Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Removing screen printed labels from beer bottles?

Upsilon - 15-9-2015 at 08:21

I'm collecting glass beer bottles to use for storage of acids. However they all seem to have these screen-printed labels that I can't figure out how to remove with anything short of brute sanding (which I'd rather not do). I've tried paint thinner, acetone, even conc. hydrochloric acid, but nothing even shows minute signs of dissolving it. Does anyone have any experience removing these kinds of labels? What should I try next?

aga - 15-9-2015 at 08:41

Razor blade ?

You might find that soaking in a strong sodium hydroxide solution gets them to soften and dissolve.

Tends to be that way when acids and organic solvents won't touch them.

Detonationology - 15-9-2015 at 09:37

I would recommend a brief wash in an etchant to attempt to dissolve the thin layer of glass on the outside that has the print on it. Hydrofluoric acid is the most well known etchant, but the safer option is ammonium bifluoride.

Upsilon - 15-9-2015 at 09:50

Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Razor blade ?

You might find that soaking in a strong sodium hydroxide solution gets them to soften and dissolve.

Tends to be that way when acids and organic solvents won't touch them.


From Google I found that people have had success in soaking it in an acidic solution for 24-48 hours. However I'm planning on using dozens of bottles, so this would take a really long time and a lot of acid. I may try the razorblade method. If not, then it's not really a huge deal; I can always tape over the label.


Also, I do not have either hydrofluoric acid or any bifluoride salts. Seems like bifluoride salts are fairly expensive. I could make hydrofluoric acid which in turn can be used to produce safer bifluoride salts, but I just don't think I'm well enough equipped to deal with HF even for a brief period.

Detonationology - 15-9-2015 at 10:07

On the more abrasive side, you could sand blast the paint off.

ave369 - 15-9-2015 at 10:11

It isn't good lab practice to store acids in bottles that look like drinks. I use drugstore bottles from things such as disinfectant and saline solution, they do not scream "Drink Me!" when you see them.

MeshPL - 15-9-2015 at 10:55

98% H2SO4 may work.

You can also try (aqueous!) H2SO4 + chromate/manganate.

There is also piranha solution: H2O2 +H2SO4 (these should be pretty concentrated on the other hand).

Note that those solutions are somewhat dangerous. Piranha may even eat through pure carbon (e.g. soot).

Also >70% HClO4 and >90% HNO3 will likely work, but those are harder to obtain.

And really don't mess around with any of those solutions!

Upsilon - 15-9-2015 at 11:24

I'm not sure how well sandblasting would work. It's not really paint; it's some sort of plastic-like ink stuff. Even when I took sandpaper to it, it was doing more damage to the glass than to the label.

Also this is just for my home hobby "lab" (it's not even a lab, I store my stuff in a large locked cabinet on the pool deck of my house, and I do all of my experiments on the pool deck as well). Nobody in my family would ever end up drinking some of it by mistake somehow.

I tried 98% sulfuric acid and it just didn't work. I think I'm just going to tape over the labels and call it good.

Detonationology - 15-9-2015 at 12:43

Could one use amber bottles to store 30% H2O2? How do you plan to seal the bottles? Even the metal screw caps leak, and would probably rust/disintegrate over time. You might be able to find some PTFE stoppers that would fit.

Zephyr - 15-9-2015 at 12:49

Try dissolving in an alkyl nitrite. Works well on all the labels I've tried it on. Also works great to clean whiteboards.

zed - 15-9-2015 at 13:35

Silk screened paper, glued to glass? Use heat. A heat gun will do it. Just heat it and scrape of off the glue. Paint on glass....same solution. Some kind of vitreous enamel on glass? Quit now and find a better source for bottles.

[Edited on 15-9-2015 by zed]

aga - 15-9-2015 at 14:03

Duh.

I was being far too normal-minded earlier.

Obvious : chuck all the bottles into a pile of wood and set the whole thing on fire.

Wait until the fire dies down, and the whole thing cools to ambient.

The labels will be gone.

