Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Extraction off less volatile essential oils

DrScrabs - 28-3-2018 at 02:03

Hello guys, I am currently moving to portugal and am into building a hot gas extractor for gas temp above 100 deg C but I really do not have a clue about herbs and essential oils wich may be of interest in portugal except of this haha-hihi
Can sb may help me with the botanical information on wich plants may to start with? I really have no clue about plants there and think I'll start out of the blue extracting the shit out of everything with an interesting aroma but as the title says I am more interesting in any less volatile stuff wich is hard or impossible to archieve with standard steam extraction.

Greez from Paris!

PhenethylamineMachine - 28-3-2018 at 05:31

Quote: Originally posted by DrScrabs  
Hello guys, I am currently moving to portugal and am into building a hot gas extractor for gas temp above 100 deg C but I really do not have a clue about herbs and essential oils wich may be of interest in portugal except of this haha-hihi
Can sb may help me with the botanical information on wich plants may to start with? I really have no clue about plants there and think I'll start out of the blue extracting the shit out of everything with an interesting aroma but as the title says I am more interesting in any less volatile stuff wich is hard or impossible to archieve with standard steam extraction.

Greez from Paris!


Are you looking to obtain these oils for fragrance? Like for incense or perfumes?

I know a good deal about allyl-benzene compounds derived from essential oils found in plants common to the spice cabinet, however, I am uncertain if this relates to your concerns.

DrScrabs - 28-3-2018 at 09:07

Well, I am interested in the hot gas extraction above 100 deg C in gerneral. In the linked patent they say it is possible to seperate different fractions(thc/cbd in that case) depending on the temperature and time of the hot (and maybe reducing) gas.
So I'd like to try that on other domastical plants in portugal. But as said I do not have the slightest clue with wich plants to start with, never been there before. Of course it would be genious if the extracted oil would be for use in synthesis or soap/parfume but that is secondary. My primary goal is not to get tar ;)
On my own I would start with some plants wich are easy to harvest, spring is there! I think I'll start with the strawberrytree anyway

PhenethylamineMachine - 29-3-2018 at 06:01

Hmmm...

I am guessing you were initially interested in something like this:
https://patents.google.com/patent/EP1385595B1/en

I mean, why else was gas extraction at those specific temperatures important? Any way, I don't mean to pry.

If this is the case, let me know and we can discuss the procedure.

In regards to other parts of you post I feel somewhat obligated to mention that Collecting unknown plant samples and attempting to subject them to chemical procedures doesn't sound very wise. You must have a clear plan with clear intentions.

Any way, the more specific you are, the easier it will be for others to offer you suggestions.

DrScrabs - 5-4-2018 at 01:41

That is exactly the patent I placed a link to.
Maybe I will give it a try but acually I do not have the money to "waste" that kind of female plant material on trying a extraction with dry steam. If I do find some male plants I will try it.

Recently I did discover a maple tree with really beautiful blood red resin, acer palmatum, wich really made me interested in doing dry steam extractions on resins, trying to fractionate the incredients and maybe identifying them, what do you think about?
I think thats worth a try!

happyfooddance - 5-4-2018 at 08:05

Acer palmatum... Every thing you have expressed interest in has the same leaf shape...

Also, what do you mean by dry steam? I am pretty sure there can be no such thing.

DrScrabs - 6-4-2018 at 06:21
Quote:

Dry steam is steam that is at the temperature of saturation, but does not contain water particles in suspension. It has a very high dryness fraction, with almost no moisture.Commercially, dry steam contains not more than one half of one percent moisture. The presence of moisture in steam causes deposition, corrosion and reduction of life expectancy of boilers or other heat exchangers. Therefore, in heating applications, dry steam is preferable, because it has a better energy exchange capacity and does not cause corrosion.



First page that showed up on google.

The way I do want to go would also work with an intert gas, but water is not that expensive and regarding the leaf form: If I would plan on doing sth illigal I would not ask for help on the internet, seriously.

I will post a photo of that maple resin so you can see yourself, it is just beautiful. May takes some days, I do not own a digital camera.

happyfooddance - 6-4-2018 at 08:04

Oh. I would just call that "steam", or water vapor.

DrScrabs - 6-4-2018 at 13:38

With superheated steam it is a hot gas extraction and by introducing a slow stream of sodium metabisulfite solution SO2 is produced upon hiting plant matter wich also would prevent oxidation of the extract(see the linked patent above for more information).

I just did find that patent and I do think that that method is the way to go without a vac system. But acually I do not have a clue if that is good on resin. I will go to tap that mapletree tomorrow and see what I do get as a starting material for my experiments. So maybe some pictures tomorrow :)

[Edited on 6-4-2018 by DrScrabs]

DrScrabs - 8-4-2018 at 07:11

Here I got a photo showing the resin, thanks to my brazilian friend :)

I also am into tapping the tree to harvest some resin but my first attempt was a failure because the resin did harden when it shall not and clogged the small tap I build.

20180407_092303 (2).jpg - 1.9MB

DrScrabs - 6-5-2018 at 12:08

About a month later I sadly have to report that my try on tapping the tree is considered as a fail for me, at least this year.
The first try was really promising but the resin hardned inside my tap and any other try with my new tap was a total failure and I do not want to kill a tree by trying to tap it in my noobish "not knowing what I do" style.
Maybe I´ll give it a go next year in the late winter or early spring when it is normally done I think.

So I do hope for next year, I will not forget to post here again once I do start again!