Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Estimated VOD

Estimated VOD

MineMan - 28-4-2017 at 19:07

Can anyone give me an estimate VOD off of this witness plate test. I am testing a new primary explosive!

1 gram was compacted in a graphite arrow tube 5mm ID

The witness plate is 3mm Al, it was covered with 5cm of sand and places vertical... so the sand was not acting as a tamper!

It shot sand crystals into the aluminum plate, they are embedded deep and cannot be scraped out with a razor blade. Flash powder does no such thing to this plate and its VOD is 1600m/s

Would SADS and LA do more or less damage?? I really need to know this

MineMan - 28-4-2017 at 19:08

The right side of the first picture is where the explosive was, the left side was flashpowder to ignite it and the same explosive but not pressed.

[Edited on 29-4-2017 by MineMan]

NeonPulse - 30-4-2017 at 02:31

Speak to Dornier335A. He has developed software which if given a set of parameters including the molecular makeup and density he can calculate a VOD , oxygen balance and the suspected decomposition products. He may be kind enough to help you if you had the right info. Certainly lead azide pressed in a 1g quantity would blow a hole through 3mm aluminium plate.
I'm not so sure that SADS would do that but it would likely leave a fracture in the plate. May I ask what your compound is that you are testing? What is it based on?

Laboratory of Liptakov - 30-4-2017 at 09:16

Some is here. http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=17695&...
But generally is always tested forehead of shockwave, not planar from side. I never seen professional or relevant measurements, put charge from some side. Always from forehead, perpendicular. And measurement hole, plate dent, impact depth. And always is necessary before measurement xy EM making measurement on same material with known properties, for example cast ETN = 8100m/s. And his depth in relevant material. At maximum density (and known VoD-GPa) and low density (1,0g/cm3) with known properties (VoD - GPa) After is possible interpolation between depth of both impacts. After this is possible kicking xy (again max density and low density 1,0g/cm3) and to graph writte for his.

PHILOU Zrealone - 30-4-2017 at 16:25

The scratches may come from the sand or from the graphite arrow... what is in fact nano-carbon fibers = nano-tubes wich are somehow as hard as diamond....so at high speed nano-tubes of carbon will easily scratch the Aluminium surface.

Dornier 335A - 1-5-2017 at 01:17

I agree with Liptakov, it is important to test it perpendicular to the witness plate. Then the shock wave slams straight into the witness plate. If the shock wave instead travels parallel to the surface, only the expanding gases behind it can do work against the plate. It's also much easier to compare round dents or holes.

Regarding my software, it won't give reliable results for inhomogeneous mixtures so I suspect it is less useful here.

Laboratory of Liptakov - 1-5-2017 at 06:49

Best useful is watching and compare mechanical damage some plate. Because is it clearly and accordingly shape of damage is easy determine all energy and hard grade of energy. For later using, for example as primary kick, in frame original question. From "side " energy is almost impossible any say how was VoD or pressure in GPa.

MineMan - 2-5-2017 at 14:24

I cannot say what this compound is, I have only shared the composition with dornier. But I can say that it requires no synthesis, and it is immune to static, flame and friction. A sharp hammer blow will set some of material off. It is an invention of mine, and there are hardly any scientific papers or journals that refer to compounds such as this. I can say a little more if you PM me.

You are probably thinking how a primary explosive can be immune to static and flame... it is because it self extinguishes itself. But when confined it detonates!

[Edited on 2-5-2017 by MineMan]

MineMan - 2-5-2017 at 14:27

Quote: Originally posted by PHILOU Zrealone

The scratches may come from the sand or from the graphite arrow... what is in fact nano-carbon fibers = nano-tubes wich are somehow as hard as diamond....so at high speed nano-tubes of carbon will easily scratch the Aluminium surface.

The scratches come from the sand, it was detonated in a bucket filled with sand. I have done a hundred tests this way...
flash powder for example barley has the gurney velocity to make the sand particles scratch this plate. But my new formula does.

Laboratory of Liptakov - 4-5-2017 at 12:27

Huuh...I am curious...new primary ? Holy grail of amateur deminers ? A new substance ? Relatively safety ? Detonatable only in closure ? Not poisoned ? Some better than tetraamine copper perchlorate - hexamine clathrate - CHP ? Impossible....:-)

MineMan - 4-5-2017 at 16:47

Sorry LL.. it might be true! In fact I have detonated TACP and ANNMAL mixtures with it. You see, it is not like a regular primary...it seems impossible to you that it could not burn in the open but it could ddt confined... it is very unique. Its sensitivity to impact depending on the formulation is about that of CHP or PETN... but it is immune to friction, static, and exposures of flame for less than 1.5 second.

Holy grail of armatures... yes, but i am hoping to write a patent, nobody likes lead azide! Oh and cheap... I can produce it for less than $30 per pound... although i never mix more than a few grams. Industry could make it for $10 a pound or less.

PHILOU Zrealone - 5-5-2017 at 03:51

Quote: Originally posted by MineMan

Sorry LL.. it might be true! In fact I have detonated TACP and ANNMAL mixtures with it. You see, it is not like a regular primary...it seems impossible to you that it could not burn in the open but it could ddt confined... it is very unique. Its sensitivity to impact depending on the formulation is about that of CHP or PETN... but it is immune to friction, static, and exposures of flame for less than 1.5 second.

Holy grail of armatures... yes, but i am hoping to write a patent, nobody likes lead azide! Oh and cheap... I can produce it for less than $30 per pound... although i never mix more than a few grams. Industry could make it for $10 a pound or less.

If you mixed only a few grams...you can't be sure of the real troubles for industrial plant...many things are safe when made into minute amount but reveals their danger of explosion when it comes to industrial scaling-up and handling... it was the case with NH4NO3, Nitromethane, double base or single base powders, black powder, suggar crystallisation process and atomisation, flour, ...

For example that unsensitive powder may become self confined and thus acheive D2D into 20g, 100g, 500g, 1 kg, a tonn amount ... by triboelectricity, static electricity or hot spot...

This will need further development and study for industry but of course 10-30 US $ a pound is nice. and even if semi industrial it will definitely change part of the world's face ;-)

MineMan - 5-5-2017 at 12:10

Thank you... your right, in large amounts it would a be, I will be in the other room lol. But its better than lead azide.