Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Wondering if i could pay someone for a fumehood?

Db33 - 27-12-2016 at 08:19

i wanted to make a fumehood something like this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXNN9UhSdes

but i dont have any experience building or using saws or anything. I actually bought the inline fan but i dont have the jigsaw tool and i dont have any drill tools. So i was wondering if i was to give someone like $300 would someone be willing to make me one like this? Or if i take my phone to Home Depot and show them the video and take the fan, would they help me make it there?

GolonDestroyerofWorlds - 31-12-2016 at 02:32

Yeah, I can build something like that no problem. At home depot they would probably help you out but I doubt they would help you actually build the thing.

violet sin - 31-12-2016 at 03:23

if you bought plywood for instance, they might rip a sheet down to some specific dimensions before you left, but they aren't going to jig out a circular hole, not when THEY sell the tools to do it.

though you might prevail at a rental store, couple $'s a day for some basic tools. crack it out in an afternoon ( try) and use that to judge how many times you will be borrowing those tools. you deff don't want to be trying your hand at a table saw for the first time by your self... no sir.

you may even be able to find a local handyman looking for work down at the lumber yard. ask him/her what it would cost for a special speaker box if you buy the materials, it's one option if you feel like avoiding suspicion from captain could-call-a-cop ( if he thinks your a cook). the circular hole in the back and rough shape are close enough I would say. or a mini porch living green house with fan, what eve's your comfortable with. just not wise to explain these things to strangers hanging out at lowe's looking for work ya know.

unionised - 31-12-2016 at 03:45

What are the liability issues with getting "a local handyman" to build what's meant to be life-saving protective equipment?

violet sin - 31-12-2016 at 04:25

none if you do all the work of sealing it. he just has to build a rough box with a hole in it for the fan, and screw on the plexi. which can be difficult, as it breaks easy. so, it would then be up to you to caulk, paint and seal up that vent so it all goes outside, fire-proof and all the rest.

I realize it is a bit caviler to say there is no liability... but you asked the guy to make a speaker box, did you not? how is he going to know it is supposed to save your life? we are just getting around the lack of tools here. there is WAY more work for the individual after this part is done, and it all falls on your shoulder to ensure you don't end up dead..\ most of the work will be by brush and caulking gun instead of power tools. the danger factor means test it and don't push an inferior design, outsourced labor and hardware store materials too hard 'eh, not wise to try and do professional toxic/fume/gas handling work in a makeshift box.

just a workaround to lack of tools and tool knowledge

CuReUS - 31-12-2016 at 04:35

why not do what zts16 did ?;) -https://youtu.be/NMVZRTJy6Ds?t=131

unionised - 31-12-2016 at 04:36

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin  


I realize it is a bit caviler to say there is no liability...

The lawyers might agree with that bit; the rest- not so much.

PirateDocBrown - 31-12-2016 at 09:21

Fume hoods are used all the time for spray painting. Nothing (potentially) nefarious about that. They are widely commercially available. Get a handy man to install one of those for you.

Magpie - 31-12-2016 at 13:08

Something to keep in mind when designing/constructing a fumehood: It only needs to be airtight downstream of the blower (fan). The rest of the system is at a slight vacuum and therefore small leaks are of no consequence.

aga - 31-12-2016 at 14:32

The best thing for people who want to Pay for things (and can) is to just buy them.

Ergo, there is no need for a fume cupboard.

Just buy the chemicals you want.

Job done, money spent, zero effort required.

JJay - 31-12-2016 at 15:01

I see a lot of people use wooden fume hoods. Depending on what you are doing, that might be ok, but I personally plan to use a fireproof material. There are just too many opportunities for fires to start... you could potentially see a serious fire starting from something as simple as a drop of water in an oil bath (with superheated water causing spattering onto your hot plate, leading to flames, igniting the oil bath). Untreated, uncoated wood isn't going to stand up well to large amounts of strong acids or strong oxidizers either.

violet sin - 31-12-2016 at 15:04

ya, it just sucks for some individuals...
stuck somewhere in the middle between ... tools/skils needed <--you ---> $ needed