MeshPL - 17-9-2015 at 09:52

I know that wood combustion is an actual chemical reaction :o, but... well puting bottles into wood fire may result in soot and/or tar like residue, that is hard to remove. :P

Detonationology - 17-9-2015 at 10:04

Quote: Originally posted by MeshPL  
I know that wood combustion is an actual chemical reaction :o, but... well puting bottles into wood fire may result in soot and/or tar like residue, that is hard to remove. :P

The thermal shock might break/degrade the glass... which would not be good for a container intended for storing strong acids.

ave369 - 17-9-2015 at 10:36

I think I know a recipe, but it may seem dangerous. I've seen a Youtube video where a ink-like print was removed from a coffee mug with dilute HF. Of course, this was an opaque coffee mug, so cloudiness from etching wasn't an issue.

violet sin - 17-9-2015 at 12:15

when I was screen printing shirts for a few years, we used CCl4 or similar drycleaning solution to remove unwanted spots from shirts. like if it got flipped over on itself while loading into the drying conveyor belt. put shirt over a vacuum machine hose, turn on, load the spray gun jar with fluid and spray. it dissolved part of it in order to release from the fabric. vacuum stretched out the shirt knit and pulled bits through. the really well cured colors like black,.. hard little guys to get out. more reflective colors didn't cure 100% from the IR(infrared) source, and was easier to release.

sounds like a mess to get the labels off. that would be a lot of expensive solvent to release quite hardened pigment. in fact, I *think* bottles use more of an enamel, like we did for bumper-stickers. ohhh the lightheaded days of printing 1000's of stickers... my uncle called it *HOT* solvents to clean a screen that was getting gummed up. cause the stuff would eat all kinds of things up. this was years ago, not sure what he uses now, but I am almost positive CA doesn't sell the stuff that I worked with back then. because it actually worked, super volatile, and had a LOT of fun stuff in it. vent fan was your friend

careysub - 17-9-2015 at 12:22

Quote: Originally posted by Detonationology  
Quote: Originally posted by MeshPL  
I know that wood combustion is an actual chemical reaction :o, but... well puting bottles into wood fire may result in soot and/or tar like residue, that is hard to remove. :P

The thermal shock might break/degrade the glass... which would not be good for a container intended for storing strong acids.


If is any sort of combustible material (thus an organic label) would not warm drain cleaner sulfuric acid remove it? Doesn't that char nearly any organic?

ave369 - 18-9-2015 at 14:13

Quote: Originally posted by careysub  


If is any sort of combustible material (thus an organic label) would not warm drain cleaner sulfuric acid remove it? Doesn't that char nearly any organic?


It only chars organic from which it can draw water, such as sugar.

jsc - 14-11-2015 at 18:05

Try methyl chloride. Do it outdoors.

Hawkguy - 14-11-2015 at 18:33

Would this work on Avalon milk bottles? They are awesome, but it'd also be great to remove the labels.

macckone - 15-11-2015 at 06:10

Piranha solution will remove most organics. The problem with screen printing on glass is that it may be inorganic and actually fused to the glass. You can order bottles a lot cheaper than the piranha solution. Teflon lined caps is the real expense.

WGTR - 15-11-2015 at 07:11

Concentrated ammonia (~30%) strips the enamelled labels from my pipets within seconds.

[Edited on 11-15-2015 by WGTR]

MolecularWorld - 15-11-2015 at 09:15

I use steel wool for painted-on labels. Unlike sandpaper, it doesn't scratch the glass:

steel wool bottle.jpg - 108kB

Glued-on paper labels are another matter. For one or two bottles, they can simply be scraped off, but I've got dozens of small bottles, each with a glued-on label. My limited research suggests boiling sodium carbonate solution should dissolve the glue, but I'd love to know what others here have tried.

Morgan - 15-11-2015 at 09:21

I've used acetone for the glued on labels.

MolecularWorld - 15-11-2015 at 16:10

Quote: Originally posted by Morgan  
I've used acetone for the glued on labels.

Thanks. Several hours soaking in acetone had no effect on my stickers/labels. However, this gave me the idea to try a similar product, and, despite being mostly acetone, it worked where the plain acetone failed.

Texium - 15-11-2015 at 16:54

Quote: Originally posted by MolecularWorld  
Quote: Originally posted by Morgan  
I've used acetone for the glued on labels.

Thanks. Several hours soaking in acetone had no effect on my stickers/labels. However, this gave me the idea to try a similar product, and, despite being mostly acetone, it worked where the plain acetone failed.
Probably since it has the ethylbenzene and xylene in it. Those aromatics are really good at eating up most common plastics and resins.

jsc - 16-11-2015 at 12:23

Quote: Originally posted by MolecularWorld  
Quote: Originally posted by Morgan  
I've used acetone for the glued on labels.

Thanks. Several hours soaking in acetone had no effect on my stickers/labels. However, this gave me the idea to try a similar product, and, despite being mostly acetone, it worked where the plain acetone failed.


Xylene is powerful shit.