
bnull
National Hazard
Posts: 624
Registered: 15-1-2024
Location: Home
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy Easter!
|
|
| Quote: | | - Combustion mainly occurs with utilising high amounts of O2 and realising simpler substances like CO2 or H2O(I agree that there is no H or C
to form those compounds.) |
Osmium needs twice as much oxygen than carbon.
| Quote: | - Combustion releases very high amounts of heat energy but Oxidation of Os doesn't do that(only small amounts of heat is released).
- Combustion is usually self sustaining but it's difficult in case of Os.
- Combustion is a relatively quick process than Osmium's oxidation. |
The energy released on the oxidation of carbon to carbon dioxide (393.51 kJ/mol) is very close to that from oxidation of osmium to osmium tetroxide
(364.98 kJ/mol). For comparison, the oxidation of sulfur to sulfur dioxide releases 296.81 kJ/mol. The issue here is the reaction rate, which is very
slow for osmium. Why? I'd say it is because osmium is almost 16 times heavier than carbon and osmium tetroxide weighs almost six times as much as
carbon dioxide.
| Quote: | | - Combustion usually takes place with an explosion or a fire but this doesn't do that. |
Not necessarily. There's smouldering: no flame, only a reddish light. Osmium, like iron, aluminum and a bunch of other metals, is pyrophoric when
powdered. I don't know how small the grains need to burst into flames or at least smoulder (you can make an estimate by taking into account a whole
lot of things).
I remember someone asked about how carbon actually burned, with those high melting and boiling points and what-not.
Edit: The Chemical Properties of Osmium from Mellor's Comprehensive Treatise, volume 15 (also in the Library); not up-to-date (it is from 1936) but
still valuable.
[Edited on 19-4-2025 by bnull]
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
@bnull I noticed that you are online and was waiting for you to reply here.
Anyways back to the topic, ok I agree the fact that there is a small difference between their oxidation (combustion) energies, and I agree with your
explanation to some extent about combustion thing but why not just call it "Oxidation" just like others do?
Here is a link to a video about Os sponge(finely divided one):
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AdX-T2Vv68Y&pp=ygUWT3NtaXV...
So what I understood is Os
sponge reacts easily with air forming it's tetroxide.
Osmium ring is safe to wear. Unless you are working with very high temperatures.
@bnull apology for some wrong comments about the combustion thing.
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
Radiums Lab
Harmless
Posts: 40
Registered: 18-3-2025
Location: India
Member Is Offline
Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
|
|
And guys any more suggestions for the final conclusion so that this topic can be closed or a final overview before this thread goes dead?
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
|
|
|
woelen
Super Administrator
Posts: 8085
Registered: 20-8-2005
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline
Mood: interested
|
|
I personally also am quite sure that wearing an osmium ring is safe.
The only possible reason of not being safe for specific persons could be that people react allergically to trace amounts of osmium compounds.
Another example is nickel. Nickel is used quite a lot, for coins, but also for cutlery. It remains nice and shiny and can be cleaned well. At the same
time, nickel(II) salts are known to be quite toxic and carcinogenic. But the amount of nickel(II), produced from bulk nickel metal is so small, that
this risk is nearly 0. Only if you are allergic to nickel, it can cause issues. Allergic reactions can be triggered by very very small amounts.
So, I am sure that a similar thing is the case with osmium. If you have the bulk metal, and are not allergic to it, it is safe.
Cost most likely is prohibitive, but that is another matter.
|
|
|
Sulaiman
International Hazard
Posts: 3788
Registered: 8-2-2015
Member Is Offline
|
|
GUESSING :
if the ring is sintered rather than molten it may be quite porous to atmospheric oxygen?
stuff that comes out of my skin is surprisingly corrosive and I'm sure it is a complex mix of substances.
So corrosion on the finger may be much faster than in air, water brine etc.
Watch for colour changes that would indicate oxidation etc.
Usually our bodies give a local reaction to toxins so I guess you could wear it until any negative symptoms are noticed,
or people tend to stay upwind of you 
CAUTION : Hobby Chemist, not Professional or even Amateur
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