I am great with my hands, have many usefull tools and keep appropriate materials when they present themselves for free on job sites. of course rest is purpose bought. I know enough to make sure my projects will fully function, take into account failure modes and plan for worst case... so I am more than confident anything put into use will be safe.

if you can't say the same for your work, don't build stuff, lol, short and sweet. your better saving up and buying things. money is not equivelant to the safety of your family. though you would be surprised what a guy can learn to do when people want to pry around in his wallet.

so when you are talking about lawyers and liability... I'm not hearing that. either you do it 100% legit with permits and professional installers with a bought unit... or you do it your way, being carefull to think about the possibility of a forced air fire inside your wall, electrical shorts, water spills, power outtages mid crazy fume, etc. etc.

so perhaps the liability thing scares some, not me. your already breaking rules/laws if you install such a device (home made or not) in the absence of proper paperwork and help...
-------

yep, fire safety is max importante. hardy board, concrete foam board, 2x 5/8"drywall, metal joint tape, silicone caulking, tile or even nice bits of graphite; all those will be usefull.

the glass blowing setup I built for a buddy had concrete board on 1" stand-offs, all seams caulked and metal tape over that, fan intake had good flashing underneath and was also 100% sealed off with metal tape. no foil/plastic flex hose was used for air handling, all galvanized. conduit on all wiring. I popped out a window, installed a piece of plywood with louvered exaust vent on the outside. fully flashed, caulked and painted. so if he ever changes his mind it can be popped back in with no framing changes.

[Edited on 31-12-2016 by violet sin]

JJay - 31-12-2016 at 15:30

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin  


the glass blowing setup I built for a buddy had concrete board on 1" stand-offs, all seams caulked and metal tape over that, fan intake had good flashing underneath and was also 100% sealed off with metal tape. no foil/plastic flex hose was used for air handling, all galvanized. conduit on all wiring. I popped out a window, installed a piece of plywood with louvered exaust vent on the outside. fully flashed, caulked and painted. so if he ever changes his mind it can be popped back in with no framing changes.

[Edited on 31-12-2016 by violet sin]


Sounds a lot more professional than putting a tarp over a card table and blowing the exhaust out through the toilet vent with a shop-vac!

[Edited on 31-12-2016 by JJay]

MrHomeScientist - 3-1-2017 at 08:20

Quote: Originally posted by violet sin  
your already breaking rules/laws if you install such a device (home made or not) in the absence of proper paperwork and help...


What laws prohibit you from installing a fume hood in your own house on your own private property?

Sulaiman - 3-1-2017 at 08:50

Law is territory dependent,
Insurance get-out clauses are universal :)

Texium - 3-1-2017 at 09:01

Quote: Originally posted by CuReUS  
why not do what zts16 did ?;) -https://youtu.be/NMVZRTJy6Ds?t=131
Haha, I'm probably slowly killing myself with that setup. Every time the north wind blows through that window it overpowers the fan and I have to hold my breath. The other day I got a whiff of nitrobenzene. Definitely not the best solution.

The original plan was to install a squirrel cage type exhaust fan above the window, keeping that window closed, and opening the one on the opposite side of the building, that way I'd get continuous fresh airflow. I just never got around to installing it, so the temporary solution became the permanent one. I might still install that fan, but I'm not sure now because I may be moving to a new lab space in the next year, and if so, I'd like to set it up there instead.

aga - 3-1-2017 at 09:46

Quote: Originally posted by Db33  
Wondering if i could pay someone for a fumehood?
It seems that the consensus is Yes, you could buy a fume hood, or pay someone to make one.

While it is perfectly practicable to make one yourself (as many active members have done) if you lack the tools/skills, it would be far better to buy one.

The Global nature of ScienceMadness makes it unrealistic to ask a member if they would make you one due to the sheer distances involved.

In any event, an active member who Could build one would prefer to be doing Chemistry than Carpentry, which is why they joined up to a Chemistry forum in the first place.

[Edited on 3-1-2017 by aga]

JJay - 3-1-2017 at 11:00

Quote: Originally posted by MrHomeScientist  
Quote: Originally posted by violet sin  
your already breaking rules/laws if you install such a device (home made or not) in the absence of proper paperwork and help...


What laws prohibit you from installing a fume hood in your own house on your own private property?


In some locations, zoning regulations would prevent it.

MrHomeScientist - 3-1-2017 at 11:25

I'm curious as to what specific regulation would prohibit this specific piece of equipment from being installed rather than, say, a sand blasting cabinet or ventilated spray painting tent. Surely one small fume hood wouldn't rezone your house as a commercial factory?
Seems like most fume hood builders weren't concerned about it, or at least never mentioned it in the construction threads.


Edit: I did a small amount of research on local zoning laws, and I suppose these could factor against me:
"104-93 (c) There shall be no change in the outside appearance of the building or premises, or other visible evidence of the existence of a home occupation or home office."

"104-93 (f) No equipment, tools, or process shall be used in a home occupation which would interfere with the use or enjoyment of neighboring properties because of noise, vibration, glare, fumes, odors, or electrical disturbance."

So a fume hood exhaust pipe exiting the roof would alter the "outside appearance", and the fumes clause would apply (I imagine) if neighbors complained.

[Edited on 1-3-2017 by MrHomeScientist]

Magpie - 3-1-2017 at 12:11

There's also the matter of electrical and possibly plumbing codes. Was the work done by qualified craftsmen and/or inspected by city code inspectors?

Db33 - 6-1-2017 at 07:13

i feel just stupid about it, i have the most expensive part needed, the $100 dollar inline centrifugal fan, im sure i can go to the hardware store and they can give me the correct wood and plexi glass sizes, but i know id fuck it up ive never used a jig and i would probably crack the plexi glass when i tried to drill in holes. I was thinking if i just took the fan intself and my phone to HOme Depot and showed them the video they would help me out (for a price) to finish the project. But i have a feeling they would not be very helpful for a good price.

JJay - 6-1-2017 at 11:28

Jigsaws are easy to use. You could also use a hole saw instead of a jigsaw. Drilling plexiglass is easy; use a general purpose drill bit and just don't go too fast and burn it. Also, don't work too close to the edge, and put washers under the screws where they are in contact with the plexiglass. You can use a tiny drill bit and then move up to larger and larger bits if you're worried about cracking it or having a hard time drilling. Don't screw the screws in too tight; that can crack the plastic.

Are you planning on doing any fireproofing?

aga - 6-1-2017 at 13:11

Quote: Originally posted by MrHomeScientist  
I did a small amount of research on local zoning laws, and I suppose these could factor against me:
"104-93 (c) There shall be no change in the outside appearance of the building or premises, or other visible evidence

Nice work MrHomeScientist.

Depending on the plumbing/intended gasses there's the 'vent it out via the foul stack' idea.

Tried to look it up, as i saw it here on SM, but no joy.

No external change visible.
Possibly bad for the plumbing.

JJay - 6-1-2017 at 13:51

Quote: Originally posted by aga  


Depending on the plumbing/intended gasses there's the 'vent it out via the foul stack' idea.

Tried to look it up, as i saw it here on SM, but no joy.

No external change visible.
Possibly bad for the plumbing.


You're probably talking about this: http://www.sciencemadness.org/member_publications/Odour.pdf

Some pretty nasty stuff gets vented out through those vents normally, but they can't handle large volumes of fumes, and they aren't designed to deal with solvents. I'd imagine that if you regularly discharged your chlorine cylinder through one, you might eventually run into some problems with corrosion that could be expensive to repair.


[Edited on 6-1-2017 by JJay]

Bert - 6-1-2017 at 18:12

Not to mention the down wind neighbor's issues...

Db33 - 7-1-2017 at 06:37

being a home chemist is turning out to be sort of more than a hobby its actually affecting life decisions. Ive stayed with family most of my life because i never had a good paying job. Only last year i got a great internet home-based job that pays good money so now im looking for my own place. Id ordinarily probably look for an apartment... but wait! im a home chemist and i know i will be dealing with tons of stinky solvents, Acetone and especially the well-known smell of Ether. And then my fumehood will be going out a window and so i cant have anyone directly behind. So it is seeming like an apartment is just not going to work, and even a town house id probably atttract attention with smells. So am i going to actually have to buy a house just so i dont have people constantly smelling chemicals? Its really a tough choice.